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Hope you are all well and enjoying your modular. This is my current set up and I need some suggestions on what would be good candidates for 1U modules for my Intellijel case which would add more functionality to my system. I have 3 slots left on the Intellijel case and plan to buy the 1u dual vca modules for definite. Other than that I am open to other options. I don't think I need a big mixer as I find that I prefer tracking everything to Ableton. I don't plan on gigging with my set up. I just enjoy making music and so using the dsp from my UAD Apollo twin and satellite, helps with processing the sound to achieve less muddy mixes and side chain to my kick drum which I can save and hopefully release one day.

I really can't help that much here - the noise tools module always struck me as useful, as does the attenuator and the vcas - anmd midi an i/o if you want that sort of thing (I guess you do as you bought cases that have it (semi-) built in

Oh and maybe some tips for people starting out and head scratching about how all this stuff works. I send clock from a digitakt via midi into the hermod and then distribute clock all over the system from the gate 8 output. Its rock solid.

good

I invested in a small erm midi clock which also takes care of any clock jitter from Ableton, which ensures that if I use internal software based vst's, these also play in time with the hardware set up. It works really well but I remember at the start, I remember thinking that I had wasted money on my hardware set up as I couldn't get anything to play in time with each other. Don't let this get you down as it's all part of your learning process. When you come from just the software world all this side is taken care of for you and you don't have to think about it :)

erm yes... I guess

The other thing I would say is that there are some brilliant contributors to this forum, Lugia, Jim, Garfield modular, farkas and others. I often go back to old threads and read their very detailed replies and this really helped investigate and research some of the modules they suggest which if you watch YouTube you will miss, as reviewers will only tend to review what's sometimes referred to as the 'sexy' modules in this forum.

thank you!

Ok , back to my post, over the last few months I have really been impressed with Steevio's music and want to incorporate more of his ideas into my system. I particularly like how he takes odd length patterns and hives triggers off to other voices. In fact, I love the rhythms he is able to generate and they way he seamlessly transitions to song after song without stuff going all over the place. How does he do that? I am hoping that I can replicate some of this idea with my varigate + and precision adder, which I bought specifically for this purpose.

have you seen his rig run down on youtube - I would watch it repeatedly and take copious notes - then try to figure out wtf the notes mean - from what I can remember there's a lot of logic involved

one thing to note is that Steevio's rack is almost all if not all doepfer - buy a switched multiple now - abuse it as a gate/trigger combiner, just like Steevio 'it's not broken 'out yet'

Are there other things that I need to incorporate his tricks into my set up. I have watched some of mylarmelodies take on this and also Omri Cohen's video ( although as much as I adore Omri), he sometimes replicates modules to develop his patches which due to cost I am unable to do.

having started in modular a bit before the rise of the influencers, hopefully the fall will be soon, not that I don't think that they do a good job - they do - just explain why you are using the beauty case - it's shitty to start - and they are always swapping modules in and out of larger cases - I saw one of them admit it once

Also I have just placed modules in my racks so they fit (top 2 rows are Intellijel 84hp), bottom row is nifty case (84hp) and the other case is a 241hp custom built wheedy whizz cab.

@Lugia, not sure if you have the time available, but would love one of your reconfigs for a more efficient patching workflow, if you have time??? :)

nothing wrong with that approach - group functionally go from left to right in terms of signal path, modulation below voices and control below that - or something similar - whatever works for you is best - but won't necessarily be best for me or Lugia or anyone else for that matter

Also, I know it seems like I have amassed a lot, and indeed I have but 90% of my modules are second hand and I have really waited a long time to buy at lower prices - for instance I bought my two Doepfer VCA's for £35 each, the Wheedy whizz cab with about 6 modules (braids, korgasmatron ver1, jp8 filter and a few more) for around £750. I recently picked up the excellent ACL delay for £158 and this unit would be over £350 brand new. It's the old brand AQA but sounds wicked and was in perfect condition. There are many bargains to be had for people particularly looking to exit from their eurorack addiction , find that the patching workflow isn't really to their liking or simply just collected the modules at new prices without spending time learning how to use them, for instance I still see online people using plaits and they have the pitch all the way to the left so that they can get the tone in a lower octave, which could very easily be sorted out if they read the manual or read a forum post where people explained how to use the buttons at the top of the unit :)

Hahahaha - really no one cares - it's your money to do with as you please - good that you got a few 'bargains' though!

There's nothing wrong with using the frequency knob of plaits like that - but I agree RTFM, RTFM, RTFM and forums

EDITED Jun 26th 2021, 16:15

I have no thoughts about the livestock maze at all

in a small form factor the mix04 would tick all my boxes - but needs envelopes etc not sure about the maze

the thumbnail and the rack don't match

as is often the case - not enough utility modules - submixers, things for modifying cv etc - the erica sequenctial switch is massive - do you really need an 8 channel sequential switch in a case this size? I wouldn't - I'd be pushed to use 8 channels in my 1500hp case - I'd rather have a second 4 channel one

redundancy is not really an issue in modular - and it really depends how you patch, how many voices you have etc

I'd ditch the cells and chips modules - not heard good things about them at all

EDITED Jun 26th 2021, 15:52

@jb61264 - if you right click on the rack in this thread you can open the link as another tab and then get infomatics and click through to read what every module does (how do you think we manage to give rack advice - there are over 7k eurorack modules!!)

but in broad strokes (the rack seems to me to be)

the top 2 rows are mostly vcos, modulation and effects (plus grids - which is a trigger sequencer)

the middle row is more utilities and effects = plus vc-t-networks which is 4 percussion voices (or you can use it as filters) and a basic vco

bottom row is mostly things that you'd want in easiest reach - control modules, favourite filter, voice etc

why? can't you send it to a vca to shorten the envelope?

you've learnt well @Cangore!!!

blades and beads are kind of difficult at the moment - I don't think the next batches are due until next year - so maybe go for something else to start with - you can't go far wrong with a happy nerding fx aid xl - plaits doesn't need a filter - there is one built in

but I would suggest some (used) doepfer filters - there is a huge selection and they are relatively inexpensive

as is a black face maths - only in the B&G shared system iirc

there's nothing wrong with the old veils - I have 3 - but if I was buying today I would buy the newer one - 2 less hp

I too dislike the rackbrutes - they do seem a little expensive, I don't like the aesthetics, and worst of all they waste hp with the rack wart - but you do have the only reasonable excuse for getting one - a minibrute 2(s)

the links and kinks tips are correct

I would also add something like shades - or the happy nerding mia - you need attenuation/attenuversion and offsets a lot

personally I'd also want a matrix mixer of some sort - predominantly for mixing modulation sources

how are you intending to final mix/record the output of this and the minibrute?

what sort of music are you intending to make?

you may well want to add a second sequencer - to enable you to transpose the sequence - for separate sections and/or chord/key changes - for this you would also need a precision adder - shades and links both include these

so what's missing??

imo definitely utilities

a nice matrix mixer perhaps? maybe keep it small - rebel technology mix04?

kinks and shades would also add a lot

that will fill your 20hp - use them primarily for processing modulation

Hmmm...it occurs to me that you could also arrive at a "matrix-ish" result with a Frap 321 in place of the Shades. The fit's the same, too. Not a "true" matrix, sure, but it's in the general ballpark.
-- Lugia

isn't it just 3 utility mixers that feed 3 3-way passive mults (that can chain) ? so nothing like a matrix mixer

Hi everyone

I'm planning to finally get into modular. What i want to build is a generative system but i also want to be able to control the synth via a DAW if needed.

generative music which changes over time randomly? I would look at marbles and bloom - probably marbles is better as a starter 'generative sequencer'

My thoughts:

VCOs:
I'm pretty sure i want to go with Plaits to be flexible and the Behringer 112 VCO because i love the sound and it gives me 2 Oscillators.

Plaits is a decent starter vco - I'd look around a bit more for an analog osc though - there are many many out there (mostly more expensive than the behriinger, but definitelly worth checking out - especially as the behringer is so big

Filters:
Behringer 121 seems like a good choice for me.

Modulators:
I put Maths in because from what I understand it's good to have in a generative setting.

Maths is great in any setting - google the 'maths illustrated supplement' and work your way through it a good few times - it will help your understanding of modular immensely

The Behringer 140 seems like a good choice because it gives me 2 envelopes and an LFO.

if you say so - again there are many more interesting options - given that maths is a cycling envelope generator (ie an lfo) then this may be superfluous, at least to start with - especially with...

I'm pretty sure I need some sort of Clock generator and Clock Modulator. Is Pamelas New Workout a good choice here?

Pam's is great - screen is meh - but really useful for providing all sorts of clock functions and modulation options - unipolar oonly though

Sequencer:
I'm a bit torn between Melodicer and MakeNoise Rene. Am I right that i can do a lot of similar things with the two? Do I need a Sequencer?

No you don't need a sequencer - but you do need a way to play - pick one or more of - midi, sequencer - and there are lots of different types of sequencer, dc-coupled audio interface to send cv to/from rack/daw (es9 for example), complex modulation sources lots of utilities and a quantizer, or a vc/gate keyboard (which may be the only time you really need an adsr envelope)

I'd go for either midi (keep the module small 8hp?) /es8 and some kind of turing machine based sequencer, such as Marbles, which is kind of a triple turing machine with built in quantization

Effects:
PicoDSP seems like a good choice because it doesn't use a lot of space.

fx aid is similar, but you can choose the algorithms - I personally like the xl due to better ergonomics and more modulation points

Beads (not sure i should count this as an effect) seems very interesting for pads.

unless you already own beads it's unlikely that you will find one before next year, due to mi production schedule and global parts shortages

Utilities:
What do I need here? I've added some multiples and the pico Quant and some logic gates but i'm very unsure if that is sufficient or even needed...
-- cryforhelp

if you use midi/dc coupled interface from daw or most sequencers , a quantizer in this size case is pointless (both sources will probably be quantized already)

a good utility starter set is links, kinks, shades and veils - or other modules that cover the same ground - this will give you a taste of a lot of things and be incredibly useful - btw kinks is discontinued - so buy one quick whilst stocks last -- and they may last you a long time - most of these were in my first batch of modules and still get used constantly after 4 years and 1500hp

I would dump the behringer quad vca - it is too big and doesn't have enough channels - get veils or the intellijel quad instead - both of which can also be used as external input modules (due to them being actual amplifiers instead of voltage controlled attenuators)

a good rule of thumb that seems to scale well from a single voice to many voices is:

sound sources < sound modifiers < modulation sources < utilities

buy some stackcables for passive multing

go slowly - buy the minimum you think you need

sound source, sound modifier, modulation source, some utilities, a way to pay and a way to listen - btw, how are you planning on mixing and listening to this???

there's a decent sell/trade thread on modwiggler.com too

kinks is discontinued - I'd pick one up if you can find one - the other functions are very useful

maybe look at 2hp for a kick and snare - maybe even a hats - do check for depth though - 2hp can be quite deep and the nifty case does not seem that deep

nice, enjoy!

I've playing around with Rings and the sound i am looking for when i think at "strings" is the one which Ring does while it's in easter eggs mode.
Any other modules which sound close to this? maybe Chord? Or the 4ms ensamble oscillators?

Thanks in advance
Ciao
-- abstractrhythms

then the obvious answer is rings!

but rat king is not https it is http and as such unsecure - bad practice for a web shop - I would not buy anything from their site due to this

if it is just the favicon - it's not a big security risk - just a bit sloppy

well I was just commenting on the url in Lugia's post

when I open the page I do get a warning on Firefox about parts of the page being insecure - the images

best practice these days is to have everything protected by ssl including all internal calls in multi-tier applications

http:// NOT htttps:// = no security

Rings is a great option - I came from a guitar background too and really like it for those sorts of tones - plucky is pretty easy to dial in and the red or orange/red mode (not available in vcv rack iirc) on polyphony gives a nice stereo ish spread - alternating notes left and right

using other sound sources as input works really well too - drones etc are available

I very rarely send mine through a filter or vca though - mostly just through a delay - mostly clouds or magneto or disting and then at the moment I'm sending everything through an fx aid xl on the lo-fi algorithm

so you may find you don't need one - or maybe you do, but stereo - blades perhaps or qpas

if you are enjoying vcv rack something like an es8 or es9 can be a great link between the vcv rack and the modular

yes

output of one module into input of other module - repeat

also google 'maths illustrated manual' and work your way through it

personally in a starter case I would rather have Marbles than Pams - I have Pams and whilst I use it a lot - I'm not a big fan of programinig it - the screen is small and at the moment it is not in an ideal position in the rack to see the screen - marbles on the other hand has a lot of knobs so is much more interactive

I really wouldn't bother with twiggs either - Pams or Marbles can do this and there is not so much in the case that you will need or want a branches-alike module let alone 2 - I have one and a DIY one in the back log - but I have about 1500hp of modules - I use the branches I have mostly for hats - as it is easy to get nice skip/open/closed ratios by self patching the top section to the bottom section

I would also consider swapping out the micro clone of plaits for a real one - there is plenty of space and ergonomics are very important - micro modules = poor ergonomics - it's possible you've never actually seen an eurorack modules in reall life yet - a lot of people in this situation get a shock with how small modules actually are - it'll cost a few extra $/€/£ but not many - and mutable support is fantastic - I had a button fail on Marbles - back to Emilie to fix - sent last Thursday - should have it back this Friday!

how are you intending to sync the modular to external gear with Pams? - there are a couple of midi expanders which may work - I use an audio pulse in the DAW (the one i use is from make noise web site) and send that through an expert sleepers es8 when I need sync and use that as clock in to Pams - in computer OSes audio is much higher priority than midi - so timing is tighter - using a midi clock via a BeatStep Pro was sloppy/out of time

as a next module - if you can find one buy kinks - it is a really useful inexpensive utility module - it's been recently discontinued - but there is still stock in some shops

otherwise I would buy plaits and then veils - plaits has a built in lpg (which is a combination vca/low pas filter) - so to a certain extent you won't need either a fillter or vca for the audio path to start with - the vcas will be useful for modulation purposes (modulate your modulation)

pitch output from both marbles and pams is quantized - the 2hp tune modules are superfluous

marbles contains something like a mini branches - I use both but I have a lot more - you don't need this in this size case

in this size case I would remove the mixer and one of either pams or marbles and add a quad cascading vca such as veils

I also agree with both Lugia and CM487 - in that the case is too small for more than a single voiice - and probably better used as a control skiff for a larger case

EDITED Jun 22nd 2021, 09:12

the first thing I would do is take the es9 and move it to the 3u - this will reduce your power consumption in the 6u by a considerable amount

don't forget that a lot of utility modules are passive - mixers, attenuators, mults, switches etc etc all of which are very useful in a modular synthesizer

as are blind panels - and they stop you dropping cables on to busboards etc!

the rule of thumb that gets used for this is always leave 25-30% headroom on all rails - this is to allow for inaccuracies in the stated draw and to allow for inrush issues (where modules take much more power than stated whilst starting up - usually digital modules)

I would advise against trying to get that much power out of that power supply

a couple of things to point out here:

plaits is dual mono not stereo - it has 2 outputs, but they are variations not stereo

warps is also not stereo - possibly it is in some modes - it has 2 inputs (carrier and modulator) and 2 outputs (the 'normal' output and a vca'd aux output which appears to be a mix of the input and the output) - again that doesn't make it stereo - just 2 output channels - and I'm not sure how modulating one output of plaits with the other will work in practice - if I had warps i would try

so maybe a better signal path would be both plaits -> veils -> warps -> qpas (for filtering and stereoisation) -> beads (insert more vcas as appropriate)

I'd probably skip the NoiseRainbow2 - kinks has 'noise' and marbles has a random output (Y) - probably enough in this size case

I'd probably also remove the quadrax and expander - I think that Pams and Maths should be enough modulation sources for this size case - but I would want more mixing capabilities - probably a matrix mixer, specifically for mixing modulation sources together - choice is limited by space though! and/or another quad cascading vca (take the dual out and replace?)

veils, qpas and maths would be my next modules for this and in that order

but kinks has been dicontinued - so if you can get one now get it

@witgezicht - I just had a quick glance through the manual - I couldn't find anything - I would contact korg support and ask them how to save the midi channel data - everything in there about saving appears to be linked to projects - as far as I can see in 5 mins - it is possible that you have to save a project and then reload it on power up to get the midi channels correct - so maybe you need to use 1 project as a template with your midi settings saved in it

My idea got a bit out of hand by including two more rows but I plan to buy it in two periods of time. I hope this revision is better as I took the whole day off to get this together. I still got two weeks till I will start the build IRL. So until then I hope this machine can grow.

Kind regards,

Glenn
-- LNITB

Not out of hand - it's given you an idea of your actual case size and power requirements

Personally I would go a lot slower than this - buy the right case and just a minimum viable synth - 1 voice (sound source, modulation source, sound modifier and whatever support modules you need for that - how to play, how to listen etc)

actually touching modules can change plans quite a lot too - especially once you first start patching

so I would then get used to that for at least a few weeks before adding anything else - and add slowly - make notes of things that you want to do but can't - ask questions etc - this will influence you as you acquire modules

Hi Vincent

I think you are trying to do too much in too small a space

too many voices - I generally think 1 per row is enough - 1 1/2 at a push - you have 2 1/2 per row

this is because you won't have the space for the modulation and utility modules that are needed to support them - unless of course you aspire to perform like you are on crack - see frenetic modular influencers and 'artists' who constantly touch and micro adjust knobs - this is what modulation and utilities are for people

saying that I think you have enough modulation - maybe too much - but no way of doing interesting things with them - combining, multing, modifying them - not enough utilities - I don't think 6 vcas is enough for 4 sound sources, even if some have built in ones & where are the submixers? and how are you doing final stage mixing? mix up? not enough channels so you can listen to all the sound sources at once!!!

NB regarding vcas - they are useful for so much more than opening and closing audio - they can also be patched as compressors, crossfaders, auto-panners and are fantastic for control voltage

rainmaker is a huge delay - and a lot of people seem to buy it and then not get on with it

midi/sequencer/pams - all have built in quantization - the scales is redundant - especially in this size case

I would keep only 2 of midi/sequencer/pams - I would drop either midi or sequencer and if I kept the midi I would go with a midi interface that can support hte number of voices in the rack - I count 5!

I'd probably also go for a better melodic sequencer - especially if you want to dial things in easily

NB changing 'chord' and keeping disparately sequenced melodies in key - ie changing a major to a minor or vice versa is quite difficult in modular - there is a brilliant solution - sinfonion, but it is large and expensive and only really of benefit once you have a polyphonic voice and at least 3 others

a good ratio to start thinking about when planning a modular is:

sound sources < sound modifiers < modulation sources < utilities

and start with modules you want - add what is needed to support all these modules and leave 30% free for expansion (add 10mA/hp/rail for power to be on the safe side) and then find the right case for you

these last 2 statements will save you money (eventually) - maybe not to start with in that you will end up with a bigger, probably more expensive case - but in the long run as you will not end up buying/builidng cases as a hobby

EDITED Jun 15th 2021, 13:42

I have a tex-mix setup - theres a tiny bit of bleed at higher volumes

not sure about with DOUTS - I have 2 3hp ones to build but that won't be for a few months yet

great advice there, as usual, @Lugia

I had a quick skim through Lugia's reply too

almost everything he says is spot on - almost always in my opinion

better to start without a planned case and work out the modules you want and the modules you need to support them + 20-30% free for expansion - rather than starting with a specific case

sounds sources < sound modifiers < modulation sources < utilities

due to the < 's needing spaces around them

EDITED Jun 15th 2021, 08:37

I agree with Lugia - also note standard size for rack cases is 19" which gives 84hp a row - not about 100hp - so unless it's a special order you may be disappointed - or you are confusing us (me) with thon rack case and purpose built 104hp thon eurorack case

also had a quick look at ASEC - music was ok, but I hate that frentic constantly micro moving knobs and touching the modular for no purpose performance style - the only module he really appeared to be paying any attention to was the erica bassline - by that I mean he twiddled those knobs for at least 2 seconds continuously at one point - he seemed to spend much more time interacting with the elektron boxes than with the modular

also I'm not convinced the DFAM is that good for "riffy hypnotic leads" - I think you would probably be better off with something else for this and for "hypnotic" I usually think of modulated reverbs and delays

Hi Glenn

have you bought these modules or are you still thinking about it?

you seem to have a lot of sound sources (morphagene, dpo, panharmonium, SWN), a few sound modifiers (panharmonium, morphagene, wasp, ripples), a sequencer and almost no support modules - including (but not limited to) modulation sources, vcas and mixing

how are you going to mix these sound sources - you have an output module? but no way of mixing to stereo (3 out of 4 your sound modifiers are mono) and no way of mixing waveforms from the dpo (other than 'final' I guess) - the only mono sound source - or combining say the outputs from swn before sending the signal to a filter

there are no delays or reverbs - really useful especially if you want to do what you have stated - you can't go wrong with an fx aid xl

not enough modulation - Stages is a great module - but it is enough on it's own for that number of modulation inputs and it is not necessarily a great first modulation source, especially for you, yes it can provide 6 envelope, but they are very short and patching it to do something else quickly eats up channels

perhaps you should look at zadar - you can get very long and varied modulation envelopes out of it

I copied the rack so I could make sure it was an swn hiding and found a load of modules hiding out of the rack - the cat was unhappy to see me! - the only module that I would recommend that you add to this rack is Maths - it's a particularly great module - especially as there is the maths illustrated supplement which documents 32 self patching ideas - and as such is a brilliant primer for modular synthesis in general - even if you don't buy the module - read the supplement!

VCAs - the vca appears to be an afterthought - VCAs are fundamentally important modules - they control the amount of a signal going through the module and they allow you to do this with a control voltage - so you don't have to do it with your hand - when patched with appropriate (and essential) modules (an lfo, a mult and a polariser/offset) you can turn 2 vcas into an auto panner, use a cascading vca - you can also use them to change the level of control voltages going to modulation sources

I would dump the pico one and replace it with something like veils (a quad cascading vca) which will also work as an input module if needed as well as a mixer

I always strongly recommend a starter set of utilities - links, kinks, shades - or similar modules (kinks has been discontinued recently - buy one if you can find one!) and a quad cascading vca (as mentioned above)

I also often recommend following this ratio to get more out of your modular for less cash:

sound sources

In the end - modular sequencing/utilities is really where eurorack starts to shine in my opinion
-- SCALEBRAIN

absolutely sequencing, modulation and how you combine, modify (via utilities) and use these to control the synth are often more important and interesting than which modules you are using to create the sounds and/or modify them

see further edits, above, but that one will have a short delay time due to the number of stages

EDITED Jun 14th 2021, 13:50

which BBD? doepfer make a variety iirc...

I would set up the simplest possible patch

a vco into a vca into mixer - check that this makes sound (make sure that the volume is up etc)

then patch bbd in between the output of the vca and the mixer

make sure volume is up on correct channel and then play a single note with the vco - ideally very very short - as minimum delay time is 10ms - so make sure you have a noticeable delay time dialled in

make sure level on delay is not 0 - keep increasing this until you can hear the delay or have run out of travel in the knob

make sure that mix is past 12 o'clock - increase this if the previous step

another thing to do is to check the board components for signs of damage - burnt bits, bad smell, sticky residue - post pics (hi-res)

one other thing to note with doepfer modules - I have one that had the power cable on the wrong way (and not one that was just pull it out and switch it as it is connected to multiple boards) which would have been fine with unshrouded headers (which doepfer at least used to use) - but as I had shrouded ones I had to cut the key off the header to get it to fit - make sure that the red-stripe is correctly situated on both ends of the power cable

EDITED Jun 14th 2021, 13:49

case - imo poor choice for a starter case - as are all 'beauty cases'

good examples of starter cases are doepfer lc9 or tiptop mantis

why? because they are the best value for money cases out there and have been proven over years of service - they are not so small that they will be filled immediately and they are not so big that they cannot be moved, reasonably easily

beauty cases are great as extensions to larger cases - control skiff, sequencer skiff etc - but most experienced modular synthesists will point you towards a bigger case (at least to start with) so that you can find the modules that you want and the modules that you need to support them and leave space to expand (preferably 20-30%)

saying that you should not have any compatibility issues with modules that are not too deep (check this - especially the doepfer modules - 45mm and 50mm), power looks ok - are there enough power headers? (you can get flying extensions from intellijel if not)

in terms of power you should always leave at least 25-30% headroom (to account for inaccuracies and onrush needs) on all rails - otherwise you will get unexpected results - anything from lights flashing weirdly and then switching off to burning out power supply and/or module components

quite frankly the odessa/hel combination on it's own is too big for this size case - as are to a large extent multiple voices - it's difficult to fit 2 vcos and the support modules for them in such a small case not counting the size of odessa/hel

how are you intending to play this synth? iirc to take full advantage of the polyphony of odessa you really want 4 v/oct signals just for that one module - but no sequencing or midi-> cv converter in the case - iirc there is part of one included in the case, b ut yoou still need to buy a module to use it and iirc it only has 2 sets of v/oct gate outputs - so can only play 2 notes at once

you almost definitely will want way more in the way of vcas - 2 vcas is not really enough for a single mono voice of a vco and filter - especially once you start using vcas for more interesting purposes - modulating modulation and controlling volume not just note shape, compression, cross-fading and auto panning (to name a few uses for them) - with essential supporting modules such as polarizers and offsets which you have neither of

I would advise you to start again with a bigger case and work out what modules you want and what you actually need to support them and get that verified by people here as a workable synth - this will probably work out less expensive in the long run

when you do this it is a good idea to also specify what sort of music you want to make and what your budget is (not only the starter budget, but ongoing monthly/yearly)

and I speak from experience I started with a 72hp 6u case - I ran out of space within 6 months and case number 2 had to be bought, roughly 5 years on from that I have 6 cases with a total of roughly 1500hp - looking back if I'd bought case 2 first I may never have gone past it's 208hp (a mantis)

es6 adds 6 inputs

es7 adds outputs

thanks sacguy71 - yeah that would have been my next bit of advice too - but only once a second voice is in and it is needed

EDITED Jun 12th 2021, 12:37

@JimHowell1970 - thanks for all your replies, really appreciate your helping me along with my confusion on all this :)

If I get the ES-8...thats all I need in order to us CV Tools in Ableton Live to send/receive CV? Is it doing that via the USB?

correct

Then for recording stuff coming from my modular/Hydrasynth, I could use the combination of the ciao and a-520 to route audio to my Focusrite?...do i have all of that right?

yes if you can get both interfaces to work simultaneously - do a search on asio4all and working with multiple audio interfaces - I'm not an expert - especially as I use a Mac - where aggregate devices work quite well

If I substitue the Ciao! with the Intellijel Audio Interface II, would that allow me to route audio into the modular setup from my Hydrasynth for any processing and then back out to my Focusrite?

yes potentially - there are many other ways to do this though - personally I'd start with veils and some attenuators

According to their website all Focusrite ¼ inch (6.35mm) jack inputs and outputs are mono balanced.
-- jb61264

In which case a balanced output module sounds like a good idea - most probably aren't balanced - Happy Nerding do a reasonably priced unbalanced to balanced converter module called the isolator - if you find you need it

EDITED Jun 11th 2021, 20:13

things that are usually good to pair with semis will probably work perfectly

so modulation and utilities are good starting points

Maths, zadar, pams, batumi etc etc etc (they'll mostly be in the categories envelope generator, lfo or function generator)

I'd also usually recommend a utility starter set of links, kinks, shades (or similar functions in different modules) and a quad cascading vca, such as veils (veils specifically because it's more versatile than most, 10hp and reasonably inexpensive) NB kinks is discontinued so if you can find one buy it

after that I'd start thinking about adding an extra voice of some kind - probably a vco, filter and an end of chain mixer, unless you've already got that covered externally

EDITED Jun 11th 2021, 19:46

the P6 is much more expensive because of the case fittings (tolex, handle, corner bumpers etc) - and it's a lot more convenient than an lc6 and a flightcase - plus it's less storage space for the lid of the case than for a flightcase

as the 8i6 is not DC-couplped then yes you would need something else to use CVTools

USA= unbalanced power - if the 8i6 has balanced inputs (check manual) then the general consensus is to use balanced outputs too - should = better recordings with less noise

re ciao and a-520 would be the i/o modules

@jb61264 so you have a mac or windows computer

if you are using a mac you can set up an aggregate device in macOS and then use that as the i/o for your DAW

if you are using a PC there is something called ASIO (I think) that may do similar,, but I'm sure I've heard it's not as good as the Mac

NB botht he ES8 and ES9 can be used as audio interfaces as well as for cv/gate/modulation

with both the ES8 and ES9 you can go direct into and out of them at modular levels - so there is no need for an output module

if you live in a country with balanced power you may want an output module to go to the 8i6 and an input module to raise the volume to modular levels (something like veils will do the job perfectly well - check maximum gain of exact module before buying)

although an attenuator may also do the job perfectly well if needed as an output module

my general advice is to start with nothing, if you get clipping try an attenuator in front - they are inexpensive and useful - if you still find it too noisy try an output module - but unless your outputs are balanced and your inputs are balanced then I'm not convinced it will make any difference

there's a contact details on this page

https://www.modulargrid.net/e/pages/imprint

I think the Korg FS 2600s are unobtanium

really a 9u case is not that big 3u is about 13,5cm

make sure you get a case with decent handles and a lid and you will be good to go (doepfer briefcase stye for example) - unless you are expecting the modular to be portable by small children

hands on is good justification for anything and I understand about pam's being kind of the opposite

you may be better off with a module full of a/b (or a/off/b) switches - I have a few with 6 (diy from pusherman but they do do built for these too) - for what you describe above

if you want to play with ratcheting send a multiplied trigger from pams to a vca and open and close it with a heavily divided gate from pams with a shortish high state - so it doesn't happen that often - obviously you can mess with this more inside pams - combine using the vca as a trigger combiner (it's dc-coupled and cascading, isn't it?) - you could also use the switched multiple for this... - for me that would probably be enough - apart from ducking hats for example: send the inverse of the gate signal to a vca using it to turn on/off the hats - either the triggers or the audio depending on what you want to send it (and maybe how many channels you use for your hats!)

google - "maths illustrated supplement" - 32 self-patching ideas - from bouncing ball to drone and back

extension cables are available

redundancy is often a good thing in modular - but in a small case like this with big modules...

I think the qcd and expander is way too big for this size case - especially as pam's can do 80%, if not more of what they can do - same with the euclidean circles - Pams does euclidean too

and to some extent the same goes for compare2 - in this size case I would concentrate all my trigger/gate generation from Pam's, which has built in logic functions - not as exhaustive as compare2 - but for me that would be a next case module

I would focus more on modulation:
maybe something like maths - it's a fantastic learning tool - especially when combined with the maths illustrated supplement - available online

and utilities:
you can never have enough vcas - use them for everything - modulating modulation, note shaping and volume are only 3 basic uses - want a sidechain compressor - patch it up with a vca, want an auto-panner or a crossfader - vcas...

switches - are they going to do exactly what you want??? exactly as you want it - I have a feeling they won't - some AB switches probably would though - the switched multiple is a great module - especially when you abuse it as a gate/trigger combiner - not advised by many - see Steevio and MylarMelodies though as they both use this technique - as according to Mylar - Steevio once said to him - "I've been doing it for years and not broken anything yet!"

sub mixers - it's really useful to have a few modules scattered around that can create submixes - especially if one is featured like shades - where you also get attenuversion and a precision adder thrown in

if y0u can find kinks buy it - it is a great small and inexpensive utility module that has been discontinued recently

power - I hope you have the turbo boost wall wart and not the regular one - the modules in your rack draw too much power for the regular psu and you are at very nearly 1A on the +ve rail

you should leave at least 20-30% headroom to accommodate for inrush draw on top of what modulargrid says and I add 10mA per hp to each rail for every hp that is not filled to allow for expansion

yes it's 2hp smaller - and it keeps you mostly mutable.. for what that is worth

btw - if you can find one grab kinks - it's a really useful little module and it's recently been discontinued