Hi,
I have had two private messages, but no corresponding notification in my email inbox!
Is everything working as it should be?
Kind regards :)
That 961 has nothing to do with V/Oct. Its purpose is converting different kinds of triggers. It can be useful with an MS-20/K-2, but for V/Oct to Hz/V conversion you'll need a different module. The G-Storm KVP does both. You already went for a Neutron, so no need for that, but I thought I'd mention it.
@Ligia - wonderful!! :-)
I came across a post listing the cost per HP of various cases which was very interesting.
You're absolutely right. I wouldn't consider housing such a module in a rack (until I get one which fills wall!), mainly because of the loss of HP. I hadn't worked out the REAL cost which is even more frightening :-)
I'm still trying to decide on a case...
I've just ordered a Neutron! Phew! One decision down, 999 to go :-)
Yes, 961 typo (now fixed). Apparently they are now available: https://www.thomann.de/gb/behringer_961_interface.htm
I really wanted an MS-20 back in the day, hence interest, but will likely give it a miss. Patching all this stuff together it going to be tough enough as it is :-)
OK...attenuator/inverter/mixers are backbone stuff. There is a Shades in your build, but this only provides three channels of CV/mod manipulation. Better choices would be Happy Nerding's 3X MIA, Antumbra's ATN8, Frap's 321, Low-Gain's CVP1, Tiptop's MISO, etc. The key here is functional density...you have to cram as much as possible into as tight as space as you can where utilities and other "no-tweak" modules are concerned. This then frees up more space for the modules that require more "playing surface are", like VCFs, etc.
Mod sources...the Quadrax is quite good as far as complex function generator/envelope generators go. But while Tides is a great LFO-type source, you're better here if you find a smaller form-factor 3rd party version of it. Again, you need to cram function into tight space here. Better still: Tesseract has a dual Tides that fits into only four more hp than Mutable's original. Keep an eye out for things like this. And don't count Maths out; there are REASONS why that module sees so much use! Tony came up with a true classic there.
Keep the Sloths, also. If you're doing anything ambient, generative, etc...self-regulating systems, basically...having low-speed randomness is a must. However, it could be augmented with comparators, logic, and so on...things that can pick off specific voltage states, combine these with clock pulses, and develop entirely new behaviors as the system runs. I strongly suggest looking into both categories I've mentioned here, as they open up new control possibilities for your modulation sources to work with.
Now, VCAs...the red-headed stepchilds of Eurorack, seems like...there are technically two: linear and DC-coupled, and exponential and AC-coupled. The latter is purely for audio, because these manipulate signals in ways that our hearing recognizes as "changes in apparent loudness", plus they BLOCK DC...which is really effin' critical if you have an amp that's DC-coupled, because if you send enough DC to that amp by accident (like passing a DC offset to your output...oops!), you won't have speakers if you keep it on long enough at a high enough level! The ARP 2600 was infamous for this. But the linear VCAs are key to manipulating CV and especially modulation signals. Since they can pass DC, they can be used for audio (preferably if you can send them exponential envelopes) OR subaudio signals down to DC. This means that if you want...oh, say, a rising amount of vibrato on a single VCO after a hard-attack audio envelope opens...well, you can do that. Just trigger the EG for the audio VCA and another one for the linear modulation VCA, set the first with a hard attack and a medium tail, and the second with a slow attack and medium tail, and there you are! One key press does it all.
I've repeatedly said that YOU CANNOT HAVE ENOUGH VCAS. I ain't kidding! They have ridiculous amounts of uses, particularly if you're talking about VCAs such as in the MI Veils or Intellijel's Quad VCA, because those not only pass DC, you can tailor their response curves. And that opens up a whole other pile of interesting possibilities. But here again, cram these as tightly as you can! And make sure you also get mixer capabilities, because mixing/adding CV and mod signals...yup, more fun potential. MY big choice for a dedicated linear VCA bank, btw, is the Erogenous Tones VC8...8 VCAs in one, with two breakable/linkable mixer paths. But for variables, Intellijel seems to have that down. Also...when you get a chance, try using an audio signal as a CV for a linear VCA while feeding another audio signal through it. Like I said, ridiculous amounts of uses...
Now, downright missing stuff...first up, look into waveshapers. These allow you to do loads of timbral manipulation before you even get your oscillator signals to the VCF, and make for a cheap way to get a more complex sound. In a similar vein, suboctave dividers are a super easy and effective way to create doubling...particularly into sub-wrecking subbass frequencies. This one point was/is why the Roland SH-101 punches as hard as it does with just a single VCO. And another key thing: ring modulators. Hell, I have "raw" ringmods permanently patched into my routing bays here and feed 'em with sine generators so that I can "whang up" any signal I damn well please! They're a big key to getting strange, alien, metallic sounds, but you can also use them as tremolo circuits (with an LFO as "modulator") to vary amplitude...just like a VCA, kindasorta.
Now, stuff that's just downright wrong...for one example, let's start with that Roland/Malekko mixer there. Since this is a smaller build, you should consider using mixer level VCAs to control your final signal amplitudes...but the Roland 531 only has CV over panning. You could use those as level VCAs (kind of) but then you'd have to run the mixer in mono, which defeats the purpose of having a stereo performance mixer. Plus, if you're properly submixing within your patches, you probably won't need six input channels at your output stage in this small a build. But if you step up four more hp, then you find the Toppobrillo Stereomix2...which gives you CV over level, panning, AUX send, plus you get channel muting and an FX send/return path. And this at only $80 more than the Roland. True, you lose two channels and your 1/4" outputs, but what you gain here is immense. Plus, if you want a balanced output AND a second stereo AUX return, you can pair this with a Happy Nerding OUT...so you get transformer balancing, metering, your headphone amp, and...yep...that second parallel stereo input.
Which brings up a point: sometimes the solution to a single issue is NOT a single module. In fact, much of the strength to be found in modular synthesis in general is in module complementarity; sure, you could add a second VCO for timbral variation...but you could ALSO add a waveshaper along with it, and then you've got tons of that timbral variation with just 12 more hp (or less...) used. As you remove and replace the above, try and focus on what combinations of modules do. Then how do those combinations work together as subsystems? And so on...as this is the key difference between a pile of electronic crap in a box and a real INSTRUMENT that you can work and live with for potentially decades. This is why I'm saying "go back, strip out the junk, redo"...because no one wants to drop several grand on something that you'll have to keep dropping several grand on. Instead, proceed slowly, carefully, and after studying the hows and whys of this stuff, proceed precisely so that you can hit a result that needs nothing but which provides everything. And MG's no video game...you don't have to get this right inside a time limit or hit a specific score. You have the room and the tools here...but TAKE THE TIME, because that's the one thing you bring to this process. And there's no substitute for properly using that resource when you're dealing with building an instrument that should be on-hand for decades.
I'd suggest starting here:
That's 10 modules... that's a ton to learn out of the gates, but still very powerful. Then after a few months, you'll start to understand what you really need to add next (if anything at all). But Luigi's point is important: do your homework on how synthesis functions first. If you're brand-new to synths, I'd strongly suggest picking up one of the various semi-modular monosynths as a starting point (O-Coast, Mother 32, Neutron, Crave, etc. etc.). Great way to get your feet wet, and get used to patching... and they'll still be relevant once you go for an actual modular system.
Way too much "sexy" going on here. You're missing a large amount of the boring stuff that serves to make all of that expensive, snazzy crap do what it should. Yes, there's definitely a lack of modulation sources, but without more VCAs, attenuators, mixers, and other stuff that has sleepy panel graphics and a lack of blinkenlichts und twistenknobs, you've got a MUCH bigger issue building here than simply dropping a few more EGs in will fix.
Starting with the above, and prior to adding anything, remove as much as you possibly can (and be brutal!) while maintaining the sort of base functionality you're aiming for. My bet is that about half of what's there will go away in this process. Then, go back in and double only certain modules when that doubling will contribute to the sound of a single patch. Doubling VCOs for detuning, for example. Next, if the idea here is to have a second voice-path, add that back in...but again, be as simplistic as you can, just like the above.
At this point, there should be a lot more open space. Now...start chucking in the "boring" stuff. The result won't look as dazzly as the above...but it will work far better than where your above build is heading.
But before doing ANY of that...go and check some tutorials on how synthesis methods work. Seriously...because you have 4 oscillators (but not...exactly), you don't have to have 3 VCFs. You'll get a LOT more punch out of taking all four and mixing them, then feeding that through ONE filter. This is one example; there are others present here, and one of the worst ideas I can think of is plunging into a $10k swimming pool without reading the manual to find out how to put the water in first. And modular synthesis can easily become that...OR WORSE.
-- Lugia
thanks Lugia for your reply.
can I ask you if you could provide me with some specific module that you will add (I'm thinking about what you said, " VCAs, attenuators, mixers, and other stuff that has sleepy panel...") so I'll look them out and study more.
About modulation, what do u think about Tides (2018) and Quadrax?
I didn't notice the 1u VCA, somehow... I thought it was the left half of the midi unit. But yes, that would take care of that need.
If you're going to be sequencing by midi, then the swap you're describing could be great... but of course, those are two very different modules. If you need sequencing, you need sequencing, not Woggling.
-- Shakespeare
Yes, I sequence by MIDI and I also have an SQ1. What I was doing was sequencing with MIDI and then using the MD to send CV sequence to different parameters. But it honestly has not been a great fit for me. I find that just sending the sequences from Ableton gets the pattern and pitch that I want, plus I can do so many styles of sequences with it. So the rest of the rack is basically modulation. Thats why I started looking at woggle more. I feel like it could be a good fit for the BIA as well. On that note, this sloth module looks so cool too. I am definitely going to get one of these.
Way too much "sexy" going on here. You're missing a large amount of the boring stuff that serves to make all of that expensive, snazzy crap do what it should. Yes, there's definitely a lack of modulation sources, but without more VCAs, attenuators, mixers, and other stuff that has sleepy panel graphics and a lack of blinkenlichts und twistenknobs, you've got a MUCH bigger issue building here than simply dropping a few more EGs in will fix.
Starting with the above, and prior to adding anything, remove as much as you possibly can (and be brutal!) while maintaining the sort of base functionality you're aiming for. My bet is that about half of what's there will go away in this process. Then, go back in and double only certain modules when that doubling will contribute to the sound of a single patch. Doubling VCOs for detuning, for example. Next, if the idea here is to have a second voice-path, add that back in...but again, be as simplistic as you can, just like the above.
At this point, there should be a lot more open space. Now...start chucking in the "boring" stuff. The result won't look as dazzly as the above...but it will work far better than where your above build is heading.
But before doing ANY of that...go and check some tutorials on how synthesis methods work. Seriously...because you have 4 oscillators (but not...exactly), you don't have to have 3 VCFs. You'll get a LOT more punch out of taking all four and mixing them, then feeding that through ONE filter. This is one example; there are others present here, and one of the worst ideas I can think of is plunging into a $10k swimming pool without reading the manual to find out how to put the water in first. And modular synthesis can easily become that...OR WORSE.
One point about these presumably "Eurorack" synths: they already have cabs and power. So, if you remove them from those and put them in a larger Eurorack case, you then have to factor the cost of how much of that larger case is being taken up by the device into the actual price of the K2, Model D, etc. And this can get spendy; let's take an example from the Tiptop Mantis here...
The Mantis retails for $335 (using US pricing here, same principle applies in any currency) and has 208 hp of space. This means that each hp has a cost of approximately $1.61.
Now, the Behringer Neutron requires 80 hp if you opt to put it into a larger Eurorack case. 80 x $1.61 = about $128.85. The "base" cost of the unit is $289.99 (looking at Sweetwater right now), so the total for a Euroracked Neutron actually comes in at $418.84. Also, you lose 80 hp of cab space for modules that don't have power or housing by doing this, which means that if you want that 80 hp of space after all, you'll have to spring for another Mantis. Now we're looking at $753.84, and this is starting to get ridiculous.
So, recabbing an already-cabbed synth like a Neutron, Mother32, etc is actually a big fiscal mistake. Don't do it! If you go with this "patchable" route (not a bad idea, really), this is a surefire way of overrunning your costs.
Hehe really good fun - simple idea nicely done :))
Thanks for sharing!
I didn't notice the 1u VCA, somehow... I thought it was the left half of the midi unit. But yes, that would take care of that need.
If you're going to be sequencing by midi, then the swap you're describing could be great... but of course, those are two very different modules. If you need sequencing, you need sequencing, not Woggling.
Your top two rows have all the fun toys, but there's way too much redundancy. Few systems really need three granular sampling modules, for instance... especially at this size. Or so many filters. (Etc. etc.)
Your bottom row looks pretty solid... good sequencing, VCAs, function generation, and a mixer. I'd toss the MI Shades in that row as well, since it's a crucial utility module. If you took that row, and added any four modules from your first two rows (two sound sources and two effect/granular/filter modules), you'll have enough to keep you busy and learning for a very, very long time.
The only big recommendation I have for something to add is Pamela's New Workout... it's right up there with Sloths as the best value in Eurorack, and it will fill in some modulation gaps for you as well. Depending on your feelings about using HP on things like mults (instead of stackable cables, for instance), you may also want to add one or two of those (I love Links for this, since it gives you several utilities in a small package).
-- Shakespeare
thanks for you reply.
About the granular, I've decided to drop off (for now eheh) the Abhar, since with Morphagene and Clouds i'm well covered in that field.
I choose Falistri over Maths, to provide more movement in my rack and I've choose those three filters (quite particular in my point of view), 'cause with 4 osc. I thought that three filter, at least, will be a good idea.
I'll look out for the MI Links, thank you.
And you where suggesting to put another MI Shades. Do you have some alternatives to suggest me?
I was thinking also to add a Tides or Quadrax.
thanks again
Hi Mebitek,
Nice usage of percussions! Also quite amazing kind of guitar sound you got there, how did you made that one, is that done with the Loquelic Iteritas module?
I like your explaination above here how you made the voices and what modules you used, nice information :-)
I look forward in hearing more from you and kind regards, Garfield.
-- GarfieldModular
I think that the guitar sound you speak about is the DPO final ouput voice. The Loquelic iteritas is creating the main voice (this kind of main melody) and when I switch the algorithm it creates some nice variation. thanks for your feedback
Electronic music/video producer and composer.
Dark Ambient Cinematic atmospheres from Sardinia.
Hey, DonghyukHeo, love your videos very much!
Could you make a video or at least describe here in more detail the process of how you split midi files into various osc?
Please, it would be very interesting!
Wishing you all the best and waiting for new tracks!
-- yalivec
Hi, yalivec.
I'll make a tutorial about it soon.
Hi Garfield Modular,
Thanks for taking the time to write out your thoughts on the rack! As far as space is concerned, I am actually using a large 19" studio rack I had laying around from a much older project. If I put more rails in, it will easily fit two additional 3U rows and and a 1U row, and if I end up going really big I have another 8U studio rack I could put rails in, but of course with the price to fill all that I could almost buy a house instead. Jokes aside I do have plenty of room to grow for the time being so I am not too worried about how much space each module takes up, although those points are still valid since I neglected to mention the extra room I have in the original post.
Because of the enormous price of a full system (especially one with polyphonic capabilities) I am trying to assemble this rack in phases and this is more of my acquire slowly over the next several months plan. Although I am familiar with standard hardwired synthesizers and the terms associated with them, I figure this will also give me the opportunity to experience and learn each module and patching more slowly.
You mentioned looking into filters, a mixer, and an audio in/out. Do you have any recommendations on specific modules I might want to look at? I was originally going to put a 1U row in with the Intelljel 1U I/O module but after learning about the two separate 1u formats I have decided to wait and learn more of whats available in each before I commit to one or the other.
Thanks again for the input and the welcoming into the community, I am very excited to see where modular takes me!
I'm finally finishing up my rack (for now), and I've decided to add a nice subtractive voice to round it out. I tossed around the idea of adding a Moog Grandmother or Matriarch, but decided to keep it in the rack. I'm going to go with two AJH Minimod VCOs for sure. I'm usually pretty decisive, but I really can't choose between the Minimod VCF and the Gemini 2412 filter. There are pros and cons to each, and they both sound incredible with different character. I'm not necessarily trying to build a fully faithful Minimoog sound, just a really great sounding subtractive voice.
I am a little stuck. Any tips or user experience with AJH out there?
Thanks in advance.
-- farkas
The question is weather you prefer State Variable Filters or Ladder filters. I'd go for the ladder filter but that's just my preference.
Thanks! I had no idea about that 1u. I will absolutely look at that. Sounds amazing.
What do you think about pulling the MD and getting something like Woggle instead?
I have the 1u dual vca up top for vcas so far. I mainly use them for gates. Probably me not knowing enough yet.
Probably should have mentioned that my current filter situation is a Ripples, the FSS Gristleizer filter, and an Optomix. Sorry for the oversight. :)
I'm finally finishing up my rack (for now), and I've decided to add a nice subtractive voice to round it out. I tossed around the idea of adding a Moog Grandmother or Matriarch, but decided to keep it in the rack. I'm going to go with two AJH Minimod VCOs for sure. I'm usually pretty decisive, but I really can't choose between the Minimod VCF and the Gemini 2412 filter. There are pros and cons to each, and they both sound incredible with different character. I'm not necessarily trying to build a fully faithful Minimoog sound, just a really great sounding subtractive voice.
I am a little stuck. Any tips or user experience with AJH out there?
Thanks in advance.
Your top two rows have all the fun toys, but there's way too much redundancy. Few systems really need three granular sampling modules, for instance... especially at this size. Or so many filters. (Etc. etc.)
Your bottom row looks pretty solid... good sequencing, VCAs, function generation, and a mixer. I'd toss the MI Shades in that row as well, since it's a crucial utility module. If you took that row, and added any four modules from your first two rows (two sound sources and two effect/granular/filter modules), you'll have enough to keep you busy and learning for a very, very long time.
The only big recommendation I have for something to add is Pamela's New Workout... it's right up there with Sloths as the best value in Eurorack, and it will fill in some modulation gaps for you as well. Depending on your feelings about using HP on things like mults (instead of stackable cables, for instance), you may also want to add one or two of those (I love Links for this, since it gives you several utilities in a small package).
Bought a Lifeforms Micro Sequence from @TechForze
Straight forward transaction, fast dispatch :)
I wonder if you really need both an LPG and a MMF in a system like this... gives you options of course, but I'd be tempted to pick one or the other. That said, the closest thing you have to a VCA is the Sinc Bucina... so I'd suggest cutting a filter and adding in a 4hp VCA of some sort, then using the last 2 hp for whatever cool thing you can think of that will fit (including the Meng Qi dual LPG, if you absolutely must have one).
Last thought: Nonlinearcircuits makes a 1u version of Sloth that would be a great fit in your 1u section, if you can stand losing the USB port. Excellent random/chaotic modulation for MG. Of course, you could also add Intellijel's 1u dual VCA in this slot. But Sloths is always worth the hp...
Bought a Batumi module from @notwaving
Straight forward transaction, fast dispatch :)
Hi Ian,
I would recommend the Neutron then to start with and take it from there. You don't need a Eurorack to get started with a Neutron. Once and if you are happy with it, then you can consider a Eurorack.
Regarding the K-2, since it's a clone of an MS-20, it wouldn't be a clone any more if you would make it 1V/octave compatible, right? ;-) But other than that it is Eurorack compatible, just unscrew the screws, remove the front-plate module, remove the attached cables and you can put it in your Eurorack case.
To be precise it's the 961 module of Behringer, not the 061 (might be a typo I guess) :-)
I just recently acquire the Model D too, it's nice no doubt, however compared to the Neutron, I would recommend to go for the Neutron instead of the Model D.
Yes, it's terrible all these decisions ;-) Why we all can not just win in the lottery, so at least we have one worry less? ;-)
Kind regards, Garfield.
For review reports of Eurorack modules, please refer to https://garfieldmodular.net/ for PDF formatted downloads
Ah... :-(
Not heard of the 961. the K-2's designed for Eurorack so why not make it externally compatible? Hey ho...
Any idea on price? It might negate Behringer's price advantage.
I was planning on getting the Neutron and K-2 as rack starters. Now it looks like the Model D or Pro 1. The K-2 seems to have better patching options, though
Decisions,. decisions...
Hi Mebitek,
Nice usage of percussions! Also quite amazing kind of guitar sound you got there, how did you made that one, is that done with the Loquelic Iteritas module?
I like your explaination above here how you made the voices and what modules you used, nice information :-)
I look forward in hearing more from you and kind regards, Garfield.
For review reports of Eurorack modules, please refer to https://garfieldmodular.net/ for PDF formatted downloads
Hi Ian,
And that brings us back to the Doepfer low-cost casings, they are the cheapest among all but yet have quality you need, deep enough, enough power and you can start small and put yet another one on top of (or next to) the existing one in case you need to extend it ;-)
Or if you don't like the look of a low-cost Doepfer, did you had already a look into the Intellijel 7U 104 HP case? That one is a bit more expensive but looks definitely better than a low-cost Doepfer. Or consider a non-low-cost Doepfer, those look nice but I feel they are a bit too expensive.
Kind regards, Garfield.
For review reports of Eurorack modules, please refer to https://garfieldmodular.net/ for PDF formatted downloads
Hi Ian,
As far as I know the K-2 is not compatible with the 1v/octave Eurorack default (the K-2 is a clone of the Korg MS-20), so you might need a converter. Luckily for us that Behringer plans just a module like that for Eurorack, the "961 - Interface" module, not available yet though. So this 961 together with K-2 should do the trick.
Kind regards, Garfield.
For review reports of Eurorack modules, please refer to https://garfieldmodular.net/ for PDF formatted downloads
Well, I'm thinking 9U is too big so I thought I was right on with that one :-)
Sorry. not totally understanding what you're saying about RackBrute. It does seem to have an over-large PSU but surely it's only units next to it which might have depth probs. not units in the rest of the rack?
The Pitts looks great but is totally out of the ballpark :-(
I'm just trying to pull together the confusing amount of info about cases - except get bigger than you think you'll need :-) - to find something that looks ok, does the job and still leaves me with enough £££ to buy some modules :-)
Bought a Module from @Subjected
Fast communication. Fast Shipping and the Module is in Perfect Condition.
Video Unavailable
-- farkas
thanks so much. now it's ok
Electronic music/video producer and composer.
Dark Ambient Cinematic atmospheres from Sardinia.
Interesting solution...but I wonder if it wouldn't have been a more direct solution to employ Silent Way/Volta/etc and a cheap, used multichannel audio interface (I use a MOTU 828 mkii for this...sort of obsolete, audio-wise, but great as a DC-coupled CV/gate/trig bidirectional interface) to just send clock pulses to one of the BSPs, then daisy-chain that one's 'clock out' to the second's 'clock in'? It seems more straightforward in practice, actually, plus it allows me to do trickery like using my Seeburg Select-a-rhythm as a master clock, with the intermediary of VERY tight bandpass filtering and a Truetone Time Bandit, sending the resulting pulses from that device to one of the 828's inputs. It's not 100% sample-accurate like the USAMO solution...but I've found over the years that when things become TOO precise, you're probably heading for the aural equivalent of the Uncanny Valley. The human hearing apparatus actually likes a little bit of "slop", as it makes things sound more like what we expect from live musicians.
-- Lugia
Well it depends on the type of music you are making and how. The Motu is DC-coupled which is a huge plus. If you for example record the base live, drums and bass all in one run or even your Eurorack live performances in one take, you may feel you don't need the rest in perfect time and if you have a workaround the discrepancies in the timing, you may even rely very little on sync all together, even more reason to consider weather you really need a different solution, I guess.
I am a drummer and I like to track the drums last or at least late in the recording process. So to do that I need totally accurate performance from the system, it's hard enough to play in perfect time with a computer, and if the system is acting up you just can't deal with that.
Careful with the Rackbrutes if depth is critical, though. The maximum depth that Arturia lists is a "best-case"...the actual limitation over the power bus is more along the lines of 45mm.
Also, consider that you're not likely to be swapping out a case along the lines of that Structure (it's also not the only one in the line, as well). You won't exceed the power supply limits unless you chuck a pile of Metasonix modules into it, for one thing. It has the form factor you want, also.
When building a system, it's VERY advisable to work with a case that's "larger than you think is necessary"...because, invariably, it's NEVER larger than you think is necessary. And getting stuck with a smaller cab becomes a big pain when you outgrow it, because then you have to go with yet another case to gradually populate...but while that's happening, you've got a second big clunky (and spendy) box taking up space, for the most part. Starting at some point that seems too big, ultimately, results in a pretty comfy system to build and work with.
Anyone got a K-2?
I may have wires crossed but seem to recall that the original Kors use a different system to the 1v/octave and could only be used with a Eurorack via a converter.
Is the K-2 the same or is it directly compatible with 1v/Oct Eurorack?
Ian
Awesome!
But will have to wait till my first album goes platinum I think :-)
It's getting the balance right between cost and quality :-(
At the moment, just starting out, I'm heavily driven by cost.
I'm in the UK and there's a 6U RackBrute on offer at a good price, cheaper than a Mantis but neither have the nice raked layout of 3xMoogs
Interesting solution...but I wonder if it wouldn't have been a more direct solution to employ Silent Way/Volta/etc and a cheap, used multichannel audio interface (I use a MOTU 828 mkii for this...sort of obsolete, audio-wise, but great as a DC-coupled CV/gate/trig bidirectional interface) to just send clock pulses to one of the BSPs, then daisy-chain that one's 'clock out' to the second's 'clock in'? It seems more straightforward in practice, actually, plus it allows me to do trickery like using my Seeburg Select-a-rhythm as a master clock, with the intermediary of VERY tight bandpass filtering and a Truetone Time Bandit, sending the resulting pulses from that device to one of the 828's inputs. It's not 100% sample-accurate like the USAMO solution...but I've found over the years that when things become TOO precise, you're probably heading for the aural equivalent of the Uncanny Valley. The human hearing apparatus actually likes a little bit of "slop", as it makes things sound more like what we expect from live musicians.
I did not find the solution online but since I have it running really well, I feel I should share the method.
I bought my Beatstep pro a few months ago and I really liked it, however when it came time to run it in sync with Protools the latency was totally impossible, I then got a 2nd BSP and I had a situation on my hands. Just to make it clear, this is not a Beatstep problem, it is a midi over usb problem. There are many discussions about this on many platforms so I will not dwell on the matters of latency per say. I simply want to present a solution that allows me to have 2 beatsteps and Protools work in sample accurate sync using USAMO from Expert Sleepers.
First to sync two beatsteps (pro) without a DAW, no other gear needed.
1) take a clock output from the 1st one (using the dongle), set it to "int" & "cc".
2) Now connect the clock from BSP 1 to the clock input on BSP 2.
3) Set BSP 2 to "clock" & "cc"
You are set.
Now slaving them to Protools
1) Connect USAMO via midi cable to the midi input of Beatstep 1.
2) Start Protools with the usb cable going from the splitter provided with Beatstep to your PC. (Ignore midi/HUI error message on startup)
3) Change the setting on BSP 1 to "usb" & "MCU/HUI"
Protools settings
1) Install the USAMO plugin.
2) Create an instrument track and name it USAMO. Add the Usamo plugin to the track. Connect a jack cable from your audio interface to the usamo box. Select the same audio interface channel as output on the instrument track.
3) Go to setup/midi input devices and make sure both your audio interface and BSP is selected.
4) Go to setup/peripherals and set "MTC reader port" to your audio interface, mine is a Focusrite 18/20.
5) Stay in Peripherals and go to "Machine control". Select "Midi machine control master" and set it to your audio interface.
6) Go to "midi controllers" and select HUI, set "receive from" to your audio interface and "send to" to the USAMO track you created.
7) On the USAMO track, open the USAMO plugin and start the "Clock".
This is it, USAMO costs 100 EU and it works, it has taken me 2 weeks to work this out, It may very well be that some of the midi pros have this down already without a 2nd thought, however this post is for the ones that are struggling with this like I have for the past two weeks.
Feel free to point out to me if some of those settings are considered bad practice or simply not necessary, however I have tested this setup for the past couple of days after receiving some suggestions from Arturia which worked but only up to a point. I think it's a good thing to have this here in the MG database for people to look up.
More on this fantastic box: https://www.expert-sleepers.co.uk/usamo.html
I am a producer and I need Eurorack to be in perfect sync with my DAW, now I have rock solid sync that loads up every time and just works.
Good things to ponder about and cool things to look at to keep the mind wandering. Thank you again Lugia!
GOOD ONYA for putting an HPF in your lineup right off the bat! These are so ridiculously neglected that it ceases to be funny. Fact is, though, if you want a lead sound that'll rip the top of your skull off, having a resonant HPF is Choice #1 toward getting that result. Plus you need it for dub filter sweeps, as a cursory listen to any number of King Tubby's dub mixes shows.
Why not this: https://pittsburghmodular.com/structure-344 ?
It's not 3 x 104...you lose 18 hp per row, but you wind up with MORE module space than a 3 x 104 in the end, plus built-in power (which eliminates that need to stick power access modules in with the "functional" ones) that is beyond ample. And you get a VERY useful utility tile-row in the bargain...and more than ample depth (101 mm max) to fit the most chunky modules. Not cheap, but you're getting what you pay for with one of these big wooden honkers.
Thanks Garfield!
10cm - Wow!
The problem is, you probably won't know what modules you want until you get the case and get started :-) A little chcking suggests that Doepfer make some of the deepest modules.
The Doepfer cases look utilitarian.My current preference is for a 104HP 3-tier raked system (a bit like Moog's 3-tier stand.
The research never ends :-)
[Make Noise vs Noise Engineering] Eurorack Dark Iteritas Jam
Patch notes:
- Drums: DPO osc1 (kick), Telharmonic N out (snare), Pico Drum (hit-hats)
- Sequencer: rené, variable tempo speed triggered by tempi driven by wooglebug
- Main Voice: Loquelic Iteritas modualted by Pressure Points through QPAS
- Second Voice: DPO final out through Echophon
- FX: morphagene custom reel through Antumbra SMOG
- reverb: Erb-verb
- additional modulations: Maths, Zone BF, Function, Wooglebug, micro o_C
- additional gate sequencer: arturia beatstep pro
Electronic music/video producer and composer.
Dark Ambient Cinematic atmospheres from Sardinia.
My rack (morphagene not yet purchased) :
Been pretty inspired by what's going on here in this video at the 16 minute mark. This is something I'd love to do with vocal samples.
Currently use my rack to add in FX and sounds into my tracks with the BIA. I sequence it with MIDI from ableton (and also use Ableton's effects plus other plugs like soundtoys, valhalla). and modulate with all my other modules. But I'd like to craft lead melodies out of vocal samples, mangle pads..etc.
I really love my Pams, and the clep diaz but I am pretty open to suggestions on what you all think I should add if I got a morphagene, which i feel like may be the best option for what I'd like to do.
I feel like I may need a stereo filter, but Id also like something I can send the BIA into when I am recording that. Or will my current filter be fine?
Also is the mimetic digitalis a good modulation source for the MG? I like it, but don't know if it's the best fit for what im trying to do. If I pulled that and the Sinc Bucina I'd have 16hp of space to add in something different. I see a lot of small builds that use Maths or Rampage instead so I'd love to get some opinions on if those modules would make sense. I could pull most of them to make room for Maths, but I'd still like to have a filter if possible.
Anyway, I see a good amount of smaller builds with the MG but not a lot with the MG and the BIA, so I appreciate any input.
Thanks for the reply. Sorry my rack got all messed up. There was only supposed to be one ochd. I will fix it and lock changes this time.
Hi Dongh-Yuk,
Thanks a lot for your insight information, interesting to know :-)
Well, I hope you are going to have very fast in the very near future tons of modules, so you can be able to show us a symphony, I would really appreciate that ;-)
Have fun with making music and kind regards, Garfield.
For review reports of Eurorack modules, please refer to https://garfieldmodular.net/ for PDF formatted downloads
Hi Ian,
If you go for Doepfer modules, there are some of them pretty deep, then rather look for a case that can handle up till 10 cm deep modules. Unless you decide for yourself to go for modules that are just not deep, on the other hand, why limiting yourself to only modules that are not deep?
The low cost casings of Doepfer can handle most modules and you don't have to worry too much about it.
Welcome to modular and kind regards, Garfield Modular.
For review reports of Eurorack modules, please refer to https://garfieldmodular.net/ for PDF formatted downloads
Hi LilP,
Welcome to modular and let's not spoil time and let me straight get to the points ;-)
That 4ms module, nice one for sure, but at 26 HP, that is more than 15% of your rack space, that's more than one seventh of your entire space, so seven of these kind of modules and your rack is full mate! Then we didn't talk about the finance yet, this module hits the 500 bucks marker line, yet another thing to consider: "Should I really start with a rack and with a module like that?" Up to you of course, but if I were you, I would reconsider it.
Your rack is (far) too small, if you would ask me, see my above explanation of the 15+% usage of just one module... and you should keep some space reserved for future needs.
Another large module is the Maths module, I know it's a great module, everyone can recommend it to you, including myself, but at 20 HP size (12%) you should ask yourself the question: "Do I need this module, or am I going to use it for EG functionally only in the beginning?" If you indeed only going to use it for its EG capabilities, then you might want to consider just a dual or quad EG module, much smaller, and most likely cheaper than the Maths too. Unless of course you are very sure of your Maths usage that you will full utilise it, but with a relatively small rack like this one that's going to be a serious challenge.
So, 27% gone of the space with just these two modules ;-) That's already more than a quarter of the total rack space... hence you need more rack space (even without these two modules).
And I can continue this story but I guess you get my point by now ;-) I am not saying those modules are bad, no not at all, they are good in their ways but to start with and then in such small rack, as already mentioned, you might want to reconsider some of those larger modules.
So my advice is to reduce a bit on the "fancy" (or complex) modules and start with a bit easier ones, smaller ones, basic ones and cheaper ones, that might save yourself a few surprises.
Going completely back to the basics, how familiar are you with synthesizers? Are VCOs, EGs, VCFs, VCAs, LFOs and that kind of "phrases" known to you? If not, you might want to go one step backwards and consider a Behringer Neutron for example to start with. It's a cheap semi-modular way to get started and gives you a first kind of taste to modular if you are really want to go into modular. If not, then everything fine, sell the Neutron and you haven't lost much. If yes, then you are ready for it because by then you will know it :-)
Don't get me wrong here, if you are sure about yourself and modular, then go for it I don't want you to think that modular sucks (it doesn't), but it might need a bit more investigation, checking, tons of reading and clarifying things, get to understand each of those basic modular concepts, once done that, go ahead and welcome to modular.
Before that though, be careful, read & check and plan carefully. Modular can be (extremely) expensive and if it's not your thing after all, then some serious bucks went down the drain and that would be pity beside the fact of disappointment.
By the way, regarding your rack, look into filters, a mixer and an audio (input/) output interface on top of what I already recommend to check.
Anyway, feel free to ask around and welcome to modulargrid, kind regards, Garfield Modular.
For review reports of Eurorack modules, please refer to https://garfieldmodular.net/ for PDF formatted downloads
