I use mine to either switch modulation outputs between different modulation inputs or vice versa
why do you think you need a buffered mult? how are you sequencing - I don't see a sequencer in the rack... and you already have links... you could probably do fine with a passive mult... there's no need for exact when multing modulation or audio - a tiny bit of voltage droop will be unnoticeable
-- JimHowell1970
thanks,ahh might gonna get a passive mult instead,just to have one in the case other than the links
I use mine to either switch modulation outputs between different modulation inputs or vice versa
why do you think you need a buffered mult? how are you sequencing - I don't see a sequencer in the rack... and you already have links... you could probably do fine with a passive mult... there's no need for exact when multing modulation or audio - a tiny bit of voltage droop will be unnoticeable
"some of the best base-level info to remember can be found in Jim's sigfile" @Lugia
Utility modules are the dull polish that makes the shiny modules actually shine!!!
+1 on Jim's suggestion...and actually, the idea of using piles of small skiffs as a single device has a lot of potential for trouble. For one thing, that rig immediately screams "ground loops!!!". Yeah, even with DC, as the system would really need some extra ground wiring to put everything (wallwarts included) on the same groundplane and even if your power is clean, all it takes is one little grounding issue and noise WILL creep in. Or worse, let's say you have a catastrophic power supply issue in one skiff. This could easily, depending on what's misconnected or what failed, cause problems to other skiffs and their modules if something happened that allowed high-current DC onto a patch cable.
I would suggest dropping some money on a unified setup instead of this method. Fact is, a Tiptop Mantis comes in at $335, it's had LOTS of users over time with a lot of pleased synthesists, and you can join them to make a bigger 4 x 104 hp cab. And it's WAY more portable than the piecemeal one you've got currently; Tiptop even sells a custom gigbag for the Mantis. And with that, you can put together a rig with just one that you could even put on a traytable on a plane and work while you fly. That's neither advisable or viable with the current multicase build.
Without naming any names, quite a few of the modular synth build videos are VERY suspect, especially when it comes to cramming a functional modular into a small cab like a Palette 62, etc. It IS possible, but you really have to know what you're doing before attempting that sort of build. Add the wrong module, and you got bupkiss. A better use for these small cabs is for "mission-specific" builds...such as needing a specialized filter setup for incoming signals that you want to modify in real time.
Now, what I would suggest is to get a synth that's easier to learn on. You've got a Neutron, but I don't think it's quite as clear to work with as my suggestion...which would be to drop $650 on a B.2600. Fact is, the original ARP 2600 was THE educational synth in its day. It's what I learned on, along with many, many others. Even Stevie Wonder used them, with Braille markings, because it was easier to program and play than other modular choices for the vision-impaired. Once you've got some of that experience under your belt, THEN implement that skiff build, but turn it into a support cab for the 2600 that gives you extra modulation, sound generation, etc. That's exactly what my B.2600 is set up for, since I can patch anything with 1V/8va scaling and a positive trigger/gate between it and my Digisound 80 as they both "speak" that language.
But that aside, the 2600 is pretty much goofproof. You've got some internal routings that are prepatched, so you can make racket with it right out of the box, but the patchpoints interrupt those and allow you to do oodles of alternate routings or even patching between synths (like that Neutron). As "starting points", they're still unsurpassed, even in Uli's hands.
We can refer here to the music of bagpipes (wind sounds), Ravi Shankar (string sounds), and the historical works of La Monte Young (‘Trio for Strings’) who is one of Eno's references.
-- Sweelinck
La Monte Young is one of the true masters of drone. His work spans decades, and includes work with John Cale (in Young's "Theatre of Eternal Music" ensemble) who would later bring Young's ideas into the Velvet Underground. It's also worth taking several hours to check his work "The Well-Tuned Piano", which involves a specially retuned grand piano on which Young would do a lot of sustained repetition that eventually blurs into a drone. He and his partner Marianne Zazeela (who also works on light projection design for Young's works) even lived in their "Dream House", a combination of a residence and sound installation, with the drone's basis pitch coming from an amplified fishtank pump.
Another great piano "dronemeister" would have to be Charlemagne Palestine, who's also done works for electronics and pipe organ. Palestine's "strumming" method is so hard on the instrument that broken piano strings are a fairly common occurrence at his concerts. And Mazz already mentioned the beautiful and austere works of Eliane Radigue, in which everything constantly evolves toward and away from drone textures.
Also, there's a number of "Krautrock" artists who were/are superb drone creators. In that column, I'd have to mention Klaus Schulze's initial works ("Irrlicht" and "Cyborg"), Tangerine Dream's "Zeit", early Popol Vuh ("Affenstunde" and "In den Garten Pharos") and the dark and foreboding first album by Gunter Schickert, "Samtvogel". Even Kraftwerk's first couple of albums have some heavy drone elements along with really alien soundscaping.
seems a very expensive way of housing modules to me... and probably much more likely to get noise issues than with fewer cases... you'll probably also need longer cables... and lots of sockets or power strips
most of that would fit in 2 tiptop mantis cases which would cost you substantially less and be more portable as a whole - plus only need 2 power sockets... probably need fewer long cables and only use 2 bags when needing to be taken out of the house
I have 8 cases (about 1800hp in total), 6 of which are stationary - ie always stay in the studio - if I want to go anywhere else with them - including the living room, I have 2 smaller cases: a mantis and a 6u/72hp, which I swap modules in and out of - I use befaco knurlies for screws and only ever screw 2 holes per module - it's simple to swap them (mostly takes minutes) - saying that my mantis is my main video case and I rarely swap more than a couple of modules in/out of it - I really can't see the need of anything smaller - not only on a cost/hp basis but also on a portability/use basis
I always need modulation and utility modules for even the simplest patch - I would undoubtedly always need 4 or 5 of those tiny cases - and moving that many units would be too much of a pain in the ass
for example I am currently set up in the living room - mantis has 3 audio modules in it - a small mixer, peaks and a doepfer lpg - as well as a most of my video synth - the 6u has erica black sequencer, rings, veils, tides, kinks, maths, a small clock divider (used as a sub) a couple of filters and an es8 - these and a video mixer sit on the coffee table and I can wiggle comfortably from the sofa - I have multiple voices - rings is going through both filters patched as a 'mutronics mutator' ish filter - in mono: channel 1 into channel 2 - tides is going into the lpg and the clock divider and I am using peaks for kick and snare
it's great fun and would be much better with a few extra modules - more utilities and modulation and maybe another voice and some hats - all of which are in the studio - another mantis would be perfect - and leave the 6u/72hp upstairs in the studio - but that will have to wait...
"some of the best base-level info to remember can be found in Jim's sigfile" @Lugia
Utility modules are the dull polish that makes the shiny modules actually shine!!!
Thanks for the reply - that doesn't sound too promising! I will contact my vendor next week for an update. The sequential voltage source, 245t, is already slated for winter/spring 2022!?
The 258t is in Germany to be expected/estimated to be available around mid March 2022, accordingly to the website of my nearby dealer and the 281t supposed to be mid March 2022 as well but that has been moved up to mid June 2022 :-( So looks like you are much better off in Canada ;-)
For the other modules there is no estimated date yet.
Kind regards, Garfield.
For review reports of Eurorack modules, please refer to https://garfieldmodular.net/ for PDF formatted downloads
Thanks for answering!
Noise is with res off to, and if i use no lfo its there to.
If I use only filter + mixer i can here it when i am moving cutoff.
Funny thing I got it working. If I put filter out to mixer and vca to filter in there is no more noise. (intellijel quad vca)
Now i can go full volume and all good..: ) i dont know why this works but it does..
Something similar has just happened to me - I received a negative rating out of the blue; going back through my records I found that I had actually interacted with the user 3 months ago - they had contacted me for a module I had listed, asking for photos - after I emailed the photos, they said they were no longer interested, apologizing for wasting my time. I'm confused they should rate me negatively three months later, and I believe it's not in line with how the system is intended to work (it says you should only rate a buyer or seller). I understand this is the simplest possible system and better than nothing (in almost all cases), but it would be great if there was a way to make sure it is not abused
Enjoy your spare HP, don't rush to fill every last space, this is not like filling sticker books. Resist the urge to 'complete' your rack, its never complete so just relax.
The YouTube videos can be misleading. It is possible to get wonderful sounds with a few modules. But one has to choose them carefully and connect them in particular ways. One doesn't want only one wonderful sound, but many different wonderful sounds, and that might require more than a few modules.
I don't have direct experience with any of your components. I don't think that you can do anything interesting with the VCA, the Seq, Clouds, and the mixer by themselves. They're not junk, but they wouldn't work in one of those videos, not by themselves. They can be used to enhance what the Neutron does, but only if you know how to use the Neutron. You can avoid the constant sound of the Neutron (changed only by turning the tuning knobs) by giving the oscillator some pitch information via MIDI. A keyboard would be the best learning tool for this. You can use a computer or tablet, but it is more complicated to set up.
The link below my messages is my write-up of one possible introduction to modular synthesis. It doesn't talk specifically about your devices, but the concepts are transferable. You can find sections on the Neutron that correspond to things I talk about, and see if you can duplicate the results. If it is not to your taste, there are many other such resources.
Get a Behringer Neutron and a Korg SQ 1 to play with. Don't start with Eurorack unless you have a LOT of money. Gambling money to burn for an expensive hobby. 5 K at least. Will soon be 10 and you will have a wishlist for another 10 K.
A "small" case for a certain purpose will still cost 4-5 K and you would have to exactly know what you want and why. (Which i would slowly be able to do after having tried out about 100 modules and seen what i like and what not so much, not easy to do for a beginner.)
Or Get a 1010 music Blackbox (used for 400) and a field recorder and some free sample packs.
That makes a lot of sense for ambient/movie/performance soundscapes.
You could test the ADSR by plugging in the Square Waveform from your LFO into the IN socket on your ADSR, the light should flash.
A - Set Fully left
D - Set half way
S - Set Half way
R - Set anywhere really but a Fully left will be fine
Make the LFO slow, fingers crossed the ADSR light flashes.
Enjoy your spare HP, don't rush to fill every last space, this is not like filling sticker books. Resist the urge to 'complete' your rack, its never complete so just relax.
Why don't you start with just the Neutron, which is a self-contained semi-modular, so there are default connections made for you? There are some example patches in the manual that you can try reproducing and then altering. When you understand more about the functionality of the various parts, you will be able to introduce additional modules.
You might ask your Instagram friend the reasons for their choices and what they thought you would do with them. There are many Erica Synths Pico modules; you need to specify which one you have.
Hi,
After getting into modular around a year ago I'm getting more and more confident that this is my "target" rack to be completed in the next 2-3 years. As you can see it's split into smaller building blocks designed (hopefully) to work good in various combinations. The ideas behind the individual components are:
Pod 64X (s) - fx rack (to pair e.g. with my MC-101) / standalone synth (Rings)
Pod 26 (u) - Maths (analog envelopes and all the goodness) + VCAs / crossfading / ducking
Palette 104 (s) - main synth (multi-voice: drums, basslines, pads, Mimeophon), guitar pedals (e.g. Boss RC-5 looper) send/return
Pod 60 (u) - analog "preset sequencer" + Beads as sampler / sequenced mod bus / audio mixer + Beads as reverb
Pod 32 (u) - 2 different sequencers
Pod 40X (u) - weird VCO + weird envelopes
Palette 62 (s) - drone/generative synth, modulation bank, VCV interface
Pod 26 (u) - complex oscillator + spare/mod bus mixer
(s) = standalone
(u) = utility
That said, I'll be grateful for any suggestions from more experienced artists/wigglers :)
Pedal Order:
- Friedman Buffer Bay - Buffered Input (not pictured)
- Keeley Fuzz Bender
- Peterson Strobostomp HD (used Korg Pitchblack as placeholder)
- MXR Noise Clamp (the following indented pedals are in its fx loop)
-- All Pedals Macrodose (used SubDecay Prometheus DLX as placeholder)
-- JHS Unicorn
-- ProCo Rat
-- EarthQuaker Devices Monarch
-- MXR Ten Band EQ
- Meris Hedra (mono in, stereo out)
- DOD Rubberneck (from Meris R out)
- Strymon Blue Sky (ins from Hedra & Rubberneck, stereo out)
- Strymon Deco (stereo in, outputs go to Buffer Bay)
I hope that I'm not violating any regulations here, but I haven't found anything suitable in a hurry.
So here are my questions.
I would like to start in the ambient area, where it seems to be a long way. I bought a few modules on the advice of an Instagram friend.
Here is a list.
Tip top audio power supply with a frame.
Behringer Neutron (not installed in the rack)
Doepfer VCA A130-2
Erica Synths Pico
Clouds Mutable Instruments
Behringer 305 Mixer
That's the current status.
I have no idea where to start or what I can and should patch.
I've already tried a few things, but haven't had a respectable result yet because, as I said, I don't have a basic setting or the knowledge of what module to connect to another one first, or which input and output of the respective module should use.
You have to start somehow.
For example, patching the output to this input.
Any beginning.
I sincerely hope that someone can help me.
PS.: Before the standard sentence comes, it's a years-long learning process, I know that, but there must be some basic setting so that you can lure out the first notes.
Excellent proposals from @Amenbreak (with the Monotrail Tech Talk video) and @Lugia (with the technical suggestions). For my part: E352 Cloud Terrarium, Nebulae and Morphagene are some of my favourite modular sound sources for that musical genre.
But I think that with various means (and sometimes little means) we can obtain interesting things, because it's actually and mostly a question of mindset when creating and listening.
We can refer here to the music of bagpipes (wind sounds), Ravi Shankar (string sounds), and the historical works of La Monte Young (‘Trio for Strings’) who is one of Eno's references.
Behringer Crave is a good choice under $400. Further you can check this for good options. https://www.playpianotips.com/best-synthesizer-for-beginners/
I personally use Behringer Crave and its good. But The “note” buttons are not smooth but hard-clickable... on live a bit annoying... here you are forced to hide the hard click sound that every key press produces mentally.
Otherwise, the device is quite valuable from the haptics... deck and front/back made of metal... feels good so far.
However, the technical and audiotechnical characteristics are the main reason why you buy this device from Behringer.
Okay for the price too.... but the click sounds when operating the buttons... close to the microswitch sound of old joysticks - only unfortunately with higher resistance... on sound devices like this, the sounds should only come from the device and not quasi-mechanical from operating the buttons.
Like with any other genre, listen to the artists you like and ask yourself what it is you like about their music. And try to recreate that.
I'm listening to A LOT of Éliane Radigue lately and currently exploring her sound with my BARP 2500 build. The Modamp module does pure magic to drones if fed a couple of sines and connected as intended (outputs back to the VCOs). Feed that to a chorus and you can listen to that for hours...
You can also use the Toolbox as a primitive envelope generator by patching your gate to the top input. The Time knob will control rise/fall. Can you can patch the output to the VCA CV and hear notes? If so, then it's back to the ADSR module. Is the cable connected the right way around? If so, you may need to talk to Pittsburgh Modular.
The only thing not working for me is the ADSR. The light is not on, and I am getting no changes from it or triggers. I will have to check the power cable is in, and that it is working.
-- cj18
Before busting out the M3 screwdriver, try this... Turn all of the ADSR controls to the left (ie: very short to zero envelope behavior), then feed a gate pulse into it. Then, slowly bring up the Sustain level and Release time; your Attack and Decay controls should function as VERY short parts of the modulation signal without touching them. At that point, you should see/hear some proper function from the ADSR when its output is patched to either a modulation input or a VCA although you'll have to patch up a basic audio signal and feed that to a VCA. It can make sounds, but only when being clocked by an audio oscillator to bring the activity up into the audio range (and by using short ADSR values!!!); normally, you wouldn't send an envelope gen's output to your overall mix, as the actual envelope function isn't in an audible range.
The key to interesting drones is in getting movement going inside the texture. There's a number of ways to do this...
1) Modulation. Adding a little bit of LFO to one VCO in the synth will create subtle detunings in the drone itself.
2) Effects processors. Adding delays and/or chorus to parts of the drone increases the timbral complexity and puts movement in.
3) Panning. Don't treat drones like mono sources; instead, using something to modulate the stereo field again increases complexity. Also, pan your internal sources so that you've already got some stereo field action going on.
4) Fade-ins/fade-outs. Set up parts of the drone so that parts can appear/disappear by modulating the VCOs' output via a VCA(s).
...and so on. There's loads more methods, but these are generally variations on the above four main techniques.
Very new to all of this still, so grateful for advice on what might be n00b questions...
I've only just got my first basic patch going, thanks to plragde, and I have noticed that my Pittsburgh Lifeforms ADSR doesn't seem to work. No red LED, and no effect when knobs are turned or keys pushed on my midi controller.
I am assuming that this is a bad sign...
I am comfortable that the right cables are plugged into the right jacks, so it shouldn't be that. I tried two other power ribbons, but got the same outcome.
Is there some way to test if this module is functional? I have a multimeter, but not an oscilloscope.
This module came out of 'display stock' for a store. This unit is also supposed to have reverse polarity protection, if that helps
First of all, put that Lifeforms synth back in its normal case. When you put something that's already cased and powered into a Eurorack cab, it's worth seeing what that costs. In this case, the Palette 104 costs $399, and the Lifeforms was $599 when it was around, and it takes up 48 hp. Ignoring the tile row in the Palette, this would mean that:
399/104 = $3.83 per 3U hp.
$3.83 x 48 = $183.84 This figure is how much it costs extra to house the Lifeforms, so add that to the Lifeforms' price. Ergo:
$599 + $183.84 = $782.84 This is the ACTUAL cost of the Lifeforms when in the current configuration. And even if you didn't get a case with the Lifeforms, that's still too damn expensive since the Lifeforms has a fixed control density, meaning that you're stuck with the density as specced by Pittsburgh...where if you did this in basic separate modules, you could easily reduce the panel space needed for the same module complement by quite a bit. And in a Pallete, space is at a premium! Hmmm...let's give this a shot...
(several minutes later) OK! This seems to be a lot more functional:
There's quite a few changes besides the Pittsburgh issue. A few functions were shifted into other modules, added a crossmod section for the modulation...
The top row, of course, is the Palette 104 bus module. Then the tiles were switched around quite a bit: Input on the left end, then the two modules that make up the Temps Utile...this is a multifunction thing, with several sequencers, clock outs and so on. I put in a QuadrATT, also...mainly for mixing and inverting mod sources. Next to that is a Pedal I/O, then the Stereo VCA, which can be useful for a number of things...controlling output levels, splitting as VCAs for your Pedal I/O's levels, etc. And then last is the stereo output on the right end. All of the I/Os use the onboard 1/4" jacks.
The 3U row starts with something a bit beefier than a MIDI interface. It IS that...but it has two return channels for situations where you might want the synth to serve as the main clock, etc. And it's class-compliant, so all you need is a class-compliant controller (like a Keystep, etc) and there you are. Next are four "free run" LFOs, then Maths, and then a pair of modules for screwing around with modulation behavior: a Tenderfoot triple attenuverter/mixer and an After Later dual VCA, with the VCA topology based on the Mutable Veils. After this is a Zadar + Nin for your envelopes, then we get into the audio section.
For audio, I went with a pair of Klavis Twin Waves mkii, as these are actually rather complex AND they're quantized...which means you save money and space on not needing a quantizer module while getting a serious VCO complement. These FOUR (yep!) VCOs then feed the four inputs of the Veils, which allows you to either manually control the mix, or you can apply envelopes or other modulation sources for that purpose. Polivoks VCF is next (not a bad choice for a single VCF), then a Frequency Central Stasis Leak gives you your choice of tap delay, chorus, or reverb...and since this has mono-in and stereo-out, it provides your stereo signal via the effects. And last, a Doepfer A-138s is your stereo mixer, with manual level and panning. I would've liked to put in a couple of VCAs post-FX, but if that's really necessary, you can use the VCA tile above.
This is a really open-ended build, which is a bit surprising for a one-row cab, but the tile row really takes up a lot of slack, plus your bus row also gives you buffered mults and adders for a bit more tampering with the CV. Plus you now have a proper sequencer in there that can be used like the Steppy that was there, but also as a CV sequencer, which allows you to set up sequenced ostinati over which you can solo...ala Klaus Schulze, but all in one little cab. Not too shabby, I think!
This was my first time looking at the Dreadbox modules and their manuals, and I'm a little surprised at how sparse the documentation is. They're cheap and cheerful, but, for example, what exactly does the "Pulserizer" on the Utopia do? Perhaps the videos reveal all...
Ok, I did what you said before, and it seemed to work fine today. Clearly that was operator error.
The only thing not working for me is the ADSR. The light is not on, and I am getting no changes from it or triggers. I will have to check the power cable is in, and that it is working.
Thanks for all of your assistance. You've got me past that first hurdle :)
Hey...$4k for actual rubber in the form of an actual chicken WITH VOLTAGE CONTROL should be something that everyone'll want. I'll wait until Uli puts out a knockoff for $99, tho...
The big question I have to ask here is what did you have the resonances set to? It could be a problem...but at the same time, if the resonance controls on the VCFs is set too high, it can start to make a VCF behave like a VCO, which might explain the sweep sounds. Plus, if the ferrites are doing their jobs, that would tend to eliminate external sources as the cause. Try turning the resonance all the way down on those VCFs, then feeding them the sweeping LFO. You also might try feeding the VCFs' modulation via an attenuator between the LFO and VCF, as the incoming LFO might be a little too hot for the VCFs. Just use the attenuator to back down the LFO's level...this will result in a bit less span on the sweeps, but this may also keep the sweep sounds out of the VCFs.
The Focusrite is a good interface, but I wouldn't be surprised if it can't handle high levels. I have a 2i2, but I don't use it with my modular. I have output modules, which you no longer have space for (you might have to sacrifice one of the Dreadboxes for one if the problem persists). INST mode is off, right? I would be happier without the stereo adapter. I think you need to disconnect everything, and then see what combinations of connections and power on/off result in the buzzing. Is the interface connected to anything else besides the modular? Is it plugged into the same power strip as the modular, or a different power source?
I was trying to hear the VCO without anything else, as per your first step (I hadn't gotten to the second step yet). However, even with the AI (Focusrite 4i4) gain at zero, it still came in too hot. Hence, I ran it through the mixer first, as someone suggested to me before. I stopped at that point, as the buzzing was clearly a problem, and I didn't want to push on until it was rectified.
I am connecting to the AI via a 1/8 mono cable with a stereo 1/4 adapter on the end - it has been a drama getting a 1/8 to 1/4 mono cable from my supplier. Might that be part/all of my buzzing problem? I am not used to using 1/8 mono... This is connected into the front 1/8 jack with the adjustable gain.
I will ignore the buzzing for now, and push on with what you wrote before (and not plug outputs into outputs...)
A Brunswick synth from Future Sound. Not a eurorack, a general purpose synth with some good sonic characteristics and a excellent way to get started with modular synths. A but pricey, but still a good deal.
The pulse jack on Hysteria is an output, not an input. Look at the manual. That's why I told you to use the gate to trigger the ADSR envelope, and then use that envelope to control a VCA.
In the earlier thread, you were told to turn down everything as much as possible, either using a VCA from the modular or the input gain control on your audio interface. Eurorack voltages are higher than line audio, and some devices will have trouble with it. What audio interface are you using, how are the cables connected, and how is the power supplied to everything? What happens if you unplug the switched-off modular?
Ok, I tried putting the Hysteria directly into the AI, and it went crazy and reset.
So I put the VCO into the mixer on the Eudemonia, and plugged the CV gate into the 'pulse' jack on the Hysteria. The pitch was still in the 1V/Oct jack on the Hysteria.
For the first time I heard something from pressing the keys, but there is still that buzz that is FAR louder than the notes. The notes were barely perceptible, but at least they were there!!
I'm guessing the buzz is some sort of ground loop or something? Either way, it is there even when the modular synth is switched off, but the mixer (Eudemonia) out is still connected to the AI.
I use my modular mostly for techno, just drop a kick and almost everything goes. But when I try to create drones all I get is dull and absolutely boring tracks. I just don't know how to approach droning and I realised I really don't know what makes a good drone.
So, what makes a good drone? how many VCOs do you use? how do you tune or detune them, what about filters and effects? what are your patching tips and tricks? can you share some drones, made by you or other artists, that can be used as examples/inspiration?
Hello,
Has anyone used Befaco VCMC to trigger samples and instruments in Kontakt? I have a Varigate 8 and a few modulation modules and would like to use them to trigger samples in kontakt and to trigger and modulate Kontakt instruments such as Spitfire and Sound dust. Would the VCMC be a good option?
Thank you,
Ezra
