Thank you :)

Hi Defragmenteur,

I think you helped me already a lot with your comment that without individual output for each voice, the result is ok but flat.

So if I want to do recording & mastering outside my modular system but without a computer... I need something that can handle a lot of voices or at least as many voices as I might want to use.

Thank you and kind regards, Garfield.

Hi Modular Freq,

Nice demo and drum beat :-) I like the way you explain how you get a certain sound, it's very educative as well as interesting!

Thank you very much for sharing and kind regards, Garfield.

Hi Guitarsenal,

Ha, ha, yeah just two very plain filters, but might be useful if you just want to cutoff at a certain frequency.

Did you or anyone have heard of any update regarding Behringer versus their Eurorack modules? Pretty quiet around that theme, isn't it?

Kind regards, Garfield Modular.

Hi s_____,

Have a look at the Erica Synth - Black Octasource, there you have 8 phase-shifted outputs equally spread over the 360º, thus 45º each. Is that what you are looking for?

I am having this module and I love it. This module is totally bananas and if you start modulating even your dullest modules, they become rather interesting :-)

Kind regards, Garfield Modular.

This module seems like a rare mistake for modern era Behringer. There is no voltage control for cutoff and no resonance control with voltage or otherwise. It's not a VCF, it's just an F...

EDITED Dec 13th 2019, 23:48

Exponential VCAs don't have to be entirely new VCAs. The Intellijel Quad VCAs can be tuned to respond linearly or exponentially. It's a matter of preferences. If you want your VCAs to respond exponentially to your linear signals... then sure. But it's up to you if you need them.

Your rack could use some utilities like attenuators or attenuverters. You have a quad mixer/VCA unit. That's fine. But I see at least five sound sources. You don't necessarily need more mixer channels. But it's something that I noticed. Another small mixer for mixing CV (or audio) would be great in here. It doesn't need to be special, just handle audio and be DC coupled for CV.

Do you have a noise source? Pink and white? Noise mixed at low level can add some grit and character to a sound, even if you're filtering off the high end.

I'm assuming that your sequencer and time based effects (reverb, delay, etc.) are all handled outside of the box.

will this ever become a real module?

First of all, this ModularGrid module builder is great! thank you, i wish i saw it a month ago haha.

Right now, technical people would call my style 'industrial hip hop', sort of like technoanimal i guess but better. Maybe some days more Funk than others. Anything near experimental or ambient tends to be dub reggae like King Tubby or Lee Scratch. If i feel like turning up the BPM, it's jungle-ish with maybe a Gangstarr sample. Heavy Drums, Heavy Bass, add in a catchy melody with some accents, samples, etc, that's my style since the 90s.

I own the following external devices for reference:
-NI Maschine....a bunch of Volcas.......a bunch of Pocket Operators....a Drumbrute Impact.....a Microgranny, Thyme, Kastle, 60 Knobs, and Trinity modules....an LXR Drum Machine.....miscellaneous digital rackmount effects....a Monologue......four turn tables and a microphone.....and a BEATSTEP PRO.

What i'm trying to do is expand my sound repertoire for more Industrial Hip Hop. I prefer to call it Digital Hard Hop but whatever. Any modular rack system is incorporated to my toolkit above, i'm looking for sounds the others don't offer.

Here's the modules i have already purchased(most purchased in kit form still need assembly):
RACK............108 HP ghetto rack
DRUMS.......Qty 3 Synthrotek DS-M drum modules (bassdrum, snare, hihats)
VCO.............Atari Punk Console (square wave, it was cheap)
VCO.............Rat King Modular - TONE - (triangle, saw, pulse, AS3340 chip)
VCO/LFO....Bastl Tromso (triangle, LFO, sample and hold, distortion)
ADSR...........Blue Lantern ADSR (linear and exponential, loop mode)
FUNC GEN...Joranalogue Contour 1 (env generator, LFO, VCO, everyone else has Maths)
FOLDER.......Bastl Timber(wavefolder, VCA, feedback, overdrive)
FILTER.........Bastl Cinnamon (hp,bp,lp, can be used as oscillator)
FILTER.........Synthrotek 308 Distortion
FILTER.........Synthrotek Dirt Filter (sounded cool, supposed to be effects filter, low pass)
SEQUENCER... Division 6 Business Card Sequencer (may use BEATSTEP PRO instead)

Last thing i think i need is VCAs. Was looking to buy the following:
VCA .............Doepfer A-135-2 (Quad VCA and MIXER but not exponential(!))
VCA.............Bastl SKIS II (VCA, Env generator, but also linear)

Is there FUNCTIONAL aspect of SYNTHESIS that i am MISSING here?
Do i really need exponential VCA's? If i buy the two listed above, i have 10HP left.

Any recommendations?

Thanks guys! hate to be anther NOOB haha.
TomM

Thanks for taking the time to comment. My idea was the following: not to compete with an Elektron box, I do not have one but I like them. The Nerdseq tracker interface is like an Amiga Protracker plus it can hold samples itself, The Squid Sample is in a certain way in this rack like an Akai sampler without the weight. The Array is a simple no fuss step secuencer if I dont want to go with the nerdseq. Plaits would be a synth line that is not sampled. The Mum8 as it is based on the s950, so its a must, then the mixer and pamelas for clocked modulation. It is like a portable "classic" jungle setup where you would have the tracker, the samplers, some synth for bass maybe and the filter as it is an importat sound.

It is not cheaper than an octatrack mk2, but it works in a certain way like that old setup would work, just smaller and with spaghetti cable mess on it.

What are you looking to accomplish with this? How would you set up a patch in order to get what you want? Physically, what would you connect in this rack to produce your drum and bass? From my prospective it's severely lacking. Will it produce sound? Yes. Will its functionality beat a stand alone beat box from Akai or Elektron? No. But you'll be paying A LOT more for this.

I've been looking at demos and asked for opinions on the 1U reverb but it wasn't really what I needed. I would definitely recommend to make sure it suits your needs, I would personally not consider it as a sort of end of chain module. Again, that's just based on the small demo on Youtube and forum talk so to take with a grain of salt. I myself settled for a 2hp Verb for now, limited as well but at least it sounds decent and has that long tailed reverb I need. Now looking forward to real demos of the new FX modules by TipTop Audio. The ones I often see recommended are the Erbe-Verb by Make Noise (if only I had more cash and more rack space for it lol, demos sound incredible) and the Mutable Instruments Clouds (although a lot of people seem to use it as a reverb, it's wayyy more than that, again, wish I had the space for it).
For the sampling part, I haven't really reached a point where I'm ready to do that in my rack, I use an Octatrack in conjunction with the modular so I can't really comment further on that other than repeating that I would certainly try to decide exactly what needs to be achieved before looking at any module. There are a few options that are doing very different things so make sure you watch all the videos you can about those devices and also read their manuals before deciding.
For your pitch cv offset issue, I'm no expert so definitely check that out with someone else before making any purchase but I think a precision adder could solve your tracking issue. From what I understand, it is made to solve the problem you encountered and some modules have an offset built-in which could free up the Quadratt channel you are using now.
Discussing modular sequencers is worth its own thread (probably has several already tbh) but I'll just say that there are many many options, ranging from single modules to combinations of utilities, from immediate and/or random to pre-prepared sequences, some only cv, some only gate/triggers, some both. To illustrate, I was surprised to learn that you could have a lot of flexibility by having pitch and gate information being sequenced from 2 separate modules, or how it is possible to sequence a voice using a turing machine module in combination with a quantizer because those 2 aspects of sequencing are not really present in the "groovebox" world I was used to. Most options I know of in Eurorack take up a lot of rack space (because I need them to sequence more than 1 voice) so to sequence a single track, I can't really recommend any specific option.
All this being said, what are you using your O&C for ? From what I read in the manual (I don't own one yet, my 1U O&C is in the mail), the Quantermain app has a turing machine built-in so you could use that so sequence your other voice, and it has other options for pitch sequencing as well.
I hope this at least gave you more ideas and options to research :)
This thread has a link to my rack and a track I have on Youtube: https://www.modulargrid.net/e/forum/posts/index/8260

D.

thoughts?

User men_chine is a crook!

This is a warning to alert fellow wigglers about this person.
I paid for a module last month (PP f/f) and then he/she/it disappeared. men_chine is still active on Modulargrid, updates rack layouts etc and the ad is still up for that same module.

With the Maths, you have some possibilities to modulate the envelope. However the Math only has a rise and fall... so basically attack and decay. The Neutron has four stages per envelope. So if you're looking to replicate the Neutron's envelope generators, that might be hard with The Maths module. It will sound different.

To get closer, I would try something like a TipTop Z4000NS. You get CV control over all four stages, plus the "deviator" offset. The Z4000 is a little trickier to use as the deviator and attenuator always come into play. But that's the module I'd pick. The Maths is a good pick, don't get me wrong. But I can see you having an awesome patch on the Neutron then trying to swap out EGs and not being able to replicate the Neutron's envelope with the Maths.

-- Ronin1973

The Z4000NS looks like what i would want from an ADSR env, plus its 8hp and not expensive at all. I might throw it in the rack, but keep Maths as well.

For the output module, why not looking at a mixer+out+headphones out ?
In fine, you might end up with several voices when you'll get another vco
I started with a 4ms listen four and i replaced it by a XOH (with a XPAN before to increase the XOH limited mixer capabilities and save space)
The Quad VCA before the Out will do the job in the first time but as your rack will grow out, the needs of VCAs as well
However listen to the pro, I am still a beginner
-- anglr

When I'll add another VCO i'll need a lot of other modules including more VCAs, a filter or a LPG, maybe envelope generators etc. But that won't happen very soon. I'll be looking at a dedicated mixer then and at the end of the routing i'll always just need some "modular level to line out". I'm also looking at Lifeforms Outs as a cheaper alternative to Intellijel Outs, i have no idea about the sound quality on both modules tho.

EDITED Dec 12th 2019, 12:05

This might be a weird one...

Wondering if there's a module or a way to take my single sine LFO and get the related quadrature outputs?
Is this doable? I figure I just need some sort of fixed phase shifter?

bought a Triatt from @suhovmodular, all good and quick delivery.
sold a Maths to @Cortex, no issues, good buyer.
thanks to both!

For the output module, why not looking at a mixer+out+headphones out ?
In fine, you might end up with several voices when you'll get another vco
I started with a 4ms listen four and i replaced it by a XOH (with a XPAN before to increase the XOH limited mixer capabilities and save space)
The Quad VCA before the Out will do the job in the first time but as your rack will grow out, the needs of VCAs as well
However listen to the pro, I am still a beginner
-- anglr

Finding the right combination of Outs + Headphones + the features you want can be tricky. In my search, it was "not enough channels", "too expensive", "not enough sends", "no mutes", "too big", etc. Those features are nice if you can get them on your mixer. But I wouldn't make them must-haves if you find something that works for you.

Another factor is performance. Some mixers are meant to be set-and-forget. Others were purposely designed with performance in mind. That's something to always consider when buying a module... ergonomics are important if you're going to be playing the module live. Perhaps something not towards the top of the list when you're first starting out. But, something to consider if that's a goal.

Cheers.

Excluding the Mantis that would be around 1600 euros just for the modules. Maths is the most expensive module in this rack but i figure it would provide me with a lot of useful functions for instance sometimes i would like to use it as an external envelope for the Neutron because i can't modulate the ADSR parameters in the neutron.
-- abrupt

With the Maths, you have some possibilities to modulate the envelope. However the Math only has a rise and fall... so basically attack and decay. The Neutron has four stages per envelope. So if you're looking to replicate the Neutron's envelope generators, that might be hard with The Maths module. It will sound different.

To get closer, I would try something like a TipTop Z4000NS. You get CV control over all four stages, plus the "deviator" offset. The Z4000 is a little trickier to use as the deviator and attenuator always come into play. But that's the module I'd pick. The Maths is a good pick, don't get me wrong. But I can see you having an awesome patch on the Neutron then trying to swap out EGs and not being able to replicate the Neutron's envelope with the Maths.

I'll take a deeper look tonight once I convert Euros to Dollars. I'm on the other side of the pond.

EDITED Dec 12th 2019, 00:16

Defragmenteur / All: If I don't want to record via DAW on a computer but just recording (and mastering) without a computer, what would be the best way of doing so? Any recommendations? Currently I am using (as an intermediate solution) a Zoom H5 which is okay for some basic stuff but compared to the shared track here from Exposure, I can "throw away" my H5 ;-) Regarding recording/mastering I have nil experience.

I am afraid I can't help you. Mixing inside my rack is limited. My output is an Intellijel Outs which goes to my sound card input (Focusrite scarlett 8i6) then to my DAW (Reason) for adding end of the chain FX (mostly reverb & compression) and recording. Without individual output for each voice, the result is ok but flat.

EDITED Dec 12th 2019, 13:36

For the output module, why not looking at a mixer+out+headphones out ?
In fine, you might end up with several voices when you'll get another vco
I started with a 4ms listen four and i replaced it by a XOH (with a XPAN before to increase the XOH limited mixer capabilities and save space)
The Quad VCA before the Out will do the job in the first time but as your rack will grow out, the needs of VCAs as well
However listen to the pro, I am still a beginner

Hi Defragmenteur and Exposure,

Defragmenteur: Thank you very much for sharing those links, that's very helpful! I will look for quiet moments to read those entirely.

Exposure: The feedback from Senor-bling to check out the audio input/output modular might be still worth checking though; at least for my setup I will have a closer look at that.

Another thought is the audio interface, any issues there perhaps?

Defragmenteur / All: If I don't want to record via DAW on a computer but just recording (and mastering) without a computer, what would be the best way of doing so? Any recommendations? Currently I am using (as an intermediate solution) a Zoom H5 which is okay for some basic stuff but compared to the shared track here from Exposure, I can "throw away" my H5 ;-) Regarding recording/mastering I have nil experience.

Thank you very much in advance and kind regards, Garfield.

Thanks for your insight toodee! Definitely looking into effects modules, Intellijel has a nice little 1U reverb for example which I'm eyeing. I've heard of the Mimeophon, but have not watched any videos about it, will check it out.

Saw some Morphagene videos and was very impressed by it! Still ruminating on the 4ms STS vs. Morphagene vs. Nebulae v2 battle. But leaning towards the 4ms STS has two channels which would add great flexibility in my view. I've seen a guy use it in a "DJ metaphor" set up, basically with samples of full songs and manipulating live, super interesting (check it out here: ).

Any ideas for sequencing? I really would like to sequence the Chord V2 but the Mother32 sequencer is quite finicky in this context as it outputs -5/5 v. I've been offsetting it with my quadratt but tracking is a bit wonky.

Would love to see your rig and/or some stuff you've done!

Cheers,
D

Excluding the Mantis that would be around 1600 euros just for the modules. Maths is the most expensive module in this rack but i figure it would provide me with a lot of useful functions for instance sometimes i would like to use it as an external envelope for the Neutron because i can't modulate the ADSR parameters in the neutron.

@nosp is great. Very straight forward purchase and easy to chat things through with. Thank you!

Show Raters

The User Ratings are no more anonymous. Users wanted to have more transparency who is rating them up or down.
That also might help to easier find out vote abuse.
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Thank you very much for your help. I'll take some time to really understand what direction to take with my rack.

I took the endorphins BLCK NOIR out for now and put in a 6 channel mixer. I wanted to use the LFO to add it to my MicroBrute synth. I also added a few different effects onto this one. It is a lower cost but still similar around 2k. I know it will be more expensive no matter what I just really want to get into modular and specifically modular drum machines.

(EDIT) I just made this small rack to see how it would look with the Endorphins. If this has everything I need in terms of a mixer, output, and some drums it might be a smaller and cheaper solution.

EDITED Dec 11th 2019, 04:23

just a concept for my future rack

Hi there !
I'm probably as much a noob as you are, given that I only have a few months with Eurorack.
That being said, if I was given your rack I would probably think about adding an effect module or 2, especially if you plan on using the input on that 1U module to get some external sound sources into your rack. Which one is entirely a question of choice. I'm having a lot of fun with the Make Noise Mimeophon, but it's just an example. For anything ambient, I'd say one would probably need a decent reverb, but again, that's just my very small experience making the occasional ambient patch on my system.
For working with samples, I haven't tested either of those but I've heard good things about 1010 Music's BitBox and the Morphagene by Make Noise, 2 very different takes on sampling. Again, it all depends on what you would like to go for, just throwing you a few more ideas to look at while waiting for more experienced posters.
Hope this helps anyway ;)
D.

Attenuators/Attenuverters are nice to have. Some CV inputs don't have pots built in to them so while you can plug a modulation source into them, you don't have a direct way to control the amount of CV.

The Maths module can handle attenuverting for you. Channels 2 and 3 are dedicated towards that if you take the direct output of 2 or 3 at the bottom of Maths. You can also buy dedicated modules for attenuverting such as the Befaco Attenuverter that offer more features (like offset). The Maths can replicate this function, via the "sum" output, but it's convoluted using the Maths.

I think this rack is good to go as far as exploration. I would get in some time with the rack before adding anything else. What to add next depends on the direction you want to go in.

Thanks for sharing defragmenteur, this links will be really helpful!

Ok thank you I’ll look into those modules. So other than a mixer do you feel something important or usefull is missing in my rack?

The Rene is a sequencer as far as I know. Some mixers that might work would be the Pittsburgh Modular Lifeforms, The Roland 531, Happy Nerding Pan Mix.

Hello Ronin1973 thank you for your feedback. For sequencing I also have a keystep (and a novation circuit that can be used via midi with 0coast). I would like to add a mn rené and as you suggest a second mixer. I am a noob but I have a lot of fun even if I have no exotic modules :) Thank you!

Hi all, newbie here. Here's what I have so far, I've had some good fun with it so far but would love some ideas on how to fill out the rest of my case. Leaning more towards an ambient/post-rock-ish rig but a "complete" or versatile rack would be nice.

I am also strongly considering the 4ms STS as sampling recordings, manipulating them and building off of that sounds like great fun. Any advice welcome!

Cheers

You mentioned budget. What is your entire budget for your initial build excluding the Mantis? You'll probably add more later. But what's the budget to get-going?

I'd add a second mixer like a Blue Lantern Stereo Sir-Mix-A-Lot. The A138 is a 4 input mono mixer.

Modules that have stereo outs:
Clouds
Erbe-Verb
Morphagene
Rings (not stereo but even and odd harmonics)

The Mix-A-Lot has 6 mono inputs (with pan) and two stereo returns. Your A-138 can be used for mono sub-mixing or mixing CV signals.

Your only source of sequencing is the tiny Erica module. Will that be enough?

Before you start... some considerations:
Eurorack percussion set-ups are insanely expensive compared to buying a drum machine that can sync or receive input from Eurorack. There's nothing wrong with doing percussion in Eurorack... it's just going to cost a pretty penny.

Let's work from the end and work our way backwards.

You'll need an output module that can deliver a stereo line-level (not Eurorack level) output.
You'll need a mixer for all of your percussion inputs. It's best to have one that is stereo and has at least one send for reverb or effects. The Endorphins has a mono sum mixer for its internal sounds... but if you use it, then whatever is in that module is a mix of percussion and has to be treated as a whole.

You'll need a way of triggering your drum modules (Eloquencer will work nicely).

With that... your set-up is missing a main mixer. You'll need a minimum of four inputs. More if you want the individual outs of the Endorphins.

LFOs are useful. But how do you intend to use it in this set-up?
The FH2 will work as an alternative to the Eloquencer if you're working with a DAW. However, the FH2 has to be set-up in advance of the DAW as the FH2 doesn't like to be addressed by the browser GUI and your DAW at the same time. So to change the FH2's settings you'll have to quit out of your DAW.

This set-up is about $2,000 - $3,000US. If you use an off-the-shelf MIDI drum machine with a Befaco VCMC to translate from CV to MIDI you'll spend a whole lot less. If the drum machine can respond to MIDI CC the VCMC can translate from CV to MIDI CV.

Consider your options carefully.

Cheers for the suggestions, Temps Utile was suggested in another thread and it looks like a whole lot of fun :)

Fantastic resource, thanks for sharing @defragmenteur !

Yes, some FX and a modulation source would definitely improve the setup. I'm not really enjoying the factory delay in the Neutron and i find myself in situations where i could use another LFO.
For a stereo line-level output would something like Intellijel Outs do the job? Here's what i came up with for starters, removed some modules because of budget limitations.
As for the casing, I'm looking at Tip Top Mantis.

EDITED Dec 10th 2019, 15:16

• 1 on this!

• 1 on this

Hello this is my rack. What would you add/remove from here? (28hp left)
Please consider that outside the rack I also have a mn 0coast
dreadbox echo and A118 are the two candidates to be sold (or not?)
Also sorry for my poor english.
Thank you for your help

Mastering and mixing for modular

Mastering for Modular
https://www.noiseengineering.us/blog/2018/12/19/mastering-for-modular

Mixing for Modular: the Long-Awaited Prequel to That Other Thing
https://www.noiseengineering.us/blog/2019/1/4/mixing-for-modular-the-long-awaited-prequel-to-that-other-thing

Mixing for Modular 2: This Time it’s Digital
https://www.noiseengineering.us/blog/2019/1/4/mixing-for-modular-2-this-time-its-digital

Hey GarfieldModular,

Thanks for the kind words. To be honest, I’ve never thought of the muddiness as an issue with the gear but as a lack of knowledge when mixing or equalising. Anyway, I’m using Befaco cables which I guess are fine and shouldn’t add any noise or muddiness to the sound.

Senor-bling I’m happy to see I’m not alone in this and you could clearly identify the issue. You certainly described it better than I did, muffled sound and missing crispness, yes.

I’m currently using a semi-modular Minibrute 2s as an output, so my modular’s VCA output is going to the Minibrute’s master input. From there it goes to the Focusrite audio interface and to the computer via USB.

In the computer I record using Reaper and amplify / compress the final mix in Audacity. My guess Is I’m doing something wrong in the DAW, but I’m not sure what. However, it is completely possible that the Minibrute is adding that character to the sound too.

I’ll be adding an out module to my system soon, I guess that would allow me to check if that muddiness is being added in the Minibrute or in the DAW. Let’s see if we can figure this out.

Thanks for the replies

Eurorack on perfect circuit
I have a volca kick and was wondering, can I use the volca to trigger sequences within the eloquencer?
If this is possible I might switch out the Befaco Kickall for an Oscilloscope to use with the Microbrute.

So I'm new to eurorack and I wanted to make an EDM drum machine/ sequencer rack with an additional lfo to use with my arturia MicroBrute. I know I could get something like an MPC but I really like the look and feel of modular. Let me know if this rack makes sense or if I am missing any key components for this Rack Drum Machine to work. I've also added a Midi to CV input in case I want to control drums with a midi keyboard or for the future if I have another synth. I do think it has a bit more than just midi to cv such as clock dividing. Currently I am within the constraints of 104hp as I chose a make noise skiff powered rack to put it in. I do like this size but if more functions are necessary I am willing to get a bigger case.

This is a list of all the modules. Any suggestions and assistance is much appreciated.

Winter Modular Eloquencer- 38hp
Befaco Kickall- 6hp
Erica Synths Snare- 10hp
Erica Synths Hi-Hat- 10hp
Endorphins Drum Synthesizer- 30hp
Expert Sleepers FH-2 Factotum USB MIDI Host + MIDI-CV- 8hp
LFO- 2hp

EDITED Dec 10th 2019, 05:33

Maths can do this right now.