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also, the problem with ditching the Vnlcusrer VCA and Multiple and replacing the space with a Veils is that id use up all my space and have 13/14 slots filled in my bus cable. So I think ill stick with the Vnlcurser VCA and Buffered Mult just for utility purposes.

EDITED Mar 12th 2021, 00:18

2 0f 2 is going to be my case that I build probably next year after I've assessed all my needs with my first skiff.
I do realize that I should have gotten a bigger case, but I was on a budget and just wanted something small to start out with seeing how this will be my first ever eurorack.
The cool thing about having a second 104hp skiff though is you can daisy chain 2 Row Power 45s together and I felt like that would be a better option for my wallet.

Hi. Been lurking for a while now. Ton of great info here, soaking up (drowning in) the knowledge. Have a Minibrute 2s & Drumbrute combo (with an external mixer plus a few guitar effects pedals on hand) and ready to take the deep dive into modular.

So, for your collective critique, my starter RackBrute 6U... Anything obviously awry or just plain stoopid?

Cheers

Hi Jim,

Wow, nice rack! I agree here a bit with Farkas, if you reach a certain size as well as complexity, and your rack size and complexity has reached that I would say, though Lugia took the fantastic effort to still give it a try :-) , then it becomes rather a personal taste how you like to (re-) arrange your modules. It looks fantastic though!

Can't we make your rack stickied on top of this rack forum for beginners? Saying, look, if you consider to start into modular synthesizers, this is about the minimum size to grow towards to otherwise it makes more sense to buy a ready synthesizer instead ;-)

Thanks a lot for sharing this, very interesting and kind regards, Garfield.

Thanks for all the responses!

I should mention that I'm specifically looking to be able to record in longer gate lengths via midi-cv conversion (or from within the eurorack sequencer itself like CV Key Rec Mode in the Eloquencer) for the use longer sustained envelopes where I'd like the gate length to be the amount of time that I've held a key or touch interface of some kind.

My problem currently with my Eloquencer, although I will be keeping it as it lends itself to results that I otherwise would not come up with is that I'd still like to be able to express a pattern that is in my head and the limit to gate lengths and number of steps is preventing me from doing so at the moment.

Has anyone encountered a similar situation? What did you end up doing, are there any sequencers in general, eurorack or other that will allow me to interact with my systems gates/envelopes etc in such a way?

I don't have one but I'd love to get a Steve's MS-22
If you want an example of the cleaner sounds, check out the sound sample that's part of Steve O'Hear's review

-- tverscho

Yes it does sound very nice, thanks for the link. Also sold out at Three Tom. Guess I'll keep an eye on eBay...

+1 one the Short Bus, especially in combination with Pamela's New Workout. I'm also using an ST Modular Switched, which is just a switched multiple. More often using it to send two sequences a few destinations, but it can also serve the wrong way round, just try not to have 2 sequences feeding the same bus at the same time!

I've had the Tetrapad for a while and I feel I'm probably under-using it. In particular the pressure has never been all that usable. I just got the Tete which might open a few doors!

I was on the fence about a matrix mixer, but you've really convinced me that it's just something I really need that can exponentially extend the possibilities. You are absolutely right, it would get boring quickly.

I've updated my rack with your recommendations and dropped QPAS and BAI.

Thanks - I try to help!

a good place to start:

mutable links, kinks, shades (or any other modules that cover their functionality) - multiples of this (or parts of it) are extremely useful - either as identical modules or different ones

a matrix mixer - one of the most powerful tools in the modular synthesist's toolbox - use them for combining modulation sources, setting up feedback loops, adding send return functionality to mixers without it etc etc etc

Great feedback! I will definitely focus on what support modules can help with what I have now. This makes sense.

looks like a fun rack to play with - but not a long term solution, at least for me...

too many voices/big shiny, expensive feature modules - not enough modulation or especially utilities (more variety of these needed to imo) more vcas is a good start - as is anything that can be used too mulltiply, modify and merge modulation

I prefer

sound sources < sound modifiers < modulation (20%+ of the rack) < utilities (at least 30% of the rack)

because you can get much more variation that way

utilities are the inexpensive, dull polish that stop the expensive, shiny modules from tarnishing and makes them shine

personally I'd postpone the modules you think you want - until the next case - and get the modules you need to support the ones you've already got

EDITED Mar 11th 2021, 20:38

Giving anyone a reason to chuckle is a satisfying day's work, and it helped me recover from being traumatized by a demented stalker kitty :)

Another little 4hp module that is interactive and handy is the Acid Rain Switchblade. It's just three switches that you can either gate or manually switch with a button press, but I find myself using it all the time to switch between sequences on the fly. More useful than it looks.

Tetrapad + Tête is a super powerful controller combo, it can be configured in a number of different ways to control your rack, and it offers an internal sequencer, looper and configurable CV I/O. From what I can gather, TetraPad+Tête+Planar2 is even better, but too much for me ATM.

@oldandintheway this post made my day, that cat really is a jerk!! 🤣🤣

EDITED Mar 11th 2021, 18:20

Still missing some of the modules that are harder to find like QPAS, Panharmonioum, disting EX.

The next three modules I'll pick up are Noise Engineering BIA, Noise Engineering MI, Erica Synths Dual FX.

I have every other module already installed.

Any thoughts or ideas on this? The big candidate for replacement is the Doepfer A-143-2 Quad ADSR (I love this thing so much tho). Also with the remaining 3hp in the bottom, I was thinking of a 2hp VCA.

for a mute module i got one that is called Quiet,but havent used it yet.
also considering the Makrow Module

Thank you! I didn't realize that a rogue module had fallen out of my rack and out of view. (Aren't I the doofus for getting hissy about something that is actually a helpful feature. Bad me.)

And my post suffered from pre-coffee confusion...I upgraded to unicorn independently of losing my mind over an on-screen cat :)

so is this a single case or is it 1 of 2 - in which case - where's 2 of 2 - probably better to put them into a single case for planning!

definitely getting there though!!

one thing to watch with vcas - are they amplifiers or attenuators? check the max gain - if it is 1 then they are attenuators - a lot of them are like this - I prefer actual voltage controlled amplifiers, myself - useful for more things than attenuators - I would dump the intellijel buffered mult and get veils instead if it was me! I think you'll probably be fine with 4 vcas in this size case

yes - make your rack bigger than it actually is (an extra row at the bottom when editing) and never leave modules outside the rack

but you could have done that without being an unicorn!

great - thanks for the suggestions, guys!!!

@Lugia - HAHAHA Funny title!!! I'm going to take a copy - remove all the modules you added - and put my modules back in!!!

the Portland has a mixer already - but it's mono - and normally goes to through one of the lollipops before hitting the mixer - if I need panning of the individual drum sounds I can record them separately and do that in the DAW - output is effectively mono at the moment anyway - my studio monitors are in a different country - long story!!!

for more panning and mixing I'd be most likely just to add more channels of the tex-mix - they are inexpensive and have panning - I though about auto panning - but I can patch it if I want it!

as for the doepfer modules - they get video signals sent through constantly -

I don't think I need another scaler - adding the 1st 5:1 will take me up to 14 scalers - I think that's enough (at least for the foreseeable future) and there are quite a few attenuators through out the system (one of the switched is actually a bank of attenuators (pusherman is not up to date on modulargrid)

mults are a good idea - although I do have quite a few stackcables - but I'd always go for 2hp DIY ones - such as the frequency central mumu - they are inexpensive and can be built in 10-15 minutes or so

the 2 right hand side cases are looking very good though - as little movement as possible will happen there - going to swap the joystick to the far right though, as I'm right handed!

as I said I'll take a copy of Lugia's (excellent) attempt and try to cram the modules I actually own back in - will re-post in this thread once it's done! fingers crossed the power & screws (and also some of the new modules and components for the diy builds) for the last case get here before next weekend, so I can build it and then I can actually start moving modules about

once again thanks very much for your input!!! greatly appreciated!!

OK, I've upgraded to Unicorn status...can I have special powers to get that bloody cat off the corner of my screen? It's a distracting nuisance. Yes, I am easily distracted.

I tried an overlay/pop-up blocker in Chrome, but no luck. Is there a way to disable it? Please, I'm begging.

Cheers,

Farkas thanks gotta check them out.the joystick im thinking about getting is the erica synth black joystick 2,but gonna check if there is some cheaper with the same functionality

Thanks for sharing, I'm waiting on a Morphagene myself and this is very inspiring for the upcoming experiments !
I also love using Maths as a drone VCO, very cool tone control possibilities
-- toodee

Congratulations on the Morphagene! It takes up a lot of space in my tiny rack but I don't regret it. From my fledgling experience of modular, I believe you have many exciting sonic journeys ahead of you. If you'll allow me one word of advice... if you find you arrive at a point where the Morphagene is creating something incredible then record it! I've lost count of the times when I've stumbled upon a sweet spot, then tweak some more and never get it back! Happy trails...

hahah what's going on here :P this is like the "Reste Kiste" of stuff that's not fitting in the other and somehow a planning of a rack that makes sense in a way of this stuff without buying too much new things to make it work
love these freaks around here

Sieht Anna das nicht?
-- JakoJako
sie guckt hier nicht rein ;)

Thanks for sharing, I'm waiting on a Morphagene myself and this is very inspiring for the upcoming experiments !
I also love using Maths as a drone VCO, very cool tone control possibilities

Nice find @farkas

Metropolis can have arbitrary gate lengths but it limited to 8 steps, but with repeats and gate length adjustments I think you can get close to "64" steps or easily fall off the traditional 16 step/bar notion.

Pretty cool potential addition to your test bench:
https://www.modulargrid.net/e/ladik-b-230-curious-goat-silver

I'm not using a joystick, but I have been really focused on incorporating more interactive and performance-oriented modules. For the price, I really enjoy the Sound Machines LS1 light strip for modulation and the Low-Gain Short Bus for live trigger/gate/rhythm manipulation. The FSS Makrow is killer for changing multiple parameters with the turn of a single knob. DivKid Mutes are great. I'll soon be adding a second Mutes module, in fact, so I probably should have just picked up the FSS Stumm in the first place, but I really enjoy DivKid's module. The NE Quant Gemi is a fairly interactive octave switching module. And finally, the Acid Rain Navigator is on my short list.
Which joystick are you looking at?

one thing i wanna do with my modular,is Making a Controller row/skiff with modules for controlling and live interaction with my modular.

one thing i know i want is a joystick module for my drones
im interested in hearing what other modules people are using for this sort of thing?

I really like the look and sound of Beads and I've been watching YouTube avidly to learn more about it. Unfortunately my little 84HP rack is full up and, anyway, Beads is sold out in the UK. I was interested to learn that it uses a recording buffer, however, and that got me thinking about the Morphagene, which also has a recording buffer. Learning about Beads inspired me to use the Morphagene in a way that is new for me...

I went through and revised my space yet again. It seems that just when have an idea for my final build, i have to change things once again. I had realized that I had 2 more inputs in my flying bus cable that I wasn't using.
Now if I'm smart, which I hope I am, id hope that I'm at least smart enough to use ALL my space if I can.
I also realized i had no VCAs... dumb lol
So, I got rid of the Varigate4+, Levit8, Polaris, and FX Aid, and exchanged them for:

Mimetic Digitalis - I watched a video on this and I love the amount of things I can do with this module. I feel like its way better than the Varigate 4+ in terms of editing, plus it saved me some room.

uJove - Its an excellent and simple filter with 4 modes and 3 cv inputs, one for resonance, one bipolar, and one unipolar.

Vnlcursal VCA - Its a 6 channel VCA which, in my book, is better than a quad VCA, not to mention its all packed in only 8hp, plus it just looks evil >:)

FX Aid XL - Its just apparently a lot better than the standard FX Aid so I thought why not.

6x Mix -3 A and 3 B inputs and 3 A+B outputs for a mixer just sounds great to me.

This made enough room for me to add Kinks and a dual buffered multiple because utilities are important.

yeah but at 50c/year it's not that much of a hassle is it?

just buy a bag of ics when you buy the module!!

I'm considering one and that would be my plan!

it doesn't happen that often from what I can make out

I'm at the second chip failure in less than two years...

EDITED Mar 11th 2021, 09:38

Gotcha ! Indeed, that's a powerful combo, although I'd be unable to get the need for logic modules out of my head. Imagine that with a few boolean operators and things like gate skippers and gate delays. The modulation section you proposed for me and several others has totally spoiled me :-)

Whats the WMD Metron like? https://www.modulargrid.net/e/wmd-metron Should be OK for Gate length. You can also slow-clock a sequencer for an extended gate time, a really simple module for this would be the Noise Engineering Bin Seq if you want fairly fixed or manually tweaked gate times. https://www.modulargrid.net/e/noise-engineering-bin-seq

Not that I know of offhand...but there IS a way to do what you're describing, and it uses a CV channel on the sequencer and this: https://www.modulargrid.net/e/ladik-s-187-voltage-controlled-clock-trig-gate-modifier This has a pulse delay and a pulse length modifier, both of which can operate in a range from 0 to 300 seconds.

Well, what the hell...

Not going to go into detail here, since you know the vast majority of the modules already. I did a LOT of reordering for signal flow clarification, though. As a result, a number of previous positions where modules were are now occupied by something a bit different, while still trying to maintain the functional separations that were in place before. Plus, I did make a few additions here and there where they seemed to be called for, such as adding a third rescaler for the video cabs and restructuring those so that you main "control" modules are now at the bottom, your main LZXes are next up, then almost all of the non-video modules in this (except the MIDI interface) were shifted to the bottom of the three-row video cab to help delineate the "don't plug these directly into the video" differentiation.

I also clarified the drum module's usage a bit more by adding the Ladik submixers, which now lets you pan drum sources (and the VCO-VCF-VCA/wavefolder path) with a stereo comp after those so that the drum sounds can bang harder. Then a submixer here, a few PWRchekrs for the DIY cabs, and a bit of the usual mojo hand gettin' waved over the whole design along with a sprinkle of black cat hair and graveyard dust, and there ya go!

As for removals, I don't think I made more than four in here, trying to keep the original module complement intact except where it felt like the Department of Redundancy Department had gotten a toe-hold...and those very few removals opened the space up for a LOT more once things got slung around the cabs. I'm especially pleased with how the right cabs came out, notably with that single row for the Bassline, Deckard's, and Magneto (and a new Roti Pola, plus your M/S matrix). This now slaps, I do believe!

@JimHowell1970 Good call, I forgot about VCAs, I guess I just thought that the levit8 counted, so I got rid of that and the ONA and replaced it with a quad vca and added 6x mix.

Quadrax can be made even more potent by pairing it with a Maths AND the Qx expander. The Qx allows you to do things like "cascading" different LFO waveforms based on the four pairs of rise/fall settings on the Quadrax, and this plays really nicely with the Maths's ability to screw around with these sorts of signals on its own. And +1 on the Doepfer ADSRs...in fact, the A-140-2 is the exact thing you want: two ADSRs in 8 hp.

Noise source + a pair of passive LPGs = two more neat percussives! Sounds right to me!

A note on the trig sequencer: a valid contender to replace the Gibbon ALAK (funny little device, it seems) would be the Robaux LL8, loads of power hidden in there, I recommend having a look
-- toodee

Very true...but then, this is why I dropped the Pam's in there. By coupling the user-defined trigger sequencing that Pam's is capable of to a four-channel CV/gate step sequencer, things get kicked on up into the bonkers range.

Are there any sequencers in eurorack format that allow for recording gates of arbitrary length? Longer than 16 step sequences?

Hello,

Currently own the Winter Modular Eloquencer which is a fantastic tool! Although there are two things which I wish it could do..

So I'm wondering if there are any sequencers that can

1.) Record in longer gate lengths via external midi or internally? In order to program longer sustained envelopes

2.) Have more steps per pattern for more slowly evolving sequences?

Cheers!

Hi Mowse,

Sorry, I can't tell if you have been listening a lot to Stellardrone because I don't know what it is or does...?

Anyway, still great and fun to listen at jam you got there! Kind regards, Garfield.

Hi Lugia,

"Oh, you mean one of these?: O0YAAOSwQnpezCL2" target="_blank">https://www.ebay.com/itm/Soundcraft-Vi6-digital-mixing-console-mixer-upgraded-w-racks-church-owned/133599376656?hash=item1f1b24b510O0YAAOSwQnpezCL2 ."

Oh yes! That would be something, for 1500 bucks fully functional and in perfect undamaged state ;-) I would say yes, then I clear out the living room, then I wouldn't care any longer what wife or son have to say ;-) Living room will then be the new studio, yeah!

Dreaming is nice... though back in the reality... it's tough to find a good mixer but hey, that's with everything: the perfect synth or perfect sequencer or perfect mixer just doesn't exist, so one almost always ends up with doing concessions. Cheers, Garfield.

Hi Mowse,

Oh, those first few tones, so tense, so nice, I am getting goose-bumps here! It also reminds me a bit of Jean-Michel Jarre's Waiting For Cousteau (original 1990 release), track 2 "Calypso - II" when that starts around 1:00+ minute.

Nicely done Mowse! Thank you very much for sharing this and kind regards, Garfield.

Can't we asked Anna to make one rack (one row will do for this purpose) full with only VCAs and we and Anna should keep that secret from JakoJako. Then when he "surprises" her with the no longer secret rack, she counter-surprises him with a rack full of VCAs and tells him:

"Well you know darling what they say on ModularGrid, you never can have enough VCAs!" :-)

Man, I wish I could help here. This is a great thought exercise, but I feel like once a rack reaches a certain size, the arrangement all depends on highly personal choices and workflow.
Personally, I'll be maxed out on space at 832hp soon, and had to make some recent arrangement choices that may be odd to some of the folks here but make perfect sense to me based on how I use the thing. I really just looked at what I wasn't using and asked myself why. If it was because the module didn't fit into the concept/sound I was going for or if I hated the interface, I pulled it completely out of the rack (goodbye Clouds and Phonogene) and opened up that space for something more practical. No use for me to eat up time and space with something that is just not working. If I wasn't using a module because of where it was placed in the rack, I moved it closer to the modules I use most often. That was actually the case with Maths for me. I wasn't getting the most out of it, but now I use it all the time simply because I moved it closer to where I have my hands most often.
I have spent way too much time scratching my head, configuring, and reconfiguring my rack here on MG before making any real-world changes, all the while being mindful of how I actually work (which is probably way different than your approach). Then I finally took a few hours on a Sunday and actually completed the "Great Rearrangement", but I still spent time over the next few weeks moving a few modules. Now, I'm really happy with my arrangement, and getting the most use out of everything.
I think if you follow the general guidelines we've all offered to the novices here (e.g. maintain a sensible signal flow similar to a hardwired synth architecture: osc -> filter -> modulator -> vca -> effects, keep similar module functions together or separate them out into multiple voices, etc.) but on a larger scale, it still applies. But give yourself an allowance for having certain modules in seemingly odd places because that's where it makes sense for you.
Have fun with it. I wish you luck!