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-- if you do get to a format that is faster for you to complete, how about spending dedicated chunk of time trying to cover the more interesting modules available in one segment (e.g. sequencers, complex oscillators, etc.)? Then your detailed work would basically line up with and support a bunch of the summary findings given in lists like Doudoroff's (https://doudoroff.com/sequencers/). And after you cover one "cluster" of interesting modules, then you could move to a next interesting cluster. If out of ~8000 modules there are 10-20 interesting subgroups and you cover 5-10 most interesting modules in a group, then its
Feel free to use or ignore any of my comments above. I hope at least some of this is helpful to you!
-- nickgreenberg

Hi Nickgreenberg, All,

It took me a while but I since a while I am following up on your above mentioned idea. I am not following it up for 100% but as good as possible though. The way how I follow up on your idea is that I take a bunch of modules with the same functionality that I review and then move on to the next functionality. I finished multiples and VCAs for the moment, till I get perhaps another interesting multiple or VCA and moving on now to the next functionality, which is audio interface modules.

I have made "comparison" tables of functionality as well as tables where parameters & characteristics used in the review reports have been "bundled" in tables to compare the modules against each other from different angles and aspects. I have collect all those tables and reflected them in one PDF that's downloadable from my website in the "Other documents" tab, it's called "Review_reports_tables_20220508" whereby the date indicates the version or latest update. Here is the link to that:

https://garfieldmodular.net/index.php/other-documents/

Thanks a lot for your feedback that I finally managed to use in my updated way of reviewing the reports :-) Kind regards, Garfield.

Hi Tunç,

Great video effects! Your music sounds interesting, reminds me a bit of a modern version of the Sisters Of Mercy :-)

Thanks a lot for sharing this with us and kind regards, Garfield.

I love the Commodore 64. These require SID chips and it sounds like getting the new clones may be the most stable option. It would be nice if they assigned a 1V/oct per SID voice, but they don’t, so you need 4 to get the 4 note polyphony. Though, you could build out a 12 note chord. VCO and filter are combined, but big. Barely room for the VCA and EG. Also, threw in the Polychrome Phaser and a joystick to do cool stuff.

Roland 500 VCOs paired with Vowels for a bi-timbral poly 4 into Wasp filters. I added a joystick to be able to control all vowel sounds and cutoff frequencies with one interface.

EDITED May 12th 2022, 14:24

I love the old Commodore 64 SID chip sound. These Chipz VCOs are supposed to be similar. I’m also obsessed with the 2HP Vowel. For this build, you can get 4 note polyphony from either sets of VCOs or combine with to have Vowel and SID together. My plan for the joystick is to split the X and Y with 1x6s into the Vowel CV and Wasp CV1. It should give some pretty cool sound control. Closed out with some bold effects.

I am attempting to use a Poly-8 to create a bi-timbral 4 voice polyphony synth. This requires splitting the input 1v/oct and then combining the VCO outputs. I am experimenting with multiple NiftyKEYZ configurations.

EDITED May 16th 2022, 19:12

Thanks for the tip! Tanh3 is on it

My new single "Far" is out now on all digital platforms!
DnB style + Analog and Digital sound + with a visual made with Max MSP.
Analog and digital hybrit mixing and mastering.

Label: Wic Recordings

Download and stream here
https://wicrecordings.lnk.to/FAR

www.tunccakir.com

Hmmm...OK, I went off on this, and I think I've got a better solution AND a rationale for removing the Model D.

In this version, I have the two cabs side-by-side, mainly to show the division of labor between the two cabs. These could just as easily be on "top" of each other, though, although the left cab should probably be the one on the bottom if this is done.

LEFT TOP: P/S, Black Sequencer, and then the Voltage Block WITH the Varigate 4+ that serves as its memory, controller, etc. After that is a Xaoc Bytom, a multichannel OR + gate/trig distributor...very useful in situations such as this. The last bit there is a XODES bidirectional 4-1 sequential switch, positioned so that it's adjacent to the "voicing" row in the right cab.

LEFT BOTTOM: Pam's expander and Pam's...expander was put on the left to minimize "outside" cables getting confused with patchcords. Then the DOT trigger sequencer, and after it are some basic clock modifiers...a dual pulse delay and a two-channel probabilistic pulse skipper. These support the Boolean logic module, a Frequency Central Deep Thought dual Boolean gate.

If you're wondering what the Boolean logic is for, here's an explanation: Boolean logic uses specific conditional gates which output a gate pulse when certain conditions are met. For example, if two incoming gate signals overlap, Boolean logic can obtain new gates via either an AND (when both inputs are 'high' this outputs a gate), OR (when only one gate is supposed to be "high"...having both or neither inputs hot = nothing) and so on. With a decent Boolean module and some modules to screw with the timing pulses, you can have even MORE clocking or weird conditional states with which to drive all of the sequencers...or anything else that wants a gate!

Anyway, after that are the two Metamorphs, and then I added a Tenderfoot Quad Quantizer for quantizing the sequencers that don't have internal quantization...or to just quantize modulation signals, which can be a really beautiful sound when something like an LFO on sawtooth gets quantized into ascending tessalations.

RIGHT TOP: Voice row. P/S first, then a Ladik dual lag for portamento, etc. Then Plaits...and then, some fun! The two next modules are Klavis Twin Waves mkiis...which are dual wavetable VCOs with internal quantization plus random capabilities, which gives you a total of five (or potentially six with the AUX out on the Plaits) oscillators in this version. Veils goes after that to offer CV control over (most of) the oscillator outputs; outputs that it DOESN'T have space for, though, are easily repurposed as audio-frequency modulators. After that, you've got a dual lowpass gate, Make Noise's LxD, then a way more interesting and complex VCF from Dave Rossum that offers changeable slopes, improved resonance control, sweepable filter types, and so on; this is pretty much perfect as a singular VCF in this sort of build. And at the end is a 4-in, 2-out Tesseract Tex-Mix setup which gives you a VCA input, two FX sends, and panning control across the four inputs, and the output section has the master level, headphone preamp, and I/O for the two FX sends and two stereo FX returns. Got hipped to the Tex-Mix by Jim...and when space is key, it actually is one of the smaller VCA-equipped performance mixers out there.

RIGHT BOTTOM: Modulation, mostly. Batumi (with Poti expander) first, then the ultraversatileness that IS the Maths. After that, you'll notice a Frap 321 and a Happy Nerding 3xVCA...these modules are there specifically to tamper with and alter modulation signals in a large variety of methods, allowing you to derive even MORE (and potentially screwier!) signals from just a few modulation generators. And speaking of those, there's a Quadrax/Qx combo next...the Qx really rips the lid off of the Quadrax by bringing the EOR and EOF signals out, and then these can be used to fire other EGs in the Quadrax; fact is, you could turn this one module, with the use of the Qx, into a cascading AR envelope set with successive EOR -> next TRIG patches which ALSO has CV over the attack and/or release...in short, a totally batshit insane waveform generator! Then the Zadar/Nin is next for "normal" envelope generation...and of course, there's loads of sources to trigger those, ergo the Nin's presence in here. The Dual FX is next (which is perfect for the Tex-Mix's FX bussing: 2 mono sends, 2 stereo returns). And that last sliver is a quad level adjuster, which takes synth-levels down to line-levels. Two, natch, get used for the Tex-Mix outs, which leaves two others to be used as "isolated" outs for a leadline, etc.

So...loads more complex, but majorly improved. Some of the initial modules did get bumped here so that other, better solutions could be pursued...which is also the rationale for pulling the Model D out. It's a good synth, to be sure, but THIS is where you could conceivably get to once it's gone.
-- Lugia

This is really wonderful and I’m grateful that you took the time to make this for me. You’re awesome! I will definitely look into these modules and see which I can afford to add to my rack.

Also this all is indeed a bit too complex for me right now and as you know I’m still a beginner and learning. However what you showed me is a good way for me to get an idea of what I’ll need in the future as you said. It’ll eventually happen. Just need to figure out my workflow and how I usually use my set up.

I’m definitely going to look into that Tex Mix module and NIN expander for the Zadar for now. I’ll get a couple more buff mults, a matrix mixer probably, some attenuator/attenuvertors, slew limiter, and another filter if I get the Polaris so I can use that as a phaser if I want to. I know I got myself into this modular mess and it’s not looking good for my wallet, but I’m still trying to keep costs somewhat low.

Again, thank you so much for taking the time to do this and explain everything.

EDITED May 8th 2022, 19:27

I'm not really sure why you would buy a scope to do what is essential mixing/MASTERING.

I should have given more context. That's not what I'm doing.

The scope is mostly used for looking at DC/modulation signals. When I'm trying to finesse a modulation signal with an attenuation and offset, for example. Or when I get new modulation modules, helping me understand exactly what they are doing so I can figure out how to use them best. It's for testing signal flows within my patch when things aren't working as expected.

I guess I approach patching like software programming and the CV scope is my debugger. Although I sometimes mindlessly experiment, I often have a specific idea that I'm trying to pursue and sometimes I need to see what's going on to make it happen. To give a specific example: One thing I like doing lately is feeding an LFO into a waveshaper and then into a clock-triggered quantizer. It's really helpful to see what's going on there while looking for the "sweet spots".

Asking about external scope options comes from the fact that I have a Zeroscope 1U and it is very useful to me for these purposes, but I only use it when I need it which is not most patches, so I want to swap it out for more "day to day" utilities.

I know the correct solution here is to get a bigger/second case and keep using the Zeroscope, but I was wondering if there's an affordable external option that could be useful for other purposes, such as in DIY contexts. I was also just curious how you connect a modular system to a general-purpose scope. It wasn't obvious. Thanks for pointing me to https://www.threetom.com/product/threetom-wiretap/

I like this suggestion:

personally I'd go for a expert sleepers interface (which I have) and use one of the scopes in vcvrack

If I can get a DC signal into my computer then I can do whatever I want with it. It probably makes more sense for me than buying dedicated hardware. I'm not sure I'm equipped to do that at the moment, but I'm going to keep this option in mind.

on the other hand - with the fx aid (xl)s you do get a hundred plus algorithms to choose from - including 808/909 emulations etc etc... so a lot more flexibility ++++ at least some algorithms on the fx aid are clockable, which is not at all common with fv-1 based effects modules

Thanks for the comments, given me something to think about.

EDITED Feb 27th 2023, 06:56

Naaaah...what you need, if you're getting an external scope, is one that can ALSO be used in an X-Y mode. If you're doing a lot of bassheavy stuff, keeping an eye on low end phasing is a MUST, and a dual-tracer in X-Y can give you phasescope results when you connect the two stereo channels to the two inputs on the scope. Why? Well, if you're tracking for vinyl, you'll find that bass signals below somewhere around 120-180 Hz can cause SERIOUS problems for the lathe engineer. So as a rule, bass below that certain point can cause havoc if it's out of phase, so it gets summed down to mono for vinyl. Keeping an eye on phasing while mixing, also, helps you get to better mixes with some practice, especially when doing a lot of panning and other screwy imaging processes.

FYI, eBay has a pile of suitable o-scopes for $200 and down...just make sure that you get one that's dual-trace with X-Y capabilities.

EDITED May 8th 2022, 02:46

Hmmm...OK, I went off on this, and I think I've got a better solution AND a rationale for removing the Model D.

In this version, I have the two cabs side-by-side, mainly to show the division of labor between the two cabs. These could just as easily be on "top" of each other, though, although the left cab should probably be the one on the bottom if this is done.

LEFT TOP: P/S, Black Sequencer, and then the Voltage Block WITH the Varigate 4+ that serves as its memory, controller, etc. After that is a Xaoc Bytom, a multichannel OR + gate/trig distributor...very useful in situations such as this. The last bit there is a XODES bidirectional 4-1 sequential switch, positioned so that it's adjacent to the "voicing" row in the right cab.

LEFT BOTTOM: Pam's expander and Pam's...expander was put on the left to minimize "outside" cables getting confused with patchcords. Then the DOT trigger sequencer, and after it are some basic clock modifiers...a dual pulse delay and a two-channel probabilistic pulse skipper. These support the Boolean logic module, a Frequency Central Deep Thought dual Boolean gate.

If you're wondering what the Boolean logic is for, here's an explanation: Boolean logic uses specific conditional gates which output a gate pulse when certain conditions are met. For example, if two incoming gate signals overlap, Boolean logic can obtain new gates via either an AND (when both inputs are 'high' this outputs a gate), OR (when only one gate is supposed to be "high"...having both or neither inputs hot = nothing) and so on. With a decent Boolean module and some modules to screw with the timing pulses, you can have even MORE clocking or weird conditional states with which to drive all of the sequencers...or anything else that wants a gate!

Anyway, after that are the two Metamorphs, and then I added a Tenderfoot Quad Quantizer for quantizing the sequencers that don't have internal quantization...or to just quantize modulation signals, which can be a really beautiful sound when something like an LFO on sawtooth gets quantized into ascending tessalations.

RIGHT TOP: Voice row. P/S first, then a Ladik dual lag for portamento, etc. Then Plaits...and then, some fun! The two next modules are Klavis Twin Waves mkiis...which are dual wavetable VCOs with internal quantization plus random capabilities, which gives you a total of five (or potentially six with the AUX out on the Plaits) oscillators in this version. Veils goes after that to offer CV control over (most of) the oscillator outputs; outputs that it DOESN'T have space for, though, are easily repurposed as audio-frequency modulators. After that, you've got a dual lowpass gate, Make Noise's LxD, then a way more interesting and complex VCF from Dave Rossum that offers changeable slopes, improved resonance control, sweepable filter types, and so on; this is pretty much perfect as a singular VCF in this sort of build. And at the end is a 4-in, 2-out Tesseract Tex-Mix setup which gives you a VCA input, two FX sends, and panning control across the four inputs, and the output section has the master level, headphone preamp, and I/O for the two FX sends and two stereo FX returns. Got hipped to the Tex-Mix by Jim...and when space is key, it actually is one of the smaller VCA-equipped performance mixers out there.

RIGHT BOTTOM: Modulation, mostly. Batumi (with Poti expander) first, then the ultraversatileness that IS the Maths. After that, you'll notice a Frap 321 and a Happy Nerding 3xVCA...these modules are there specifically to tamper with and alter modulation signals in a large variety of methods, allowing you to derive even MORE (and potentially screwier!) signals from just a few modulation generators. And speaking of those, there's a Quadrax/Qx combo next...the Qx really rips the lid off of the Quadrax by bringing the EOR and EOF signals out, and then these can be used to fire other EGs in the Quadrax; fact is, you could turn this one module, with the use of the Qx, into a cascading AR envelope set with successive EOR -> next TRIG patches which ALSO has CV over the attack and/or release...in short, a totally batshit insane waveform generator! Then the Zadar/Nin is next for "normal" envelope generation...and of course, there's loads of sources to trigger those, ergo the Nin's presence in here. The Dual FX is next (which is perfect for the Tex-Mix's FX bussing: 2 mono sends, 2 stereo returns). And that last sliver is a quad level adjuster, which takes synth-levels down to line-levels. Two, natch, get used for the Tex-Mix outs, which leaves two others to be used as "isolated" outs for a leadline, etc.

So...loads more complex, but majorly improved. Some of the initial modules did get bumped here so that other, better solutions could be pursued...which is also the rationale for pulling the Model D out. It's a good synth, to be sure, but THIS is where you could conceivably get to once it's gone.

I really like my Erica Synths Black Hole DSP v2 as it has stereo and various dry/wet controls and easy to learn. Plus it sounds amazing!

I personally like my Erica Dual FX. This is the only FX module I’ve owned so I don’t have anything to compare it to or suggest something better. It’s worth checking out, though!
-- Avesta

Actually, it's two FX Aids under one panel.

Many synth companies use this multieffects chip known as the Spin FV-1. They're easy to work with and they can do plenty of algorithms...but they all sound about the same. Even my AE system has a stereo FV-1 module. But the neat thing here is that this sure doesn't COST like an FX Aid XL; two of those would be about $500-ish, while the Erica comes in at around $200 lower. However, the FX Aid XL has multiple CV ins for parameter control, while the Erica's implementation is more like the regular FX Aid. Still, you come out $100+ ahead with the Erica. Decent choice!

EDITED Feb 27th 2023, 06:56

Tesseract mixer with Tukra and Happy Nerding fx aid would be a fun combo for small rig and few utilities like VCA, envelopes, LFO and have killer setup.
-- sacguy71

works great for a big rig too... as expandable...

also the mono channels have built in vcas... so maybe not so many needed...

generally you'd want to get 3.5mm to bnc cables - but this oscilloscope doesn't seem to support them - possibly better searching for scopes that are recommended for eurorack users (try searching on modwiggler!)

I'd probably look around based on those (they'll probably be a little bit more expensive though - unless you can find a slightly older module used...

I just use a cheap multimeter for checking my DIY builds...

personally I'd go for a expert sleepers interface (which I have) and use one of the scopes in vcvrack if I needed it - never have though...

Are products such as this suitable as an external oscilloscope for a eurorack system?

Hantek 2C42 Handheld Oscilloscope Multimeter 2 in 1 Multifunction Tester 2CH+DMM 40MHz Scope: https://www.amazon.com/Hantek-Handheld-Oscilloscope-Multimeter-Multifunction/dp/B07PWZV4XJ

I'm really unclear on if I can run a patch cable directly from one of my modules into this device. I'm also not sure if this oscilloscope works with DC signals. It says the multimeter is DC, but nothing about the oscilloscope.

I'm looking for something on par with a Zeroscope in terms of:

• View two signals at once
• A grid with the option to see where +/-10V is, and ideally +/-5V too
• Support for audio and DC signals

Any recommendations? Or am I really better off using a module with an oscilloscope designed for eurorack?

Tangentially: I have no multimeter and I'm thinking that would be useful for testing hardware for issues, recalibrations, and building DIY modules. But I see I can get a dedicated multimeter for a tenth the price.

Tesseract mixer with Tukra and Happy Nerding fx aid would be a fun combo for small rig and few utilities like VCA, envelopes, LFO and have killer setup.

I'd agree with Lugia on every single point and add - more utility modules...

think of them as plumbing... copying signals (stackcables or hubs are great for non-pitch signals, otherwise buffered mults)... logic, sequential switches, offsets, sub-mixing, matrix mixing (see my post on the matrix mixer thread for why) etc etc etc... possibly the most important modules you can add - and even better they are generally comparatively inexpensive...

and see my signature for a formula to follow, loosely, that gives you the most versatile modular for the least expense... scales well too - from tiny to massive modular synthesizers...

I like the tesseract tex-mix - inexpensive and expandable... I've got 2 stereo and 2 mono modules - with another mono module to build...

there's a tiny bit of bleed, but not a lot (shouldn't be an issue live)

be aware of the sends - if you don't want the channel in the sends then turn the sends down...

for the stereo channels the A & B sends work as L&R so they have stereo send/return - but you do need to be aware of this with the mono channels - ie set the levels the same etc etc

well a couple of points:

the a-138m can be used for both cv and audio

if you want to use one (or I think more) of the channels as DC offsets - then you need to set the jumper on the back... if you then use jumpered channels with inputs then the normalisation of the dc-offset is broken and the input is used...

what can you use matrix mixers for:

taking n signals and getting n different signals out - this is particularly useful for:

1. mixing and routing audio signals to different outputs (ie effects/filters etc) - parallel processing/4 different mixed waveforms from a single vco etc etc

2. combining and routing modulation inputs to produce more complex modulation outputs - possibly including dc-offsets

3. adding send/return to mixers that don't have send/return - for example send stereo input (channels 1 & 2) to effects module and then return that to (channels 3 & 4) and then mix channels 1/3 & 2/4 to get a wet/dry mix on the channel 3 & 4 outputs)

4. take n sequences and mix them together to make n different sequences - basically the same as point 2 - feed into quantizers to keep everything in tune - use the offset perhaps to change octaves or root notes - this will also work with gates

etc etc etc

EDITED May 7th 2022, 16:03

While I'm a fan of Ladik for their affordable and compact modules, I would not recommend this particular mixer of theirs. The pots are not srewed to the panel and thus feel pretty wobbly and low quality. I do recommend the Doepfer Performance Mixer, their quality is consistently outstanding. Can't say anything about the other models you listed.

If your budget for some reason doubles at some point in the future and you feel like you want to splurge on a mixer, I would also recommend the Xaoc Praga. Amazing Performance mixer with CV control over panning (which many other performance mixers lack) and level, among other things.

Hope that helps!

Some decent options for mixing in my live case. But which one.....?
Around £200 budget.

EDITED May 7th 2022, 07:11

DC offsets are voltages which DON'T move (except manually), but which can be added to another voltage via an adder or similar module to change that signal's voltage level.

Going back to the matrix mixer example...let's say you've got a sequencer line that you want to transpose. So, the CV from that would go into one of the matrix inputs. And from there, let's send that over to row #4. Now, with the offset jumper (on the backside of the module) in place, NOT connecting inputs will cause the matrix mixer to have a DC offset signal on...we'll call it input row #2.

So, if you want different pitches, you use different DC offsets and the matrix mixer combines those with the incoming CV. In bipolar mode (pot centers are "0", and you've got positive mixing to the right, negative mixing to the left), you have attenuverter-like functions. Meaning, that if you want to drop the sequencer's pitch by...we'll say an octave...it would look like this:

Sequencer CV -> Matrix input 1
No connection to input 2, which makes that an offset source
Now, using the vertical mixer row 4...turn up "row 4, input pot 1" to full to let the CV in, then adjust "row 4, input pot 2"...which is the DC offset level...so that you now have the same signal, but one octave down. If you send the CV to row 3 now, then raise the input to full but NO offset, this will give you the sequencer CV MINUS the offset. At that point, just use a two-input switch (actually, the best one for the task is Doepfer's A-151, as the input can be switched between 2, 3 and 4 inputs) and then by switching back and forth between row 3 (pure CV) and row 4 (-1v added to CV), you've got that octave jump...you just need to figure out when you want those octave shifts (via the A-151) to happen. DC offsets are very useful for shifting signal levels by exact amounts, in other words.

One other point, though...DC that gets out of the modular CAN be big trouble if you connect the synth to a DC-coupled amp. Speakers don't do well with that...to the point that you can actually set the speaker drivers ON FIRE by sending a big DC signal into the amp...which puts the speaker into "full travel" while majorly overheating the speaker coil. Not good. This is why I tend to insist on output modules that can DC-isolate, as those will NOT pass an accidental DC offset that's made it to the output stage. Plus, they do a good job of stopping trash, noise, etc from getting into the modular by accident from the signal outputs.

That's a decent overview, I think...it's not a concept that verbalizes well; you really need to see what it does hands-on.

EDITED May 7th 2022, 04:14

Portamento? Well, probably the best one for the price is Ladik's C-012. That's got two slew limiters with selectable portamento on up, down, or both CV direction changes. Their C-015 loses one slew limiter but adds a gate function so that portamento happens only on receiving a gate, and this also has the voltage direction discriminator. And the big bonus is that either one of those are only 4 hp wide, so they don't take up a bunch of space. And they're CHEAP. And since these don't use audio, you could put one in between the P/S and the Plaits to help keep P/S crud out of any audio modules.

As for the Polaris...I'd suggest adding a second VCF so that if you want to use it as a phaser, you're set. My suggestion would be another SVF such as Doepfer's A-121-2, which gives you simultaneous low, high, bandpass, and notch filtering.

One other point: you'd be better off if you tossed the Doepfer A-138 in deference to a current version Veils. That's only 2 hp larger than the mixer, but it allows you to have CV control over the incoming levels. Plus, since it has a "breakable" mixbus, you could conceivably use it in a 2-2 or 1-3 configuration, depending on what's needed at the time. Also, tossing the Intellijel Quad VCA for a Veils gives you the same sort of variable VCA response and breakable mixbus, costing $10 more but occupying 2 hp less.

Well, for starters, it's not an audio mixer...but this should explain what's actually going on...

So, you have four inputs which go "across" to the four pots. Now, if you enable the DC offset jumper, you'll have DC offsets on whichever horizontal row isn't connected to a signal via the bottom pots. This lets you set up three (one of them is for the offset) 1-out/3-in mixers which can add that CV to another CV.

Let's say you want to use it with a sequencer. So, what you'd do is to split the CV coming out of the sequencer's 1V/8va output into three identical signals via a mult. You'll have the same signal on inputs 1-3, and row 4 is your offsets. Then, after also setting the matrix mixer in bipolar mode, you'll have four different output channels with the sequencer out PLUS whatever offset you've dialed in. Couple that with a 4-in/1-out sequential switch, and you can then step through matrix outs 1-4 and let the DC offsets be used to transpose whatever pitch CV destination is desired. The nice thing about using this in bipolar mode is that you can also subtract voltages, so if you suddenly need a BIG pitch change either up or down from the sequencer's output, that's easily done.

Thank you so much for your quick reply. Could you please explain what a DC offset is like im a 5 year old lol?

yeah i have no idea what you said, but very interesting lmao. :P

EDITED May 7th 2022, 03:49

Well, for starters, it's not an audio mixer...but this should explain what's actually going on...

So, you have four inputs which go "across" to the four pots. Now, if you enable the DC offset jumper, you'll have DC offsets on whichever horizontal row isn't connected to a signal via the bottom pots. This lets you set up three (one of them is for the offset) 1-out/3-in mixers which can add that CV to another CV.

Let's say you want to use it with a sequencer. So, what you'd do is to split the CV coming out of the sequencer's 1V/8va output into three identical signals via a mult. You'll have the same signal on inputs 1-3, and row 4 is your offsets. Then, after also setting the matrix mixer in bipolar mode, you'll have four different output channels with the sequencer out PLUS whatever offset you've dialed in. Couple that with a 4-in/1-out sequential switch, and you can then step through matrix outs 1-4 and let the DC offsets be used to transpose whatever pitch CV destination is desired. The nice thing about using this in bipolar mode is that you can also subtract voltages, so if you suddenly need a BIG pitch change either up or down from the sequencer's output, that's easily done.

Where this really gets fun is when you start combining modulation signals. Remember, you've got 4 ins and 4 outs...and if you want "composite" modulation signals, you can send four different modulation sources to the matrix mixer and get four different composite modulation outputs, depending on how you set the pots.

Basically, they're amazing for scrambling up mods and CVs...Jim's sort of the matrix mixer guy here, so hopefully he'll pop in and point out some other uses.

I personally like my Erica Dual FX. This is the only FX module I’ve owned so I don’t have anything to compare it to or suggest something better. It’s worth checking out, though!

Forgive my ignorance, I’m a beginner. I’ve tried my best to research this online, youtube, and the Patch & Tweak book, but there is very little info on this (or perhaps I’m not searching correctly). I’m interested in the Doepfer A-138m Matrix Mixer module and I would like to know how this specific module is used.

• I understand that it has an audio input and output for each of the four channels, but what are knob functions for A, B, C, D?
• What does unipolar and bipolar mean?
• How can I utilize it in a patch with 2 separate sequencers? What will it do? I noticed people patching it with sequencers so that’s why i ask, otherwise I have no idea.
• What is the purpose of a CV mixer and what are different ways it can be used?

If you have any videos or links I could check out as well for more info, I’d appreciate it.

So I’ve managed to buy a second case which gave me a chance to rearrange some stuff in my first case. You’ll probably be put off by the Model D in the second rack because of the space it’s taking up, but this is the setup that works for me and I’ll stick with it for now. I know a lot of people utilizing their model d this way and I think it’ll be a good way for me to avoid buying more modules for the time being. I can utilize the case it came in with other modules if I really need to or just sell it. I haven’t installed the modules in the case yet - I want to make sure I have a solid plan first. You’ll notice that i have a lot of sequencers and that’s because I like utilizing different sequencers for different patches….so I planned everything making sure nothing is redundant.

The only modules I DON’T own yet are the Hysteria oscillators, Intellijel Quad VCA, and Polaris. What are your thoughts on the Polaris filter? Also, what kind of module do i need to add glide in my sequences? Is a slew module what I’m looking for?

If you have any suggestions regarding placement of the modules, please let me know. Also would be grateful to know your thoughts on what other modules I could add to this.

Grateful for your time!

First Rack

Second Rack

Actually, the total of the Behringer skiff and the uZeus comes out to $154-ish, but a Tiptop Mantis is less than $200 more...and you wind up with double the present space AND a better P/S AND you've got actual busboards AND it can handle depths to 50mm. For me, that would be priority #1. You can have loads of different modules, but if you can't implement them properly due to space constraints, you're going to paint yourself into a corner...especially given that the average depth of Eurorack modules is around 40mm, and you need to give a millimeter or two of extra space for routing ribbons, interconnects, etc.

And even if this IS intended as a "utility" cab, being able to fill out 208 hp with those sorts of modules simply means that you can extend the potential of them, plus have room for more "unitized" groups of modules, such as my fave modulation grouping (Maths, linear VCAs, modulation mixer such as a Frap 321 or Tiptop MISO, Quadrax/Qx) which opens up quite a bit of interaction that yields even more useful modulation signals. Or you could use a big chunk of the extra row for a large-scale performance mixer if the entire rig has enough potential audio signal paths to warrant it.

More isn't always better...but more opportunities is always useful.

And one other point: DO NOT put any of your audio modules in close proximity to a power supply...as in, power supply module next to a VCO or VCF or so on. Reason here is that some switching-type modular supplies can be noisy, and that noise can get into audio fairly easily. Next to the Pam's is fine, though, since noise induced in modulation modules will be far less noticeable than in audio.

Hi Sacguy71,

Ah yes, the Quad Switch, lovely module indeed, I got that one too! Kind regards, Garfield.

BTW I had emailed Happy Nerding and Igor responded. It sounds like he's hoping they can make a new batch outside the Ukraine in 1-2 months. I hope he can get back on his feet!

-- adamj

Excellent news! Good to see that Igor's still got the torch lit...I just hope that the rest of the synth community in both Ukraine AND Russia makes it out of that Pop-Star Stalin's vanity bloodbath in one piece.

Thanks for watching!

Thanks Garfield,

Yeah been busy at work and learning my gear. The module is Hikari Quad Switch and it is fantastic. Different than my Doepfer switch but easy to use and has a few tricks up its sleeve for routing signals in a patch. I like using it with Maze matrix mixer and other tools.

Hi Sacguy71,

Quite some while haven't heard or seen from you, nice to hear your jam and to see your video. It's nice to watch your new studio that is growing very well it seems :-)

Just in a flash of a second I saw you got a Hikari module too?! :-) Which one is that? Do you like it?

Nice work and thanks a lot for sharing this with us! Kind regards, Garfield.

the best solution for the extra 1 hp space that odd-count modules cause is to use at least one of those spaces to put in a Konstant Labs PWRchekr

Interesting! I didn't realize there were 1 HP modules that weren't just blank. This indeed seems useful. My case does not have any such indicators.

i went with erica dual fx. for the most part im happy

Oh, I missed this option. The FX aren't quite the same but it looks almost like two Pico DSPs in one module. I wish with the bigger form factor there were more CV inputs for control of both FX parameters at once, but it still looks like a reasonable option. And it seems you can switch between controlling the different parameters (or wet/dry) with the CV input, unlike the Pico which only let's you control parameter 1. So the added flexibility is a good step up from the Pico.

Responding to myself from earlier in the thread:

I found one retailer in England selling [an FX Aid XL] but it looks like they won't ship to me in the US. Sigh...

It turns out they had an issue with their checkout system, and they do ship worldwide. We got it straightened out and I managed to buy their very last FX Aid XL! I had spent a long time looking and I think I may have been very lucky and got the last one in the world (at least a brand new module from an official retailer). Crazy. Now I'm just hoping it arrives in perfect working order next week 🤞 but I think I found a great replacement for my ALM MFX.

BTW I had emailed Happy Nerding and Igor responded. It sounds like he's hoping they can make a new batch outside the Ukraine in 1-2 months. I hope he can get back on his feet!

Cheers for the various replies - not sure why the static image never updates with changes, but hey.
By way of an update I'd add:
Yes - a bigger case would be great - once I save up :)
re: "Utility" - my terminology, rather than the module definition! I had to put any thin modules in the Behringer case (due to 38mm depth) so that is the main / only criteria for populating it. however it is sequencing, mixing and drums now, so kind-of organised.
I like the vpme.de (for live tweaking) but find managing samples a bit of a pain
I agree re: Disting EX's - I have a MK 4 single one, would consider replacing it for an EX but maybe no further than that.
I love the Befaco, now I've learned how to use it better (see drum comments above)
I got a Pamela's, and already had an MCO voice - getting much better use out of that now (and modulation in general)
Hadn't realised how much I needed the Intellijel mixer either.

@trigmusicnx
I just started spitballing again yesterday. Hehe. Originally I had 5-6 2hp mods only. I've been building, deconstructing and rebuilding as I go. I lean heavily on visualization. The reason I added them was to try to get away from Starlab. It's great to get some advice on this. Much appreciated!

@lugia

Wow. Amazing and thanks! I've seen and read about a few of those modules but never saw most of them. And it looks like so much synergy and interoperability between modules. This gives me so much to chew on. I'm gonna have a lot of fun checking these modules out. Thank you for spending so much time on this!

Do you think I'd benefit from having the Plonk for experimenting with a wide variety of real world sounds? I was a bit impressed by what it's capable of.

I've looked at Beads a lot. Seems like a great module.

Whats the best way to use this build to get string or plucked string sounds?

Edit: OMG. I'm in love with the Stochastic Inspiration Generator!

EDITED May 6th 2022, 15:44

If you're trying to do a small drum machine build here...DON'T. You're far better off with a dedicated drum machine that does more (because it's designed for this purpose) and costs LESS than your efforts here. But to be frank, I don't see what you're aiming for here.

IMHO, having to wrassle with two Disting EXs will be a real chore unless you're all about menu-diving. And a lot of the rest doesn't make sense without context, I would presume.
-- Lugia

heh. yea it is particularly un-focussed. if it was a utility rack as the original poster has labelled it, drop the drums, and why is there a little mikey, when you have a ES9 going off to a computer. surely youll have an audio interface there for recording whatever. furthermore ES9 is way overkill for this little rack too. i would say rethink what it is youre trying to achieve with eurorack.

EDITED May 6th 2022, 10:46

français plus bas.
Hi fam, I previously worked on a µplaits, which is a clone of Mutable Instruments PLAITS, but I found it not very handy : to tiny and the knobs were too sloppy, so I got myself a "real" Plaits. Since a month, I have collected 10 very nice stops on the module and made this video without any artistic pretention, just for the fun. A big thank you to Emilie Gillet for the splendid works and the marvelous modules. I wish her a lot of fun.
Français :
Salut les zamis, j'avais un clone du Plaits de Mutable Instruments, mais je ne le trouvais pas très pratique : Trop étroit et les rotatifs étaient, à mon goût, trop souple. Je me suis donc fendu d'un Plaits original et quel confort ! Depuis un mois, je collecte les bons endroits où je me suis arrêté sur le module. J'en ai collectionné et monté 10, sans prétention artistique, juste pour le fun.

that's what i'm talk'n about .... thanks Trig

sequencing and mixer at the bottom or in the most accessible place. filters off to the sides where i can get at the without vcables getting in the way. important things you dont want to bump like oscillators in the centre under the cable clutter.

basically, stuff you touch often on the sides or bottom.. or accessible in general
-- trigmusicnz

If you're trying to do a small drum machine build here...DON'T. You're far better off with a dedicated drum machine that does more (because it's designed for this purpose) and costs LESS than your efforts here. But to be frank, I don't see what you're aiming for here.

IMHO, having to wrassle with two Disting EXs will be a real chore unless you're all about menu-diving. And a lot of the rest doesn't make sense without context, I would presume.

sequencing and mixer at the bottom or in the most accessible place. filters off to the sides where i can get at the without vcables getting in the way. important things you dont want to bump like oscillators in the centre under the cable clutter.

basically, stuff you touch often on the sides or bottom.. or accessible in general

yea youll always want larger. good advice above

have you actually got the vpme drum voice yet? im not sold on it. so simple...