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Exactly, what Lugia says. If you already have a good baggage of music you listened to, then just let happen what happens on the modular. And listen back. I've been in this sort of feedback loop for half a year or so and people tell me I'm improving, which heavily strokes my ego, and that's much better than Facebook likes. But the main point is this - have fun, listen critically while you're doing it, see if you can tweak things here and there to make it cooler/nicer for yourself, and then listen back to it the days after. You'll find you'll get better at getting a result you like afterwards as well. Not always what you expected, but that's part of the game. And did I say - have fun?

BTW - I liked that jam! If you have something USB equipped like an iPad or a computer, getting a simple audio interface will help the recording quality a lot.

External clock edges nice and square?

I think you have to refresh something to get the thumbnail/jpg to update...

I've always built my tex-mix modules - very easy builds with only panel furniture and headers to add - all smd pre-soldered...

if when you expand - remember to tell Mangu how many modules you have - he'll send you the right ribbon cable for connecting them at the back!

going forward things to look at (ie to add if it was me) would be something like the happy nerding 3*mia (or tiptop miso or mutable shades) and something like mutable kinks (clones are available I believe) or wmd/ssf toolbox (may be unobtanium - may be replaced by a similar wmd module in the future) and maybe a small lfo, if it'll fit...

have fun!!!

@JimHowell1970 SOLD! I never looked at the Tex Mix, but it seems amazing! Love that it's expandable and the price tag is a huge plus! A bit of bleed will certainly not bug me, very used to it:)

(Not sure why the preview doesn't show the updated rack... hahahaha)

EDITED Jul 22nd 2022, 18:21

@JimHowell1970 Thank you much! Would the Mixology do the trick on the mixing/panning? I've gotten to use one a while back and liked it quite a bit. seemed very straight forward. And the Black Output instead of the XOH?

do you really need an output module??? what are you intending to use it for?

I think mixology is kind of large for what it does - if it had a headphone out then maybe, but m'eh - do you need cv panning??? it's pretty easy to patch when you do but takes a couple of vca channels...

personally I really like the tesseract tex-mix - it's expandable so you can add 4 mono or 4 stereo channels at a time - has 2 sends (mono) and 2 stereo returns (that can be used as a stereo send/return) and a headphone output... it might have a slightly higher noise floor and a tiny bit of bleed, but to be honest I don't really notice - there might be a bit of bleed on the sends when the channel is muted, but considering the price (really quite inexpensive) I really don't care... vcas on all the mono channels, manual pan on all the channels - main mix and cue mix... also has (iirc pre-fader) direct output expanders available... I go straight from the main modular level outputs into a cheap 10+ year old Yamaha mixer and from there into my main monitors - works great...

4mono channels, 4stereo channels and a master section will take up 34hp - but will probably cost less than 200 of whatever major currency you use - and you can do autopanning if needs be with the vcas and a lfo (or envelope) and inversion and offset and you get a headphone output included

btw - complaints from people about bleed may be because they are used to pristine DAW mixers - idk, but @Lugia and I had a big discussion about this in a previous thread - neither of us could care less about a bit of bleed - most 'classic' albums from the 60s through the 90s and probably into the 2000s have bleed all over them - definitely anywhere there's a microphone used - in some cases the bleed is a feature (planes flying overhead, cars parking outside, dogs barking etc etc) - adds character, if you know what I mean

I don't want to copy the sound. But he is very creative with those modules and it's interesting for me. I prefer a more contribution comment. Thank you anyway.
-- FidlB

to some extent trying to copy someone else's sound can be a valuable part of the learning process... just as playing other people's music can be too!

btw saw your post on modwiggler - no "hate" here... but I do "hate" the hyperbolic use of the word "hate"!!! hehehe

@JimHowell1970 Thank you much! Would the Mixology do the trick on the mixing/panning? I've gotten to use one a while back and liked it quite a bit. seemed very straight forward. And the Black Output instead of the XOH?

@jb61264 I'm fine with some menu diving, especially as it seems to have some good tutorials around! Thanks for that!

@jb61264 Oh man, the DistingEX got my attention! hahahaha
-- GideonFalls

Its very powerful but be warned if you don't like to navigate menu's it may not be the module for you. I love it, it adds so much flexibility and capability to my setup. Actually (IMO) for someone just starting to put together a case, its probably one of the better modules to get early on...as you learn different functions, you find those that you really want/need in your setup and buy a dedicated module for it, then DistingEX can be changed to do other things and the cycle continues as you build out your system. Good manuals/tutorials make it pretty easy to learn/use. If you don't mind navigating a menu system in a module, its a great add.

any news on this?
-- neykes

available at schneidersladen (Germany) as well
https://schneidersladen.de/de/vpme-qex-quad-drum-expander

I'll let you know how it all comes together. I am not too worried if things aren't perfect first go. I'll just pull the unhappy module out and stick it somewhere else in the future.

In the same vein, I'll go with the A-138D, and pick up something with two channels if I need it down the track. I'm in no particular rush.

With regard to DAWs, it looks like Bitwig might be the best option (that I currently own). Otherwise I might need to buy something like Silent Way for use in VCV. I also have Cherry Audio's Voltage Modular and Softube's Modular - maybe they work? I'd have to take a look.

Ok, great! The A-183-3 fits into the space that I have available, which is a good sign. My rack now looks like this:

nb it looks like that works to me but I have no experience of it - 4 * gain from line level should work ok, you might want to do some further research - please report back...

I have to say, it feels a lot better than it did before. I better understand the purpose of each modules in there now.

good that's an important step...

In my searching, I also came across the ADDAC 200PI. How does that compare to the Doepfer A-138D? I am guessing that the 138D is the better option, with the attenuation and amp, versus simply having two loops available.

you also get crossfading with the a-138d
the 200pi will just do a basic modular to instrument (pedal) level and back
so it's a toss-up - crossfading and gain control vs 2 channels and external gain control (if needed) either from pedals or in rack

As for DAWs, I primarily use either Reaper or Studio One, but also have the light versions of Ableton and Bitwig.
-- cj18

ok bitwig handles cv natively I think, not so sure about the others - I know the full on studio version of Ableton does, but is expensive - which is why I got Logic instead (mostly just use it as a tape recorder and mixdown, but also wanted video in DAW for scoring to picture) - otherwise there are plugins - including vcv rack, that will work with the cv outs of your audio interface

Jitter is fully counterclockwise

Maybe double check the Jitter setting?

Ok, great! The A-183-3 fits into the space that I have available, which is a good sign. My rack now looks like this:

EDIT: it keeps showing the old pic only, so I had to break the link:

https://www.modulargrid net/e/racks/view/1766572

I have to say, it feels a lot better than it did before. I better understand the purpose of each modules in there now.

In my searching, I also came across the ADDAC 200PI. How does that compare to the Doepfer A-138D? I am guessing that the 138D is the better option, with the attenuation and amp, versus simply having two loops available.

As for DAWs, I primarily use either Reaper or Studio One, but also have the light versions of Ableton and Bitwig.

EDITED Jul 22nd 2022, 13:04

It still needs some work on the mixing tbh...

plaits is dual mono (you could use the dtm to mix these before the filter)
wasp is mono
disting ex can be used as a sound source - as either (depending on what you are using it for) mono, dual mono or stereo
the 3 effects you have - beads, fx aid & magneto are all stereo (all can do mono to stereo)
the output is stereo

nb most vcos are mono

so you could do with a panning mixer (vc or not) and a stereo in/stereo out mixer... I know XOH has 2 stereo channels in, but I'm not convinced that's enough - wouldn't be for me

also you probably don't need a buffered mult... mostly needed for copying pitch information - but bloom has 2 outs - and you only have a single vco...

Hi all. I'm having problems with my cara getting synced right in time when I sync it to an external clock.Well it syncs but with a latency that lets it play a little bit too late. Any ideas about that? Are you have the same issue?

Perhaps a Doepfer A-138s as a stereo input for soft synths? They are a good price at the moment.

no, it's not an amplifier... possibly this: https://www.modulargrid.net/e/doepfer-a-183-3

EDIT: actually, it appears that I'd need an Expert Sleepers module. Is that correct? I can send cv from my Presonus Q2626, but it seems that I'd need as ES module to receive it?

no you don't need a ES module to receive it... check the voltage range though! you might want to amplify...

which DAW are you using?

https://cdn.modulargrid.net/img/racks/modulargrid_1984264.jpg?1658476104

EDITED Jul 22nd 2022, 07:48

Thank you so much for the help!

@JimHowell1970 I absolutely see what you're saying! I took the DPO out as I think it might just be a bit "much" and did the same by replacing the filter. The DTM also sounds great, thanks for that. Took your advice on the Pamela too, I've only ever messed around with the Tempi but heard from people that they really like Pamela.
I was looking at the Mantis actually and it's great to hear that they hold up! They look great and the price point is a real plus :)

@jb61264 Oh man, the DistingEX got my attention! hahahaha

EDITED Jul 22nd 2022, 07:46

EDITED Feb 27th 2023, 07:33

Thanks for all of the really useful advice. I will keep in mind the 'one module for one purpose' rule!

Perhaps a Doepfer A-138s as a stereo input for soft synths? They are a good price at the moment.

EDIT: actually, it appears that I'd need an Expert Sleepers module. Is that correct? I can send cv from my Presonus Q2626, but it seems that I'd need as ES module to receive it?

This is getting confusing...

EDITED Jul 22nd 2022, 05:42

Thanks for the info, Jim.

I am going to buy the Doepfer A-138d, but wonder if I should buy the Addac 301B in addition. I get the sense that they will both be useful. Thoughts?

yes the a-138d for effects pedal interface, the addac 301b for expression pedal interface (which will allow you to control the modular with your foot!)

I like the wet/dry dial on the ALM SBG, but the 1/4 jack just speak to me a bit more :)

Aside from that, the Veils module looks like a winner. I have a software version of it somewhere, but the physical one still seems worthwhile. I'd always planned to pick up the set of Mutable modules, when finances permitted.

good luck and hurry up - new ones are getting more and more difficult to find!!!

I should be able to run my soft synths from my AI into the A-138d in my modular setup, shouldn't I? If not, what is the best route, as I have yet to try connecting them.

maybe - but a lot of soft synths really want stereo inputs - depending on your audio interface... spare channels etc etc

veils will amplify up to 4 channels - but then you don't get to use it as a vca - consider a dedicated stereo (or more) audio input or amplifier if you are doing this a lot

I actually have the A-119, so it is good to hear that it is a worthwhile module! I am thinking that the A-119 as my guitar input and the A-138d for my pedals should be compliamentary. And I am going to try out that pedal. For $40 it is worth a shot!

this is what I have (plus a strymon aa.1) and they are definitely complimentary

the pedal @Lugia mentioned is great for plugging into the addac 301b though, as it's an expression pedals - I use old roland/boss ones - as I had them lying around

If/when I get around to putting more I/O modules into my setup (as it grows), I'll remember your advice on having them separate. I was attracted to having them all in one module for space/efficiency, but will now consider just an output.
-- cj18

this kind of also applies to all things in modular - better to have a single module do a single thing as much as possible!!

Yeah, that makes sense. The Batumi seems more like a bread and butter LFO while the Ochd seems like something nice and compact that can provide some easy movement for patches.

I'm thinking about this now as a starting point (or probably even more minimal to begin with) instead of what I originally posted but we'll see. I still have to do a little more research and take everyone's feedback into consideration, I think. Thanks again.

Thanks for the info, Jim.

I am going to buy the Doepfer A-138d, but wonder if I should buy the Addac 301B in addition. I get the sense that they will both be useful. Thoughts?

I like the wet/dry dial on the ALM SBG, but the 1/4 jack just speak to me a bit more :)

Aside from that, the Veils module looks like a winner. I have a software version of it somewhere, but the physical one still seems worthwhile. I'd always planned to pick up the set of Mutable modules, when finances permitted.

I should be able to run my soft synths from my AI into the A-138d in my modular setup, shouldn't I? If not, what is the best route, as I have yet to try connecting them.

Lugia, thanks.

I actually have the A-119, so it is good to hear that it is a worthwhile module! I am thinking that the A-119 as my guitar input and the A-138d for my pedals should be compliamentary. And I am going to try out that pedal. For $40 it is worth a shot!

If/when I get around to putting more I/O modules into my setup (as it grows), I'll remember your advice on having them separate. I was attracted to having them all in one module for space/efficiency, but will now consider just an output.

Mmmm...I don't know about that. There was a lot of buzz around the Ochd when it came out and for several months after, but I never bought into that because, when you examine it, it's just a single LFO with octave stepped frequency multipliers.

Now, if you want an LFO that has multiple outs AND which can be a real treat, look into quadrature LFOs and such. In those, you have a single frequency control just like the Ochd, but what you have for outputs are offset by specific phase angles.

Let's say you want a modulation signal that falls at the exact same rate as another one that rises. Doing this with most any other LFO will be a real PITA...but with something that has a quadrature output, you just take the "fall" from your 0-degree out, and the "rise" from the 180-degree one. And of course, these have other phase angle outputs; usually the simplest quadrature devices output 0-degree and 90-degree phase angles, but you can easily wrangle the 180 and 270-degree outs via a couple of CV inverters. That Batumi, for instance, can have all four LFOs in a quadrature configuration. Doepfer also has a very useful quadrature LFO, their A-143-9, which outputs all of the right-angle signals simultaneously.

@Lugia Sounds like utilities/modulations sources are the way to go with the limited space I have. When I first saw you recommended After Later DVCA I was a bit surprised as I already have the Quad VCA. But just last night I noticed I was using all 4 VCAs and now see how the additional 2 on the DVCA would be useful.

...thereby demonstrating the modular synth truism that "You can never have too many VCAs".

re: the 4ms Listen I/O, this looks useful but I probably will not use the input as the only thing I really use my rack with is the sq-1 or a Neutron. But I like the output as I use headphones so I'm considering the PICO output as it is only 3hp and has the output which I could use if I ever decide to record anything. Right now I'm just using a cheap headphone attenuator plugged into my VCA with my headphones.

-- sndbyte

Another consideration would be Happy Nerding's new version of their Isolator. 4 hp, balanced 1/4" outs plus a headphone preamp, a stereo ganged master pot, and transformers. I mentioned this elsewhere today, but the upshot there is that transformers do plenty of stuff...they block DC from getting into your monitoring chain (which you REALLY don't want!), they keep induced crud and ground loops under control, and just like other transformers, you can hit them harder and you get this nice, euphonious saturation that can punch up sounds (especially in the lower octaves). Wins all around.

So for the MMG by Make Noise, could it cause this type of issue if you passed an AC signal to the DC input?

-- jb61264

no it's potentially the other way round - using the DC input to add DC to the AC signal...

-- JimHowell1970

Right. The usual culprit there is DC offset voltages finding their way onto the audio signals. In some cases, you might want that, but you DON'T want DC getting out of the modular, which can easily result in the above video atrocity. Even Uli didn't go with that on B's 2600, despite the ARP 2600 having that. Uli left it on the 3.5 mms, but the TRS 1/4" jacks are AC-coupled. This is one of the main reasons why I toss in one of Happy Nerding's Isolators on builds that I do, since that module also acts as a DC block (transformers no habla DC), allowing NO DC to get past it. Plus, transformers always beef your sound up when you push 'em a little.

Great, thanks! I will not bother with the AI for this build, nor worry about adding another VCO. I'll also have a look at some expression pedals.

My suggestion for the pedals themselves would be these: https://www.amazon.com/Sonicake-Vexpress-Passive-Expression-Effects/dp/B077PVVC38/ref=sr_1_6?crid=2WEX4FP0MNCKW&keywords=sonicake&qid=1658450499&sprefix=sonicake%2Caps%2C94&sr=8-6 I got one of these during the epic bout of pedal acquisition, figuring it was decent enough to use with my lap steel. Boy, was I surprised! It's built really well, takes up much less pedalboard space than the usual expression pedals, and it sounds smooth as silk...no weird pot jumps or crackles, and yes, it's all metal. No plastic case for these. But the killer thing is the price: $40!

Yeah, yeah...I know, Chinese pedal. Just try it.

1) when would an AI module be useful?

Input modules - if you are always using inputs and want to free up other amplification channels...

-- JimHowell1970

Also, it's generally a good idea to get an external audio input module that has an envelope follower. With that, you not only can preamp your instrument levels, but you can have a threshold-dependent gate output (comparator, basically) and the all-important EF itself, which extracts level information from your external signal and turns that into a CV signal for modulating all sorts of things. However, I think the Intellijel version is sort of lacking inasmuch as you've got both the input AND output on the same module, and that'll have a higher potential for cable snarling right around your build's I/O. Instead, use separate input and output modules, and I strongly suggest putting the input (I recommend the Doepfer A-119, actually) at the end of your oscillators, and treating it just like any old audio signal source (albeit with the added EF and comparator).

And then there's that Sonicsmith module that contains a pitch to voltage converter. P-V converters can be very fussy and troublesome (and WILL NOT put up with chords...monophonic lines ONLY), but if you were using something that's not a guitar (winds, f'rinstance). This was a huge part of the failure of Korg's X-911 "guitar synthesizer"...people couldn't wrap their heads around not being able to play chords, and when you do that with the X-911, the glitching becomes EPIC. But c. 1980...mmmm, not so much.

Thanks, everyone. I'll have to check out the utility modules that Nick mentioned. The Ochd looks really interesting and handy. Probably hard to go wrong having both that and Batumi down the line. The FXAid you mentioned also seems like a good idea, especially to start out. And I'll have to check out the chaos modules you mentioned, as well.

Lot to consider and I appreciate all the help.

To quote @JimHowell1970 "Utility modules are the inexpensive, dull polish that makes the expensive, shiny modules actually shine!!! sound sources < sound modifiers < modulation sources < utilities

Maybe look at something like Frap Tools 321, SSF Toolbox, CVilization, maybe Ornament & Crime, or DistingEX

-- jb61264

hahaha - or just look at the signature above!!!

To quote @JimHowell1970 "Utility modules are the inexpensive, dull polish that makes the expensive, shiny modules actually shine!!! sound sources < sound modifiers < modulation sources < utilities

Maybe look at something like Frap Tools 321, SSF Toolbox, CVilization, maybe Ornament & Crime, or DistingEX

all good advice from Nick there

I'd point out that ochd isn't really synchable - which may or may not be an issue for you!

it's ok as a start - but I think you need more modulation sources and utility modules, for balance and variety... see my signature for some hints in that direction!!

re utilities: more mixing - for both modulation and audio + panning for audio would be good (could be handled with more vcas), which you might also find you need... I like matrix mixers for modulation sources - put 4 copies of 4 in and get 4 more related, but different modulation sources out - I'd also consider some basic sub-mixers - possibly something based on the moog cp3 (manhatten analog for example)

I'd consider replacing the Tempi with Pamela's New Workout - better for modulation purposes that tempi.. and smaller learning curve (no pain in the ass button combos) but there is a simple menu structure instead - and it will add some useful things in there - basic logic, pulse width manipulation, different waveforms etc that I'm not sure tempi does

you might also want to look at a simpler filter - they're always handy to have - doepfer make some good inexpensive takes on classic filter topologies - the sem and wasp are particular favourites...

I'd also be tempted to get something like the fx aid pro, or xaoc timisazora instead of the noise engineering effect module - more variety more easily...

6u case is a good starting point - Mantis is a great case!!!

I'd go slowly at first though - get the minimum that you think for a single voice... and don't forget some stackcables...

EDITED Jul 21st 2022, 20:42

"I was mostly concerned about utility/basic type modules and if I was missing anything obvious that would work well and compliment what I had in the case already, or just general essentials. Or if what I had didn't make any sense at all."

In that case, a few additional comments:
-- I find something like 4ms SISM or Tiptop MISO to be essential in almost any rack. Control signals so often need scaling and offset, and its great to be able to blend them in some way.
-- Intellijel Triplatt or something like that is another great utility to have; low in $s and HP, very useful.
-- for mixing, IMO there's a lot of options, and none of them are perfect, they are almost always bigger than I would like, and missing something I need or including something I don't need. IMO the main questions for mixing are i) how many channels do you need to mix ii) do you need stereo or not. I will be getting some Mixups when possible, but it may not be possible for a while. I would suggest the Doepfer Narrow Mixer (mono) if all you need is mono, as it is low HP and $s and will suit many basic needs.
-- lastly, I would put Instruo Ochd on your radar if it isn't already. I have Batumi and Ochd, Ochd offers lots more LFO signal in a small package. IMO Ochd offers a lot of bang for buck to get a patch moving musically.

Good luck, enjoy!

The pedal interface won't work very well - as it reduces the volume to instrument level, which is considerably slower than line level... which is what the 804 will pump out... and you'd still need some sort of audio interface to connect to the iPhone (see below)

the other massive advantage with the 804 is that you only need a single dumb cable - which is a 3.5mm trrs (both ends) cable which shouldn't cost that much...

Any usb compliant audio interface will also work, whether in rack or out... although you'll only get stereo recording - and you'd need a usb to lightning converter dongle and the relevant usb cable - I use one of these with my es8, when I can find the dongle!!! the dongle is quite heavy though and it's difficult to get the iPhone to stay still on a tripod!

If you really just want stereo out of modular into an iPhone - I'd think the 804 is the simplest choice - if you want to also be able to use it with a computer, then I'd consider an usb interface with more channels (both in and out) and getting the dongle for the iPhone...

EDITED Jul 21st 2022, 20:26

Hi all,

I'm looking for some help putting together a first rack. Here's a bit of what I'm looking to do:
- I use "classical" and semi modular synths but this will be my first modular system.
- I'm looking for a 6Ux104HP case so there is space to expand eventually but it stays portable.
- This will largely live away from any DAW, so I'm looking to house FX in the rack.
- I'm looking for a good all around system with which I can produce dark ambient sounds but mainly learn a new way of creating music.

Thank you all so much already for your help and advice :)

I've been looking at the ADDAC804 Audio iInterface as a module to connect my iPhone to my synth for samples. Is anyone familiar with some other options to accomplish this task? Could it be done with the ADDAC200PI Pedal Interface or some other sampler modules?

any news on this?
-- neykes

it is now available at Thomann
https://www.thomann.de/intl/vpme.de_qex.htm

well that's one of the problems with posting on public forums... you don't get to set preferences for the replies you want, you just get what you're given...

looks like someone on Modwiggler tried to identify the modules better... although it's very difficult with partial and obscured photos..

good netiquette (or whatever it's called these days) suggests not posting the same question on multiple forums, at least until you've exhausted the relevant answers on one...

I don't want to copy the sound. But he is very creative with those modules and it's interesting for me. I prefer a more contribution comment. Thank you anyway.

looks like all of them... hehehehe

copying someone else's modular will not get you where they are - the most important and unique part of the modular is the user...

Hello everyone. I'm trying to figure out which doepfer modules are part of the system used by my favorite guitarist. On the left is all of Doepfer and part of the upper right side Analog systems. I'm just trying to figure out the doepfer modules. I'd like to number them left to right starting at the top, and clearly the first case seems to be all vco's with an envelope follower last. Any contribution is welcome. Thank you!

https://modwiggler.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=3796916#p3796916

I put this link because I don't understand how to place the images on this website

Hi Sndbyte, you mentioned being interested in generative sounds but I didn't see much support for that in your rack. If you wanted to go further down that path, maybe sell the Behringers, replace with a mini-Plaits and use the space saved for more generative-friendly modules.

Here's a suggestion rack: You'll need some random for generative. The SSF Ultra Random is discontinued but I got mine off Reverb (with a little patience) or you could get the Wogglebug instead - either gives you lots of options. The Pip Slope EG can be put in cycle mode and is fully CV'able. Missed Opportunities might be random overkill but is there to spice up all the EOCs. The duo Quanitze for making your two voices a little more musical, and a clock/signal modulator so you don't have to over-commit your Maths and use that for other interesting stuff instead.

Beefaco Rampage and Maths share common ancestory... the main advantage of Maths over the Rampage apart from being less cluttered and therefore more ergonomic (which is a very good thing in itself - & don't get me started on the frap tools falistri, for this very reason) though is that there's a lot more documentation available - not only are there a myriad of videos (some of which are very good), but there's also the 'Maths Illustrated Supplement', which has 32 example patches for Maths - great as a basic guide to getting more out of Maths, but even better if you spend the time thinking about the what, why and how of what it's doing and use that as part of building up a modular patching mindset...

As for a mixer... I really like the Tesseract Tex-Mix - it's not perfect, but it's inexpensive and expandable - doesn't have 1/4" outputs (except for the headphone out), but as far as I know very few modular mixers do... if you must have 1/4" outputs, then the befaco output module is decently priced... & if you can wield a soldering iron, both of these are available as DIY kits...

haha, thanks Wubbywubby!

Thanks everyone for the thoughtful feedback. I haven't bought anything yet, so I'll definitely go with a Mantis and not worry about size/expansion/having to pick smaller modules/etc.

I was mostly concerned about utility/basic type modules and if I was missing anything obvious that would work well and compliment what I had in the case already, or just general essentials. Or if what I had didn't make any sense at all.

As far as the Benjolin goes, that seemed like a good option for an out there crazy oscillator for noisy stuff, but I haven't looked at it enough. Maybe I'd be better off going with a simpler 2nd voice/oscillator to start. I'll have to look at it more. Same goes for the Bastl filter. I didn't look at it too closely or get too deep into seeing what other filter options are available. As for the Intellijel Mixup, I wonder if there are better options for a case this size or if there is a mixer with 1/4" outputs? I'll have to look into that more. I know everyone loves MATHS and maybe I should consider that. Befaco Rampage seems like another useful module that I've messed with in VCV Rack. And I'm still really interested in morphagene/ahbar, so I'll have to read other threads as to what people say about how those two compare.

As Jim said, I'll probably buy as few modules as I think I can to start out. Good advice.

Thanks again for all the comments, I appreciate it!

EDITED Jul 21st 2022, 06:24

So for the MMG by Make Noise, could it cause this type of issue if you passed an AC signal to the DC input?

-- jb61264

no it's potentially the other way round - using the DC input to add DC to the AC signal...

Great, thanks! I will not bother with the AI for this build, nor worry about adding another VCO. I'll also have a look at some expression pedals.

addac do a dual expression pedal interface...

I do have a couple of 1/4 to 1/8 cables - I use them between my mixer and AI. The thickness of the cables bothers me, as I am more used to thicker cables :D

yes some can be very thin and plasticy - you can get slightly thicker ones too usually a bit more rubbery like standard guitar cables - I prefer these ones

Two quick questions, if you don't mind...

1) when would an AI module be useful?

Input modules - if you are always using inputs and want to free up other amplification channels...

Output modules - if you get digital clipping when using an audio interface and regular attenuators are not doing the trick / if you are going to play live a lot and need balanced outputs / if you need balanced/isolated outputs because there is noise introduced by the mains power

2) can you recommend any interface modules for pedals?

AI Synthesis, Doepfer, addac, alm sbg

Hi,

A few small suggestions:

-- in smallish cases, it's important to be thoughtful about big-ish modules. Tapographic Delay and Benjolin2 I think merit close attention to alternatives given their (large) size. A small do-it-all FX module (like Happy Nerding's one) could do wonders. And there are a lot of good alternatives for chaos-type modules with great capabilities in smaller HP. Nonlinear Circuits (NLC) Hipster or Sloths are ones I can highly recommend; Joranalogue Orbit is similar to Hypster, but I prefer Hypster. And there's a lot of other NLC units that are worth looking at. I looked at Benjolin a few times but it didn't make sense for me vs. alternatives.

-- I understand you're looking at experimental / ambient / noise. Still, I suggest you don't ignore the value of "basic b$tch" modules which form the core of almost any usable system. Jim and Lugia say basically that much all the time. I will re-emphasize that. Basics with some clever and flexible patching yield perceived complexity. Jim loves CV matrix mixers; I love stuff like Joranalogue Morph4 or sequencing control signals through a switch like Boss Bow2. Net net, I think there's a lot of merit to "focus on a strong (generalist) modular core plus some modules specific to your taste" approach.... That said, I DO see your Doepfer, Intellijel, Xaoc, Pam's, Plaits, and filter module as solid choices that would play well in most systems. Just beware adding too many "specialist" modules in a small case.

-- More generally, I can recommend considering "balance," particularly in a rack that isn't huge. 1/3 of HP devoted to things that make or change sound, 1/3 of HP devoted to control signals and things that modify control signals, and 1/3 of HP dedicated to utilities and some finishing FX. That type of rule of thumb was critical for getting me working modular systems of 240HP and less. Over that HP, assuming there's a solid "core" system, then one can go more buck-wild here or there on specific module types. IMO, it's best to ensure there's a solid "core" system, then add selectively from there.

-- I'm on probably my 8th+ distinct modular setup and I'm still f$cking things up a little. There's a ton to learn in modular. Now, I have a great home rig and a work-in-progress travel rig. Lugia, Jim and a few other forum regulars helped me a lot. Hope you enjoy the process and get a nice system that works for you.

Cheers,

Nicholas