thoughts?

User men_chine is a crook!

This is a warning to alert fellow wigglers about this person.
I paid for a module last month (PP f/f) and then he/she/it disappeared. men_chine is still active on Modulargrid, updates rack layouts etc and the ad is still up for that same module.

With the Maths, you have some possibilities to modulate the envelope. However the Math only has a rise and fall... so basically attack and decay. The Neutron has four stages per envelope. So if you're looking to replicate the Neutron's envelope generators, that might be hard with The Maths module. It will sound different.

To get closer, I would try something like a TipTop Z4000NS. You get CV control over all four stages, plus the "deviator" offset. The Z4000 is a little trickier to use as the deviator and attenuator always come into play. But that's the module I'd pick. The Maths is a good pick, don't get me wrong. But I can see you having an awesome patch on the Neutron then trying to swap out EGs and not being able to replicate the Neutron's envelope with the Maths.

-- Ronin1973

The Z4000NS looks like what i would want from an ADSR env, plus its 8hp and not expensive at all. I might throw it in the rack, but keep Maths as well.

For the output module, why not looking at a mixer+out+headphones out ?
In fine, you might end up with several voices when you'll get another vco
I started with a 4ms listen four and i replaced it by a XOH (with a XPAN before to increase the XOH limited mixer capabilities and save space)
The Quad VCA before the Out will do the job in the first time but as your rack will grow out, the needs of VCAs as well
However listen to the pro, I am still a beginner
-- anglr

When I'll add another VCO i'll need a lot of other modules including more VCAs, a filter or a LPG, maybe envelope generators etc. But that won't happen very soon. I'll be looking at a dedicated mixer then and at the end of the routing i'll always just need some "modular level to line out". I'm also looking at Lifeforms Outs as a cheaper alternative to Intellijel Outs, i have no idea about the sound quality on both modules tho.

EDITED Dec 12th 2019, 12:05

This might be a weird one...

Wondering if there's a module or a way to take my single sine LFO and get the related quadrature outputs?
Is this doable? I figure I just need some sort of fixed phase shifter?

bought a Triatt from @suhovmodular, all good and quick delivery.
sold a Maths to @Cortex, no issues, good buyer.
thanks to both!

For the output module, why not looking at a mixer+out+headphones out ?
In fine, you might end up with several voices when you'll get another vco
I started with a 4ms listen four and i replaced it by a XOH (with a XPAN before to increase the XOH limited mixer capabilities and save space)
The Quad VCA before the Out will do the job in the first time but as your rack will grow out, the needs of VCAs as well
However listen to the pro, I am still a beginner
-- anglr

Finding the right combination of Outs + Headphones + the features you want can be tricky. In my search, it was "not enough channels", "too expensive", "not enough sends", "no mutes", "too big", etc. Those features are nice if you can get them on your mixer. But I wouldn't make them must-haves if you find something that works for you.

Another factor is performance. Some mixers are meant to be set-and-forget. Others were purposely designed with performance in mind. That's something to always consider when buying a module... ergonomics are important if you're going to be playing the module live. Perhaps something not towards the top of the list when you're first starting out. But, something to consider if that's a goal.

Cheers.

Excluding the Mantis that would be around 1600 euros just for the modules. Maths is the most expensive module in this rack but i figure it would provide me with a lot of useful functions for instance sometimes i would like to use it as an external envelope for the Neutron because i can't modulate the ADSR parameters in the neutron.
-- abrupt

With the Maths, you have some possibilities to modulate the envelope. However the Math only has a rise and fall... so basically attack and decay. The Neutron has four stages per envelope. So if you're looking to replicate the Neutron's envelope generators, that might be hard with The Maths module. It will sound different.

To get closer, I would try something like a TipTop Z4000NS. You get CV control over all four stages, plus the "deviator" offset. The Z4000 is a little trickier to use as the deviator and attenuator always come into play. But that's the module I'd pick. The Maths is a good pick, don't get me wrong. But I can see you having an awesome patch on the Neutron then trying to swap out EGs and not being able to replicate the Neutron's envelope with the Maths.

I'll take a deeper look tonight once I convert Euros to Dollars. I'm on the other side of the pond.

EDITED Dec 12th 2019, 00:16

Defragmenteur / All: If I don't want to record via DAW on a computer but just recording (and mastering) without a computer, what would be the best way of doing so? Any recommendations? Currently I am using (as an intermediate solution) a Zoom H5 which is okay for some basic stuff but compared to the shared track here from Exposure, I can "throw away" my H5 ;-) Regarding recording/mastering I have nil experience.

I am afraid I can't help you. Mixing inside my rack is limited. My output is an Intellijel Outs which goes to my sound card input (Focusrite scarlett 8i6) then to my DAW (Reason) for adding end of the chain FX (mostly reverb & compression) and recording. Without individual output for each voice, the result is ok but flat.

EDITED Dec 12th 2019, 13:36

For the output module, why not looking at a mixer+out+headphones out ?
In fine, you might end up with several voices when you'll get another vco
I started with a 4ms listen four and i replaced it by a XOH (with a XPAN before to increase the XOH limited mixer capabilities and save space)
The Quad VCA before the Out will do the job in the first time but as your rack will grow out, the needs of VCAs as well
However listen to the pro, I am still a beginner

Hi Defragmenteur and Exposure,

Defragmenteur: Thank you very much for sharing those links, that's very helpful! I will look for quiet moments to read those entirely.

Exposure: The feedback from Senor-bling to check out the audio input/output modular might be still worth checking though; at least for my setup I will have a closer look at that.

Another thought is the audio interface, any issues there perhaps?

Defragmenteur / All: If I don't want to record via DAW on a computer but just recording (and mastering) without a computer, what would be the best way of doing so? Any recommendations? Currently I am using (as an intermediate solution) a Zoom H5 which is okay for some basic stuff but compared to the shared track here from Exposure, I can "throw away" my H5 ;-) Regarding recording/mastering I have nil experience.

Thank you very much in advance and kind regards, Garfield.

Thanks for your insight toodee! Definitely looking into effects modules, Intellijel has a nice little 1U reverb for example which I'm eyeing. I've heard of the Mimeophon, but have not watched any videos about it, will check it out.

Saw some Morphagene videos and was very impressed by it! Still ruminating on the 4ms STS vs. Morphagene vs. Nebulae v2 battle. But leaning towards the 4ms STS has two channels which would add great flexibility in my view. I've seen a guy use it in a "DJ metaphor" set up, basically with samples of full songs and manipulating live, super interesting (check it out here: ).

Any ideas for sequencing? I really would like to sequence the Chord V2 but the Mother32 sequencer is quite finicky in this context as it outputs -5/5 v. I've been offsetting it with my quadratt but tracking is a bit wonky.

Would love to see your rig and/or some stuff you've done!

Cheers,
D

Excluding the Mantis that would be around 1600 euros just for the modules. Maths is the most expensive module in this rack but i figure it would provide me with a lot of useful functions for instance sometimes i would like to use it as an external envelope for the Neutron because i can't modulate the ADSR parameters in the neutron.

@nosp is great. Very straight forward purchase and easy to chat things through with. Thank you!

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Thank you very much for your help. I'll take some time to really understand what direction to take with my rack.

I took the endorphins BLCK NOIR out for now and put in a 6 channel mixer. I wanted to use the LFO to add it to my MicroBrute synth. I also added a few different effects onto this one. It is a lower cost but still similar around 2k. I know it will be more expensive no matter what I just really want to get into modular and specifically modular drum machines.

(EDIT) I just made this small rack to see how it would look with the Endorphins. If this has everything I need in terms of a mixer, output, and some drums it might be a smaller and cheaper solution.

EDITED Dec 11th 2019, 04:23

just a concept for my future rack

Hi there !
I'm probably as much a noob as you are, given that I only have a few months with Eurorack.
That being said, if I was given your rack I would probably think about adding an effect module or 2, especially if you plan on using the input on that 1U module to get some external sound sources into your rack. Which one is entirely a question of choice. I'm having a lot of fun with the Make Noise Mimeophon, but it's just an example. For anything ambient, I'd say one would probably need a decent reverb, but again, that's just my very small experience making the occasional ambient patch on my system.
For working with samples, I haven't tested either of those but I've heard good things about 1010 Music's BitBox and the Morphagene by Make Noise, 2 very different takes on sampling. Again, it all depends on what you would like to go for, just throwing you a few more ideas to look at while waiting for more experienced posters.
Hope this helps anyway ;)
D.

Attenuators/Attenuverters are nice to have. Some CV inputs don't have pots built in to them so while you can plug a modulation source into them, you don't have a direct way to control the amount of CV.

The Maths module can handle attenuverting for you. Channels 2 and 3 are dedicated towards that if you take the direct output of 2 or 3 at the bottom of Maths. You can also buy dedicated modules for attenuverting such as the Befaco Attenuverter that offer more features (like offset). The Maths can replicate this function, via the "sum" output, but it's convoluted using the Maths.

I think this rack is good to go as far as exploration. I would get in some time with the rack before adding anything else. What to add next depends on the direction you want to go in.

Thanks for sharing defragmenteur, this links will be really helpful!

Ok thank you I’ll look into those modules. So other than a mixer do you feel something important or usefull is missing in my rack?

The Rene is a sequencer as far as I know. Some mixers that might work would be the Pittsburgh Modular Lifeforms, The Roland 531, Happy Nerding Pan Mix.

Hello Ronin1973 thank you for your feedback. For sequencing I also have a keystep (and a novation circuit that can be used via midi with 0coast). I would like to add a mn rené and as you suggest a second mixer. I am a noob but I have a lot of fun even if I have no exotic modules :) Thank you!

Hi all, newbie here. Here's what I have so far, I've had some good fun with it so far but would love some ideas on how to fill out the rest of my case. Leaning more towards an ambient/post-rock-ish rig but a "complete" or versatile rack would be nice.

I am also strongly considering the 4ms STS as sampling recordings, manipulating them and building off of that sounds like great fun. Any advice welcome!

Cheers

You mentioned budget. What is your entire budget for your initial build excluding the Mantis? You'll probably add more later. But what's the budget to get-going?

I'd add a second mixer like a Blue Lantern Stereo Sir-Mix-A-Lot. The A138 is a 4 input mono mixer.

Modules that have stereo outs:
Clouds
Erbe-Verb
Morphagene
Rings (not stereo but even and odd harmonics)

The Mix-A-Lot has 6 mono inputs (with pan) and two stereo returns. Your A-138 can be used for mono sub-mixing or mixing CV signals.

Your only source of sequencing is the tiny Erica module. Will that be enough?

Before you start... some considerations:
Eurorack percussion set-ups are insanely expensive compared to buying a drum machine that can sync or receive input from Eurorack. There's nothing wrong with doing percussion in Eurorack... it's just going to cost a pretty penny.

Let's work from the end and work our way backwards.

You'll need an output module that can deliver a stereo line-level (not Eurorack level) output.
You'll need a mixer for all of your percussion inputs. It's best to have one that is stereo and has at least one send for reverb or effects. The Endorphins has a mono sum mixer for its internal sounds... but if you use it, then whatever is in that module is a mix of percussion and has to be treated as a whole.

You'll need a way of triggering your drum modules (Eloquencer will work nicely).

With that... your set-up is missing a main mixer. You'll need a minimum of four inputs. More if you want the individual outs of the Endorphins.

LFOs are useful. But how do you intend to use it in this set-up?
The FH2 will work as an alternative to the Eloquencer if you're working with a DAW. However, the FH2 has to be set-up in advance of the DAW as the FH2 doesn't like to be addressed by the browser GUI and your DAW at the same time. So to change the FH2's settings you'll have to quit out of your DAW.

This set-up is about $2,000 - $3,000US. If you use an off-the-shelf MIDI drum machine with a Befaco VCMC to translate from CV to MIDI you'll spend a whole lot less. If the drum machine can respond to MIDI CC the VCMC can translate from CV to MIDI CV.

Consider your options carefully.

Cheers for the suggestions, Temps Utile was suggested in another thread and it looks like a whole lot of fun :)

Fantastic resource, thanks for sharing @defragmenteur !

Yes, some FX and a modulation source would definitely improve the setup. I'm not really enjoying the factory delay in the Neutron and i find myself in situations where i could use another LFO.
For a stereo line-level output would something like Intellijel Outs do the job? Here's what i came up with for starters, removed some modules because of budget limitations.
As for the casing, I'm looking at Tip Top Mantis.

EDITED Dec 10th 2019, 15:16

• 1 on this!

• 1 on this

Hello this is my rack. What would you add/remove from here? (28hp left)
Please consider that outside the rack I also have a mn 0coast
dreadbox echo and A118 are the two candidates to be sold (or not?)
Also sorry for my poor english.
Thank you for your help

Mastering and mixing for modular

Mastering for Modular
https://www.noiseengineering.us/blog/2018/12/19/mastering-for-modular

Mixing for Modular: the Long-Awaited Prequel to That Other Thing
https://www.noiseengineering.us/blog/2019/1/4/mixing-for-modular-the-long-awaited-prequel-to-that-other-thing

Mixing for Modular 2: This Time it’s Digital
https://www.noiseengineering.us/blog/2019/1/4/mixing-for-modular-2-this-time-its-digital

Hey GarfieldModular,

Thanks for the kind words. To be honest, I’ve never thought of the muddiness as an issue with the gear but as a lack of knowledge when mixing or equalising. Anyway, I’m using Befaco cables which I guess are fine and shouldn’t add any noise or muddiness to the sound.

Senor-bling I’m happy to see I’m not alone in this and you could clearly identify the issue. You certainly described it better than I did, muffled sound and missing crispness, yes.

I’m currently using a semi-modular Minibrute 2s as an output, so my modular’s VCA output is going to the Minibrute’s master input. From there it goes to the Focusrite audio interface and to the computer via USB.

In the computer I record using Reaper and amplify / compress the final mix in Audacity. My guess Is I’m doing something wrong in the DAW, but I’m not sure what. However, it is completely possible that the Minibrute is adding that character to the sound too.

I’ll be adding an out module to my system soon, I guess that would allow me to check if that muddiness is being added in the Minibrute or in the DAW. Let’s see if we can figure this out.

Thanks for the replies

Eurorack on perfect circuit
I have a volca kick and was wondering, can I use the volca to trigger sequences within the eloquencer?
If this is possible I might switch out the Befaco Kickall for an Oscilloscope to use with the Microbrute.

So I'm new to eurorack and I wanted to make an EDM drum machine/ sequencer rack with an additional lfo to use with my arturia MicroBrute. I know I could get something like an MPC but I really like the look and feel of modular. Let me know if this rack makes sense or if I am missing any key components for this Rack Drum Machine to work. I've also added a Midi to CV input in case I want to control drums with a midi keyboard or for the future if I have another synth. I do think it has a bit more than just midi to cv such as clock dividing. Currently I am within the constraints of 104hp as I chose a make noise skiff powered rack to put it in. I do like this size but if more functions are necessary I am willing to get a bigger case.

This is a list of all the modules. Any suggestions and assistance is much appreciated.

Winter Modular Eloquencer- 38hp
Befaco Kickall- 6hp
Erica Synths Snare- 10hp
Erica Synths Hi-Hat- 10hp
Endorphins Drum Synthesizer- 30hp
Expert Sleepers FH-2 Factotum USB MIDI Host + MIDI-CV- 8hp
LFO- 2hp

EDITED Dec 10th 2019, 05:33

Maths can do this right now.

First look at FM on the new E300

You want to fire off a sequence based on receiving a trigger.

I'm assuming that everything is receiving a clock input so things stay in time.

The Temps Utile can do this for you. You can use the two CV inputs to reset the sequencer with a trigger and if you can generate a gate for the duration of your sequence, you can use it to mute and unmute the sequence.

I think you can do this a number of ways. You could even use a VCA to mute and unmute your sequence even if you're using a basic sequencer that can reset with a trigger.

https://github.com/mxmxmx/temps_utile-/wiki/using-temps_utile

If you want to go from CV to MIDI look at the Befaco VCMC
https://www.modulargrid.net/e/befaco-vcmc

I've purchased from @zucker a number of times recently. He is very helpful and friendly. Delivery was quick, packaging was great, and the items of high quality.

Ricky Tinez has an overview of the Clep Diaz... I know... never ending responses to your post... but there's so much good information out there.

AWESOME! That helps a lot and I wasn't catching any setup doubts but it did prompt me to make sure I was thinking about it correctly. I feel like the Clep Diaz can do some of this work too but I need to get more familiar with it. Thanks so much for responding with this detail!

Right, it is confusing. I'll be sure to double check, although with the current used prices that pretty much evens out anyway I suppose.

The clock/gate question wasn't doubting your set-up. I just wanted to be sure you had some thoughts on where the clock/gate/trigger was coming from.

Clocks work great, but only for rhythms that are constant division (16th notes, 8th notes, etc.).

In the case of your Euclidian module. The clock goes in the clock input and then the output of the Euclidian to the Mimetic. Then you can set your ratios as well as your starting point and the Mimetic will follow the Euclidian module.

You will also want a reset from the Beatstep Pro to both modules. It can be something as simple as a 16th note played every measure, every 2 measures, every four, etc. The reset will make sure that the Euclid and Mimetic always start in the same place and reset so your pattern is consistent and stays that way.

@Ronin1973 thanks for the super helpful questions. I was gong to use the Beatstep pro to send clock and gate info to the Mimetic, but maybe I need to think that through some more. I did toss a 2hp Euclidian generator in the rack too. I 100% agree with the idea that indirect pattern creation can lead to some inspiring ideas. That's what I'm looking for to complicate all the traditional sequencing available on my other devices. Thanks again for the advice.

As far as I can tell.. the rack doesn't come with the AC to DC adapter/transformer.
https://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/HappyEndBK--tiptop-audio-happy-ending-kit-black
Power supply
https://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/ZeusBoost--tiptop-audio-uzeus-boost-mantis-universal-adapter

I could be wrong. I'd check with whatever seller you buy it new from.

Though, the used prices are nice and come with a wall-wart as far as I can tell.
hfQAAOSwubdd6oOF" target="_blank">https://www.ebay.com/itm/Tiptop-Audio-Happy-Ending-Kit-Black-Eurorack-Modular-Kit-with-Power/153752311346?hash=item23cc5a1632hfQAAOSwubdd6oOF

Ohhhhh, I was under the impression that the HEK came with everything I need.

1 x 1000mA Universal power adapter (110-220VAC)

Is that the transformer you're talking about or would I have to buy something in addition to that?

The Happy Ending Kit is a set of rails and the bus with "flying bus boards" (ribbon cables). That gives you a small rack with 10 outlets for 10 modules per kit.

You'll also have to buy their transformer to go from the wall to bus.
http://tiptopaudio.com/happyendingkit/

Since there's no back to the rack then depth shouldn't be an issue. If you have more than 10 modules, I would read up on how to power more than 10 modules with this (what's safe and what's not).

Be sure to MANUALLY double check your power needs as MG doesn't always have that information for each module. Always leave some headroom in your total amp draw versus what the kit is rated for as your power spikes when you first turn on the rack.