Ideas Machine 3rd Iteration

Okay

Based on Lugia's suggestions I made this.

I reinstated some of the modules from my V1 (eg the DOT and Scales). Yeeees - I know their functions are duplicated elsewhere, but I really really really... really really want to have their specific functions easily to hand. Also it means that if for some reason I find myself without the Arturia Keystep, I still have CV and gate sequencers available.

I swapped out Lugia's suggested filter and oscillators for things that suit my own taste. Taking Lugia's lesson about 'multifunctionality' though, I was able to combine his wavefolder idea with the oscillator modules and at the same time shrink the footprint, thereby making room for a 3rd. I also added a CP3 style mixer. Groooovy!

I swapped many of Lugia's suggested modules with smaller ones with similar or identical functionality. I ditched the Intellijel FX and reinstated my proposed open-ended line level IO. On paper at least, this should function either an extra output bus or FX pedal board loop. I don't know why you guys were so against it haha. Am I missing something? :-P

I found a really cool little master mixer by Endorphin.es to replace the one suggested by Lugia. It connects directly to the Intellijel case's direct outputs on the back. I know the Endorphin.es mixer is totally different to Lugia's suggested one functionally speaking but I think the space gained has paid dividends.

My Concerns/niggles:

• Now is that there is no basic dedicated effects on board. If I want a boring old delay or reverb I'll have to add it down stream or bring it in through the effects loop at the top.

• The CP3 mixer and Nano filter are mono. If I could find solution that does a similar job in stereo, I'd have two fully fledged stereo buses - which would be far more flexible.

• Kinks is taking up a lot of space for the sake of a single min/max gate. If could magically combine the Divkid S+H module with Kinks I'd do it. Any ideas?

• The Omsonic panning mixer is the only uneven HP module so I've got 1 HP of space going to waste. Doh!!! :-P

Thoughts and advice most welcome please

Thanks

x

EDITED Oct 25th 2021, 16:49

Klawis Logica XT is 5hp and might restore parity, but it’s not a straight swap for anything. Basil Ikarie is stereo (and does a lot of cool things) but 8hp. knob.farm Hyrlo is 3x stereo or 6x mono in 4hp, but it won’t overdrive. No easy answers here.

• Kinks is taking up a lot of space for the sake of a single min/max gate. If could magically combine the Divkid S+H module with Kinks I'd do it. Any ideas?

-- rextable

Are you really going to need four sample and hold circuits in a build this small? I would hold off on the DivKid S+H and just use the one in Kinks for now (if you can find a Kinks, that is).
Have fun and good luck!

• Kinks is taking up a lot of space for the sake of a single min/max gate. If could magically combine the Divkid S+H module with Kinks I'd do it. Any ideas?

-- rextable

Are you really going to need four sample and hold circuits in a build this small? I would hold off on the DivKid S+H and just use the one in Kinks for now (if you can find a Kinks, that is).
Have fun and good luck!

-- farkas

I really really really like S+H :-P

...... Not really.....

Fair point. I originally chose the Kinks as an approximate replacement for one of Lucia's suggestions.

Klawis Logica XT is 5hp and might restore parity, but it’s not a straight swap for anything. Basil Ikarie is stereo (and does a lot of cool things) but 8hp. knob.farm Hyrlo is 3x stereo or 6x mono in 4hp, but it won’t overdrive. No easy answers here.
-- plragde

Thanks for the suggestions - I'll investigate them :-)

I'm guessing you are intending to use the rample for percussion and then have 2 voices - the instruo oscs (as 1 voice) and the atom (which if it was me I would replace with a mutable rings - which would reduce the trimmers and improve ergonomics)

not sure I would want 3 identical oscillators either - I can see the point of 2, fat detuned bassline, but you could easily drop one and then fit in an effects unit such as fx aid xl (variety and ergonomics again!) whic would address your point 1

point 2: most eurorack modules are mono so I'd keep as much as possible mono until final mix stage and the dtm is a great little sub-mixer, as it can be overdriven easily to add a bit of grit - which might sit nicely with the instruo oscs - plus you need sub-mixers to mix the instruo oscs (if you are going to use them in a mono-voice anyway) before sending the signal to a filter) - I'd consider dumping the q-mix and replacing it with a wavefolder of some sort

point 3: personally I'd only need one s&h in this size case - I'd drop the divkid before kinks - the rectifier section is very useful!

point 4: I'd remove the ALA DVCA and the panning mixer and patch my own using a mutable veils instead - both panning and crossfading are easy to patch with cascading vcas!!!

I'd probably also replace the atom with mutable rings - better ergonomics and a bit smaller - not a big fan of the tall trimmers which you seem to have a lot of

this would free up a bit of space which I would keep free - you'll inevitably reach for a specific function at some point and not have it, so need a little space to add it in later

I'm guessing you are intending to use the rample for percussion and then have 2 voices - the instruo oscs (as 1 voice) and the atom (which if it was me I would replace with a mutable rings - which would reduce the trimmers and improve ergonomics)

not sure I would want 3 identical oscillators either - I can see the point of 2, fat detuned bassline, but you could easily drop one and then fit in an effects unit such as fx aid xl (variety and ergonomics again!) whic would address your point 1

-- JimHowell1970

I want to play 3-tone paraphonic chords on a keyboard...... And as I type this I realise there's no way for me to allocate the notes. Bugger! I knew I had Intellijel's Shifty module in there for a reason. Where am I gonna fit that

Hmmmm, back to the drawing board.....

Right, have made considerable compromises for the sake of being able to play actual paraphonic chords actually on an actual keyboard (the whole reason those three Instrou oscs are there in the first place).

Rings was a good shout - thanks. I do prefer the sound of Elements but Rings will have to do. The version of Rings I've chosen - just so it'll all fit - looks like it might be somewhat of an ergonomic compromise compared to the original. Does anyone have any experience with this module?

If I give up on the paraphonic-chord-playing-on-a-keyboard-like-a-regular-hoomon idea, I could ditch the Shifty and one of the Instrou modules - which would free up a huuuge chasm of HP and make life far more simple. :-P

Oh to paraphony or not to paraphony...

On the upside, I did manage to fit in a Disting Mk4 which solves - among other things - the lack of basic effects.

EDITED Oct 25th 2021, 21:32

I ditched the paraphonic analog synth idea and took your advice to leave space :-)

• x2 intruo modules + CP3 filter + nano filter = voice for bass and general analog shizle

• rings + Beads = modern digital voice and/or sound mangling.

• DOT + Rample + Qmix = drums/percussion/stereo-sample-playback voice

• top right corner (UPE, Zagrzeb and Cockpit modules) = master section connected directly to the Intellijel case's built in outputs.

• Two further line level inputs and outputs along the top + Qmix = second bus for external FX loop or sub mix outs.

• Morphogene = further sound mangling

• Main sequencer will be an Arturia Keystep Pro

• Everything from Pams all the way to Disting Mk4 = utilities and control

shifty will not give you paraphony!!! it is a shift register - 1 cv and 1 gate in, for example, when the gate goes high and there are no notes in the system the note will be sent to output 1, when the gate goes high again the original note will be moved to output 2 and the new note (whatever is at the cv input) will be sent to output 1, when the gate goes high again the original note will be sent to output 3 etc

the last iteration looks better - I think it's a really good idea to ditch the paraphony at least in a 1st case - in order to reduce complexity - if you still want polyphony/paraphony then you may find a digital polyphonic keyboard works quite well alongside a modular

dtm (which you keep calling by it's old name before moog sued - cp3) is a mixer not a filter

I don't think it's a great idea to think in such rigid terms about what things do... rings has some great bass tones in it... and I'm sure those instruo modules can do some nice leads!

if you are going to use a keytep pro as your primary 'way to play' then you might find you don't need a midi->cv module...

I'd go slowly though and pick 4 or 5 of the modules that you think would play well together and get those to start with adn learn them inside out before getting anymore - you will probably change 30%+ of what you have here once you

shifty will not give you paraphony!!! it is a shift register - 1 cv and 1 gate in, for example, when the gate goes high and there are no notes in the system the note will be sent to output 1, when the gate goes high again the original note will be moved to output 2 and the new note (whatever is at the cv input) will be sent to output 1, when the gate goes high again the original note will be sent to output 3 etc

the last iteration looks better - I think it's a really good idea to ditch the paraphony at least in a 1st case - in order to reduce complexity - if you still want polyphony/paraphony then you may find a digital polyphonic keyboard works quite well alongside a modular

dtm (which you keep calling by it's old name before moog sued - cp3) is a mixer not a filter

I don't think it's a great idea to think in such rigid terms about what things do... rings has some great bass tones in it... and I'm sure those instruo modules can do some nice leads!

if you are going to use a keytep pro as your primary 'way to play' then you might find you don't need a midi->cv module...

I'd go slowly though and pick 4 or 5 of the modules that you think would play well together and get those to start with adn learn them inside out before getting anymore - you will probably change 30%+ of what you have here once you

-- JimHowell1970

Ha - I reread what I typed. I really did mean 'mixer' not 'filter.' I might be a bit daft but I'm not an irretrievable moron :-D

regarding the Shifty. I read somewhere (don't ask me where) that Shifty could be used as for voice allocation, which with judicious patching could be made to approximate paraphonic playing. However, following discussion with others I dropped the idea because it was just too much of a pain.

Yes - rigid thinking + modular = a bit pointless. My description for the last iteration was to give some context to my decisions on module choice for the benefit of others. As a starting point I think that's valid but am in complete agreement with you. The whole reason I started down this modular rabbit hole was to explore creative free form patching for idea generation. I reckon this system is heading in the right direction for that purpose. Its price tag - around £5000 - is pretty compelling in my view too. I think you'd struggle to replicate what's in this box with regular hardware for the same money and still have the flexibility/compactness. Correct me if I'm wrong on that :-P

4th iteration incoming :-)

EDITED Oct 26th 2021, 22:05

4th Iteration

optional and mostly-not-available alternate-colour front panels are gone. Doesn't look quite as pretty but.... whatevs.

I swapped a mult and an extraneous VCA for a Prap Tools distro module with some hitherto missing functionality. As well as multiply, it combines. Handy!

I swapped the CP3 mixer for another more flexible option. It can function as an effects send among other things. Its big and might be overkill. What to peeps think? The Nano mixer is designed for clean and transparent sound - quite the opposite to the CP3. However....

The bonkers looking thing next to the Nano mixer is my solution to the lack of a stereo filter for the 2nd bus. It's a stereo multimode filter with feedback delay and tube distortion. In the one Youtube demo I can find, it sounds really rathergood.com. What I'm concerned about is whether it's appropriate for this rig. Has anyone used or owned this module? How does the filter work? Can if function as a boring old HP/LP filter if needs be? Or is it all bonkers all the time?

Is there anything fundamental missing here?

EDITED Oct 26th 2021, 22:59