Added, thank you.
Unfortunately Zadar is not doable. The backside requires milling which I am unable to do.
https://cdn.modulargrid.net/img/racks/modulargrid_1133839.jpg
Finally filled the 3rd 60hp tier on top of two Mother 32s. Consists of all MN modules: Function, tELHARMONIC, Qpas, and Mimeophon. Powered by uZeus.
Honestly I am thinking of this as more of a stepping stone to a powered Skiff to complement my Make Noise Shared System, and then also likely adding Xoh, Xpan, Rosie, and Contour, followed by more nonMN modules.
But I thought these might pair well for now with my lonely Mother 32s. Looking forward to hearing the results with my two DFAMs as well.
My initial intention was to add more sequencing/clicking options to the Mothers...as I’m not crazy about those on the Moogs. But for now I’m looking forward to hearing where these take me.
Any suggestions for where to begin?
Who do you think could make an interesting module who hasn't? I reckon Fender, Ibanez, EHX, maybe Hotone. Dunlop?
Rookie. Learning Guitar. Will one day build a rack.
I've thought of that already. At the moment I don't own a saxophone, and I don't fancy practising 8 hours a day. Like I said, my body can't handle the horn. I have back problems, and I don't fancy having to work up chops. The reality is I will never sound like is did in my 20s. My face will never have the stamina. It's like being an athlete past your prime. Every day my body is deteriorating, and it would take longer and longer to heal from difficult long days of practise.
It's time to switch instruments. I'm interested in composing music for my YouTube videos, not practising saxophone all day. Again I've come to this decision after 15 years of thinking about out it.
Also for the cost of a new saxophone $5,000+, I could build a monster synth. Or build a modest synth, and buy more camera gear for my YouTube channel.
Hmmm...have you considered an approach halfway between the two? Sure, the sound of a sax is sort of basic, but I can think of a few reed players who've pushed that via electronics, one being the amazing David Jackson, formerly of Van der Graaf Generator. Jackson used saxes (and a flute) fitted with ligature pickups, and fed these through various devices including a Maestro W2, octave dividers, etc. But while Jackson developed these techniques in the pre-synth 1960s and 70s, there's no reason why you couldn't put a modular synth after the pickup(s). You'd need to have an input preamp that can handle the pickup impedance as well as an envelope follower, for starters. Then if you wanted to track the sax's pitch, something like Elby's ED-102 can handle that for both V/8va and Hz/V scalings.
Ultimately, something of this sort would give you the playability you're accustomed to on your axe while opening up a lot of different sonic possibilities that it normally could NEVER have!
Yes, I know who he is. In fact he's one of the founding members of the Glass ensemble as I remember. My point is much of that music and much of the music I played as a classical saxophonist would fit well on a Eurorack. It's just that I haven't played in 15 years and my body simply can't handle the rigors of heavy daily practice, and I'm looking to modular synths to "replace" it.
As adaptive and flexible an instrument as saxophone is, I'd bestill stuck with the base harmonic make up of that instrument. No matter what mouthpiece, reed, embouchure or voicing I'd use to "filter/shape" the sound, I'd always be stick with the basic waveform that a saxophone produces.
Synths open a whole new world of possibilities. We all grow as musicians, and sometimes we out grow the instruments themselves and need something else. Modular may be that for me. The saxophone can't grow with me. The a modular can grow and change as I grow and change.
Well, that "another guy on saxophone" is actually a veteran on Philip Glass' ensemble; I have Richard Landry playing on some of Glass's early works such as "Music in Fifths".
Process music...yeah, that's a strange topic. I think you can trace back to the point where it forks off of minimalism if you look at La Monte Young's "Compositions 1960", although the inspiration for this goes back to John Cage and his own procedural methods. Young managed to strip down the idea of "process" to simple, koan-like fragments that delineate the framed procedure for the work.
It's interesting that this set of pieces came about after Young's studies with Karlheinz Stockhausen in 1959, because they're not exactly "Stockhausen-esque"...at least, not yet. Instead, Young was inspired to investigate Cage's procedures by Stockhausen, who was quite taken with Cage's methods and results at that time. Stockhausen himself wouldn't hit this stride until 1968 and "Aus den Sieben Tagen" after his own process-based methods grew to a massive level of complexity with "Kurzwellen".
Disting don’t like the menu driving but it’s really a super useful model. I always use when I wanna try a module a don’t have .
Does exist a pdf with all the sequencers modes etc like the Disting has ?
-- Saramago
I went to the webpage
https://ornament-and-cri.me/user-manual-v1_3/
Then I printed the page as a PDF and saved it to my computer.
Hi, thanks for your reply. Could you be more specific?
my questions:
Noise - Why not the noise of MS20 and Dfam?
Sample & Hold (optional) - Yeah thought about that, is the Doepfer 118-2, 148, 184 a good option?
Dedicated LFOs? - Whats wrong with the Pam´s LFO´s?
Dedicated ADSRs? - I prefer using ad. So maybe in a future rack but for now im ok with quadra. Or is there a specific reason like something that is not possible or complicated or... ?
VCAs? - How many would you add?
Thanks a lot for your input.
cheers
Hi there,
thank you for helping me out.
I am new to modular and am planning to buy my first rack for live performance.
I wish to have the ability to create sequences with midi keyboard (Hermod), or randomly generated phrases with "70's dark analogue tone" (that's how I describe it, but it's basically Juno-60 kind of sound)(Roland 512), also being able to make ambient pads (Noise by Bastl). Is there anything that is better for my purposes?
From the posts I've read, I know it's good to leave some room for later expansions so I didn't fill the space, and it might be a good idea to fill it with your suggestions.
The only problem is that because of where I live, it's kinda hard to get less popular modules so I am just gonna stick to the popular ones I guess, but feel free to recommend me the best options in your mind.
Is this something ready to go? Or am I missing somethin' important or fun for live performance?
Thanks again for your help.
Disting don’t like the menu driving but it’s really a super useful model. I always use when I wanna try a module a don’t have .
Does exist a pdf with all the sequencers modes etc like the Disting has ?
Yes , everytime we buy something we should spend time to learn the machines . Unfortunately I don’t spend as much time as I want but gonna check some more tutorials about the “O_C” Turing machine
-- Saramago
You really should. I have the O_C as well as the Disting. The O_C really isn't too too bad as far as menu diving. Most everything is one page away once you get used to using the two rotary encoders. The Disting drives me bonkers in trying to navigate it. If you're willing to put up with that... the O_C is really easy... and it's really powerful at what it does.
Check out the sequencer section as well and what's possible as far as modulating it to play back different sequences etc. I think you'll find that it's a beast if you know it well.
I tried to wrap my head around O_C sequencers and the Turing machine mode but I do hate menu diving . But should try again and again
For sequence I have a Beatstep pro and Make Noise Rene .
What I’m looking for is a more generative melodies type so I can record and choose the happy incidents
-- SaramagoThe two strategies that I suggested are all about happy accidents. You are influencing the melody rather than creating it. Put in the work and learn the module you already have.
-- Ronin1973
Yes , everytime we buy something we should spend time to learn the machines . Unfortunately I don’t spend as much time as I want but gonna check some more tutorials about the “O_C” Turing machine
I swapped the Rene for the Nerdseq sequencer... and heaven on earth!
Very playable... and much, much more possibilities for musicality.No menu diving, everything 1 layer deep.
-- jjterbeek
Wow that “Nerd sequencer” looks a lot more complicated but many thanks for the reply :)
Thx, man! In the long run probably something like 12U. Will start with 6U by building a 2x case, throw some power in, then get a couple modules, and start from there. I think the ER-101 will be the biggest outset in terms of cash. So I'll probably start with a VCO or two, envelop, maybe a filter or waveshaper, VCA: just basic meat and potatoes to learn how a synth voice works. Then just flesh it out from there.
What's so great is that you hear composers like Caterina Barbieri using some of the same process music method developed during. Process music is a form of minimalism that arises from a process, usually a very strict process. If you listen to interviews of Ms. Barbieri, she talks about an approach very similar to methods first pioneered back in the 1960s.
Hi Funbun,
Interesting examples indeed. Funny those 6 pianos and amazing regarding those saxophones. That modular system imitating the music of Steve Reich is quite nice and amazing too.
Did you already made up your mind how big you are going to build your rack? Good luck with the build and once ready show us a picture, I am pretty curious! :-)
Kind regards, Garfield.
For review reports of Eurorack modules, please refer to https://garfieldmodular.net/ for PDF formatted downloads
Hi Dharmabum,
Ah yes, that explains quite a bit :-) Looks like you have thought this already over so, things should be fine then.
If you are not sure yet about the Antiphon and didn't buy it yet, perhaps you can leave that one out and save some rack space?
Good luck and I wish you a lot of modular fun, kind regards, Garfield.
For review reports of Eurorack modules, please refer to https://garfieldmodular.net/ for PDF formatted downloads
Thanks again for good advice!
You are right about the Slew limiter. I newer use it so there I got 8 HP more space.
But I keep the A-183 Passive Dual Attenuator as I use it in most of my patches.
I have three LFO:s that gives random waves so I wait with a dedicated S&H module.
But I will buy the ”Ladik Bool2 – logic module” and ”2hp Multi-Scale Pitch Quantizer” as soon as possible .
When I have learned these two modules it is maybe time for Pamela's New Workout or Temps Utile.
bought from @theartstrip and it was perfect! fast shipping and accurate shipping cost! buy with confidence.
Yeah, minimalist music: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minimal_music
Here's a good example from Steve Reich's Six Pianos:
To me this sounds it would be best done a programmable synth like the ER101/102. I nfact I found a fellow who recorded his Phase Piano on an ER-101:
Again here's another guy on saxophone, minimal:
Also basically everything I hear in what synthesists call "ambient" or atmospherics is what minimalists were doing back in the 1960s. They just didn't have access to modular synths. They had to use traditional instruments. That why guys like Hans Zimmer and all his film scores he uses a 5U synth. All that music from Batman Begins and Interstellar, a good portion of that is 5U blended with the studio orchestra, but the heart of it is modular.
EDIT: added another example.
Thanks for the suggestions!
I've already have a lot of the modules in a Arturia Rackbrute 6U case but already filled it so I'm thinking of upgrading to the Behringer Eurorack Go when it comes out eventually.
In terms of the modules I've fallen in love with the West Coast approach to modular so both the Quadrax and the Falistri are there to act as many things depending what I need, envelopes, LFOs, Voices etc.... So it basically is my modulation section whilst the VCAs will mostly work as CV and Audio mixers for making complex modulation shapes. The Scan & Pan is there to act as the output module.
I have two filters, Optomix which is a vactrol based LPG which sounds fantastic and the Stereo Dipole acts more as a traditional dual filter that you could combine to create a Stereo one. Intruo is actually quite small considering its functionality compared to other complex oscillators such as "DPO" or "Furtherrrr Generatorrrr" so I'm already very fond of that however the Antiphon is very big and hard to tune so I'm not completely sold on it.
René of course acts as my main sequencer for everything while Pressure Plates could act as another sequencer or a trigger for the system. Pam's is the main clock device that can do some modulation stuff as well, and uO_C is there to expand on whatever I'll need for the patch such as a quantizer or shift register etc...
Hope this explains my thought process for the rack! Cheers!
Hi Funbun,
Toodee's comments are spot on. You actually can't go too big if it comes to the rack (but you can go too small easily). However I know from one of your previous posts that you are looking into minimal music (or how you call that exactly?) so you might get "away with it" ;-) with a medium rack. Advisable is at least 3 rows (3 x 3U = 9U) and since you got already those 104 HP rails, 3 x 104 = 312 HP, it might just work out for you but on the bit longer future it might be still too small. So if you have the space and enough wood :-) Perhaps you could consider a 4 or 5 x 3 U case, as I mentioned in the other post, you don't have to fill them up straight away, take your time to get experience with modular and slowly try out more modules.
Good luck and kind regards, Garfield.
For review reports of Eurorack modules, please refer to https://garfieldmodular.net/ for PDF formatted downloads
Hi Dharmabum,
Wow, difficult question, interesting rack but somehow... I don't know, I feel it's difficult to get a grip on it, might be just me, I had traveled today quite a bit, so I might be just too tired. So take my below advice not too hard, it might be just me, being too tired.
On one hand I have the feeling you take a few main brands and take from them one or two of their best modules (except Make Noise, you took a few more from them) and put that all together in this rack of yours (I put below here the link to your rack, that's easier than providing a link to a JPEG picture; we now straight away can see where we are talking about):
What I think I am missing here is a bit of "how is this suppose to work all together" or at least most of them in some kind of harmony? I am not sure to be honest, there are certainly nice modules between it, actually a lot, and that worries me a bit... it looks a bit too much like nice fancy and sexy modules but I am not 100% getting it here.
So a few suggestions:
At my main local dealers I can't find that Dreadbox AntiThon module, are you sure that you still can get it? Anyway, my suggestion is to remove this AntiThon module and the René module and put instead blank panels. Blank panels? Yes, blank panels ;-) You need some space left for (near) future extension, that's one of the things I am missing here. Also these two modules are pretty large and save you some space for perhaps other modules you might need in the future.
I haven't accurately counted the total width but it looks like a weird total width for this casing, are you sure such casing exists?
With that and with perhaps taking a few lesser "fancy" modules and a bit more classic modules, yeah, it might be something you could use. With classic modules I mean the usual "suspects" like oscillators (okay I see that Instruo module there but quite a big one), LFOs, envelopes, filters, VCAs (yes that quad VCA you got there might be all right, I guess you can leave that one in there) and perhaps one or two logic modules.
I see some components that have some LFO capabilities so that might work out, not too sure, or you get rid of one of them and get instead just a classical LFO for that. Did I overlook it or do I miss filters and (basic) envelopes?
You might want to have a look into an audio interface input/output module too; depending on what you might have or might not have externally (external mixer?).
Some of the modules, I do think are more for seniors or at least for medium till high experienced users, not sure how much experience you already have with synthesizers in common and modular specific but you might want to reconsider a few of those modules, are you really ready for all of those modules you have chosen here?
I am not saying you are not allowed to buy all kind of modules, nothing against it :-) However I think it makes more sense to start a bit more simple (leave space left for future extensions) and start to grow into modular, build up your experience and then slowly and step by step get a few more modules. Don't buy the lot in one go!
Anyway, without more input from you, it's difficult to advice. I don't want to discourage you either because modular is fantastic but it requires quite some homework, like investigating into synthesizers in common and particular all the modules you choose, check them one by one, what they do, what you think you need of those and keep reading and checking about those modules.
So welcome to modular, have fun with it and take care, kind regards, Garfield Modular.
For review reports of Eurorack modules, please refer to https://garfieldmodular.net/ for PDF formatted downloads
Maths was one of my first modules, purchased before I had a clue as to what I was doing. For months I used it for little else than its LFO capabilities. But as light bulbs started to go off over the course of my self-education, I realized that Maths can do this...and this...and this. It's in virtually every patch I make, for a variety of tasks.
Also check out Mutant Brain Hexinverter.
I'll add that not only does it take time to learn, it takes time to figure out HOW to learn. When I started, I was completely frustrated because dammit, it took forever to find a quick resource re: how to make a simple patch. And even once I found it, I quickly realized that the wonderful semi-modular I bought didn't teach me much about what was happening under the hood...because I couldn't see the connections! Over time, I found my "teachers." The select handful of people whose Patreons and YouTube pages I subscribed to and who, through the process of my listening to literally everything they put out and learning through osmosis and practice, have taught me how to get going with modular. There is no beginners book that says "Ok, step one. Patch this from here to here. Now do this. Now this." etc. etc.
In other words, it's not enough to set aside time to learn. You have to set aside an enormous amount of time to learn HOW to learn.
And this is a language no different than English, Spanish, or Japanese. Be prepared to watch/listen to videos you don't understand. Look up words you don't know. Attenuverter?! You'll have to look that up. Ring modulation? Same. It takes time to learn a language. BE PREPARED FOR THIS.
I'd look into quantizers, sample and hold circuits, and definitely LOGIC modules. I'm not sure if the MiniBrute has any of this.
I would also consider a Pamela's New Workout or Temps Utile as they are great for creating and manipulating alternative rhythms like Euclidean. Xaoc's Zadar is also a great source for modulation that evolves.
The modules you could part with (IMHO) are:
A-170 (you have the Maths)
A-183 (check out Kona for attenuator cables)
A-180 (passive mults can be done outside of the case with all types of splitters)
If you get stuck for room, they would be the first modules I'd pull from this build to put more modules in.
A sequencer will be a big part of what I want, but after looking at other sequencers, the ER-101 seems the one to fit the build/bill. Are you still using the 101? Have you had time to incorporate the 102?
I know it is impossible to make generative music with a 6U x 84 rack ;-)
But I try anyway.
I have 27 HP empty space left in my rack.
What shall I fill it with for making as close as possible to generative patches?
If you go to the regular module finder section, you can use the "Available in Marketplace" menu, together with other search criteria as "Manufacturer" and/or "Function", etc.
-- KNYST
Thanks
I've tried that alright
Doing so just leads me to Page 1 of the Marketplace without including the preferred module as a search criteria
Cool video as always! Keep up the good work! Waiting for you in Barcelona ;)
Maybe this has been asked before but why is there no text search field in the Marketplace?
-- realeoin
If you go to the regular module finder section, you can use the "Available in Marketplace" menu, together with other search criteria as "Manufacturer" and/or "Function", etc.
Maybe this has been asked before but why is there no text search field in the Marketplace?
I started with an Intellijel 7U. Nothing bad about that one in particular (good starter option, in fact), but indeed I thought initially that the ambitious plan I made before having my first rack wouldn't change too much. I was of course very wrong and as soon as I had my first evening with my first rack, a lot changed and I ended up making more plans. I now have an MDLR 14U and can
I sense that to end up with a small setup that is efficient, interesting and playable, one needs quite a lot of Eurorack experience. Thus the advice for beginners: plan a wayyyy bigger rack than what you have in mind at first, especially if you've never touched modular before.
--- Voltage control all the things ---
Hello!
Thanks a lot for all your detailed answers and attentive listening!
It is very important for me to read such thoughts and analysis. Sometimes seems that it's not interesting to anyone except me, and it’s a little frustrating. But such reviews support me not to stop and continue to experiment.
Thanks once more. New videos coming soon!
Random is the most important kind of modulation for granular.
-- richc90No. You need smooth, SLOW modulation waveforms to make scanning through granules easier. Do it too fast, and you don't get the right sorts of textures.
-- Lugia
Speed/smoothness has nothing to do with whether the modulation is random (think of Sloths).
Random modulation to things like position, panning, grain size, amplitude, pitch etc are all standard practice in granular synthesis (go look at any software granulator with built in modulation, or the Supercell module which has internally generated random modulation normally to the CV inputs). Whether a given kind of modulation will give you "the right textures" (whatever that means) will depend alot on the specific audio in the buffer and what results you want to achieve. That's why (for instance) the Granulator software offers you ways of randomly modulating parameters as well as more standard LFOs.
FWIW I'd get Batumi and Blinds rather than QPLFO and SISM.
My choice here would be the 4ms QPLFO, actually...since that gives you LFO periods that can exceed an hour in length. Plus, this can be backplane-patched to a 4ms SISM for CV-controlled mixing/inversion/etc which also makes patching simpler, definitely a plus if this is intended for pedalboard use.
-- Lugia
The QPLFO looks like a good candidate too. The 4ms site says it is only available in DIY kit form. That is a bit beyond me at the moment but I imagine there are some available on the used market. Thanks!
I'm thinking Xaoc Devices Zadar and an Intellijel 1U Quadratt to attenuate or attenuvert the outputs manually.
I believe the Zadar can loop and play at very slow rates. The Quadratt ensures you can adjust the amount of modulation on the fly. You could also use the Quadratt to mix waveforms from the Zadar as well.
I think that would be fast to set-up in a pedal board situation.
-- Ronin1973
Awesome. Had not heard of the Zadar before. Looks very interesting. Thanks!
Random is the most important kind of modulation for granular.
-- richc90
No. You need smooth, SLOW modulation waveforms to make scanning through granules easier. Do it too fast, and you don't get the right sorts of textures.
My choice here would be the 4ms QPLFO, actually...since that gives you LFO periods that can exceed an hour in length. Plus, this can be backplane-patched to a 4ms SISM for CV-controlled mixing/inversion/etc which also makes patching simpler, definitely a plus if this is intended for pedalboard use.
I just received a pair of rails, rack ends from Synthrotek: 104 hp. This was smaller than I imagined it would be. I've decide to go 9U instead of 3U. What size case did you start with, and what did you regret about going with whatever size you chose at first?
Thanks!
Does anyone have experience with this one? Is it getting very hot? Looking for something to support my submodular case with some power and not sure if I should try the Endorphin.es P or go for a 4 ms ROW 40. Any suggestions?
Random is the most important kind of modulation for granular.
I'm thinking Xaoc Devices Zadar and an Intellijel 1U Quadratt to attenuate or attenuvert the outputs manually.
I believe the Zadar can loop and play at very slow rates. The Quadratt ensures you can adjust the amount of modulation on the fly. You could also use the Quadratt to mix waveforms from the Zadar as well.
I think that would be fast to set-up in a pedal board situation.
New to Eurorack but not new to signal processing and digital effects. Looking for advice on modulator/LFO modules for an ambient/granular/delay/looper rack to be integrated with my pedalboard. Not looking for random or S/H so much, just a variety of waveforms, prefer slower speeds than faster if there has to be a choice. My taste leans more to the serene than chaotic.
PS. Not planning to use this as a sound soure, so no VCOs etc. required.
Thinking for me the Intellijel pallete is a good starting point.
Rack so far is here:
https://cdn.modulargrid.net/img/racks/modulargrid_907968.jpg
This is the rack I'm planning on building, I already have some modules but will start expanding soon. Is it something you think is missing or something that feels odd in the setup? Thanks!
Trying to build a "smart system" with 50/50 preset/hands-on control:
Nerdseq + expanders (with upcoming CV expander) controling soundsources:
Assimil8or (Drums)
Polyend Preset controling:
- 3x CV channels Assimil8or: with one CV channel controlling 8 banks of 8 drum samples = 64 drum samples.
- 1x WMD sequential Switch matrix Controlling: BIA, A-111-4/1-3, A-111-4/4 & Scanned in
Sending in matrix to: Clean channel, Erbe Verb, Chronoblob, Warps
- 2x Filters Cut-off freq
- 1x Chimera Decay
- 1x Warps algorithm
Mixing 16 channels in 4x Intellijel Quadratts:
- Stereo left > into panned left mixer (Left out: A8, Erbe Verb, Chronoblob, out-Warps)
- Stereo right > into pannend right mixer (Right out: A8, Erbe Verb, Chronoblob, aux-Warps)
- 2x mono
End mix with VCA sidechaining kickdrum & 2HP Verb.
Hands on control:
- Varigate 4+
- Voltage Block
- Batumi LFO's
- 4 Robots & Streams Enveloppes
- Event boss
- Switched Mult
- And all the knobs...
Solid advice! Thank you so much. Take away points: (1) consider building a 6U or 9U case from the start; (2) ax the second A-111-6 for a second or third VCO for variety; (3) Consider a couple EGs instead of Maths; verify the mixer's capability for input and output.
Yeah, I can see how that would be a good bit better, just the kind of direction I was hoping for. Thanks!
Hi Yalivec,
Welcome back with some more great music! I took the effort to sit in my "listening" chair listening at your latest and above music track here. Once the music stopped (the track came to an end) I was just sitting there... not knowing what was going on with me, what I just experienced and what I wanted to be continued but I had to get my lazy arse out of that chair and now I am listening to your first track (beginning of this post) again :-)
To cut that short, this latest track, I feel it's better balanced, the guitar is still doing a fantastic job here (I love that guitar sound that almost sounds like a bird that's calling or something, beautiful sound!) however you give your modular a better chance to let it come through too, yeah on the view of having it balanced I like this latest track.
Listening at your first track again (from this post), it's less balanced perhaps but you are definitely more daring there, so that's challenging the listener more and makes the listener (okay me at least) exciting about what's coming next. So both tracks I like it pretty much. I think my favourite is your last track but they are both fantastic.
To summarise: I just can't wait for your next track you are going to surprise us with!
Kind regards and thanks a lot for sharing this, Garfield.
For review reports of Eurorack modules, please refer to https://garfieldmodular.net/ for PDF formatted downloads
