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Well all my Mutable modules are either originals or DIY built by me, I've got Rings and Plaits and have a full size Elements in my DIY backlog - hopefully I'll get round to it sometime in the next 6 months or so!
So I really don't see a problem with having both Rings and a 2hp pluck - both have the 4 note polyphony going on - think of it like a rock band with 2 guitarists...
Nice! I love the idea of a DIY Plaits and Rings if I can find them… may I ask where you sourced them?
I think if you are going to get more than a couple of sound sources I'd be tempted to swap the turning machine out for something like Marbles (which is effectively 3 turing machines + grids)
Hmmm…. Interesting concept. I do have a soft spot for the diy nature of the Turing machine though…. It’s still on its way to me in Canada, so we’ll see how I get along with it and whether I want to expand on its concept and capabilities.
a matrix mixer is a phenomenal utility to add for deriving more interesting modulation cv from a limited number of sources - mult a few to it and mix them together to get another 4 modulation signals for example (or use it for send/return or feedback patching) - so versatile!
-- JimHowell1970
Hmmm… Well you learn something every day! Lol… I had kind of dismissed matrix mixers. But that comes from not really understanding their function. Looks like I have a new topic to research! Gosh this rabbit hole just keeps going deeper, doesn’t it? Ha ha!
Definitely need to get some delay into my chain as well! I’ve been on a Pink Floyd kick the last few days, especially the Wish You Were Here, Meddle and Momentary Lapse of Reason albums…. Delay in boatloads and 2 guitarists!
Thanks for the reply and the very useful info.
The rule of thumb could at least be stated on the manuals of power supply modules. I'm pretty sure I'm not the only one who has not heard of the 3/4ths rule before.
I've now ordered the boost adapter!
Thanks a lot for all the replies! Summed up they give me a much better idea of Odessa. Extra thanks to Nick, your explanations were really helpful as I really am just at the beginning of my journey and trying to grasp the basic concepts of sculpting sound with a modular system.
The Odessa is deep but (because of it?) a fascinating module. Maybe I should've started out with a simpler OSC but I couldn't resist it!
I can totally see how a multi-algorithm module like Disting could be discouraging with TOO many options! I like the idea of a focused approach with a handful of functions at a time. That would be my plan - to eventually swap out features I like to a separate module… like you said, I have a bit of elbow room with the 12u, which is where I think I’ll end up at some point…
I've had mine for roughly 4 years and used it mostly as a tape delay - I finally broke down and bought a Magneto this year... and I still use it mainly as a tape delay - I love delays! but I do have a big-ish rack (1500hp - about to add another 336hp of space - but I like to keep a reasonable amount of blind panels in there too - probably 8% of the space - and I won't be filling the extra 336hp
I agree with the genuine MI Rings point - the Tall Dog uClouds that I already have does feel a bit cramped with its mini pots…but it was a good deal at its’ used price - and it makes good sense to reward the creatives like Emilie! On a related note, do you think Rings and the 2HP Pluck are too similar to co-exist? I do like the sound of the 4-voice polyphony in the Pluck….
Well all my Mutable modules are either originals or DIY built by me, I've got Rings and Plaits and have a full size Elements in my DIY backlog - hopefully I'll get round to it sometime in the next 6 months or so!
So I really don't see a problem with having both Rings and a 2hp pluck - both have the 4 note polyphony going on - think of it like a rock band with 2 guitarists...
your order of operations makes total sense… too easy to get hung up on the shiny sound modules! I love the idea of the Turing Machine and Maths for instance… so many bizarre routing possibilities, modulations and utilities are indeed the heartbeat of the system.
Thanks for the amazing food for thought so far…
Keep it coming… this is invaluable information!
== Aaron
-- aheath73
I think if you are going to get more than a couple of sound sources I'd be tempted to swap the turning machine out for something like Marbles (which is effectively 3 turing machines + grids)
a matrix mixer is a phenomenal utility to add for deriving more interesting modulation cv from a limited number of sources - mult a few to it and mix them together to get another 4 modulation signals for example (or use it for send/return or feedback patching) - so versatile!
"some of the best base-level info to remember can be found in Jim's sigfile" @Lugia
Utility modules are the dull polish that makes the shiny modules actually shine!!!
Maths is brilliant - download the 'maths illustrated supplement' it is a great primer for patching in general and patch-programming in particular...
Disting is a great module - but take it slowly, set up favourites - which allows you to put 8 of the algorithms next to each other and restrict yourself to them for a month or 2 - if you find one that you gravitate to replace that algorithm with another and buy a dedicated module to cover the functionality in your rack - if you don't gel with any particular algo then swap some different ones in to the favourites - don't try to go through every algorithm to see if you like them - this often causes frustration and the thought that the manual will be constantly necessary...
After that? A Pam’s, some utilities, another voice option (2HP Pluck or a uRings clone - or another DIY VCO). I do love the soldering and assembly aspects, so I have to remember to keep that in mind…
-- aheath73
yes, yes, yes - but get a real rings, not a clone - ergonomics is important & you have the space - but more so I think Emilie deserves to be paid for designing the module and writing the code
it will give you a more balanced modular and the most options for the least money
saying that 5 or 6 sound sources is probably ok in 12u and note that some modules - Rings and filters that can self-oscillate, ro example, can count as both sound sources and sound modulators
-- JimHowell1970
Awesome! Thanks Jim…
Great points to consider:
thanks for the suggested Maths guide
I can totally see how a multi-algorithm module like Disting could be discouraging with TOO many options! I like the idea of a focused approach with a handful of functions at a time. That would be my plan - to eventually swap out features I like to a separate module… like you said, I have a bit of elbow room with the 12u, which is where I think I’ll end up at some point…
I agree with the genuine MI Rings point - the Tall Dog uClouds that I already have does feel a bit cramped with its mini pots…but it was a good deal at its’ used price - and it makes good sense to reward the creatives like Emilie! On a related note, do you think Rings and the 2HP Pluck are too similar to co-exist? I do like the sound of the 4-voice polyphony in the Pluck….
your order of operations makes total sense… too easy to get hung up on the shiny sound modules! I love the idea of the Turing Machine and Maths for instance… so many bizarre routing possibilities, modulations and utilities are indeed the heartbeat of the system.
It's funny how modularists share this taste for Star Trek. I don’t escape it either... There is a Communicator (a nice toy version) preciously placed between my Mother-32 and my 0-Coast... :))
Artificial Singularity is a good ambient track. Congratulations!
I especially like the density and the smoothness of the pads. The depth of the mix and the spacialization too.
The length may seem daring and we too often hesitate to produce on such a dimension. But the theme lends itself well.
I feel the same way about Maths… it’s multi-function and quite flexible in its’ routing options. I had planned for it to be next on my purchase list. I was torn on the Disting MK IV, but I think it will give me a ton of options to figure out what direction I would like to explore in a dedicated module.
Maths is brilliant - download the 'maths illustrated supplement' it is a great primer for patching in general and patch-programming in particular...
Disting is a great module - but take it slowly, set up favourites - which allows you to put 8 of the algorithms next to each other and restrict yourself to them for a month or 2 - if you find one that you gravitate to replace that algorithm with another and buy a dedicated module to cover the functionality in your rack - if you don't gel with any particular algo then swap some different ones in to the favourites - don't try to go through every algorithm to see if you like them - this often causes frustration and the thought that the manual will be constantly necessary...
After that? A Pam’s, some utilities, another voice option (2HP Pluck or a uRings clone - or another DIY VCO). I do love the soldering and assembly aspects, so I have to remember to keep that in mind…
-- aheath73
yes, yes, yes - but get a real rings, not a clone - ergonomics is important & you have the space - but more so I think Emilie deserves to be paid for designing the module and writing the code
it will give you a more balanced modular and the most options for the least money
saying that 5 or 6 sound sources is probably ok in 12u and note that some modules - Rings and filters that can self-oscillate, ro example, can count as both sound sources and sound modulators
"some of the best base-level info to remember can be found in Jim's sigfile" @Lugia
Utility modules are the dull polish that makes the shiny modules actually shine!!!
‘I feel like I’m heading in about 20 different directions at once while trying to plan, so would love some feedback, constructive criticism and advice…’
This is a common situation and also very logical. You can't and shouldn't try to plan everything. As for a trip, you leave by defining a few essential places to visit, but it is then, on the spot, that you will discover the interest or the desire to visit others. Otherwise the process is too mental and, indeed, you can go crazy imagining 20 directions at once!
That said, in your list I see at least two that you will never be disappointed with: Maths and Disting mk4. They are not the most exotic modules, but they are like the Louvre and the Eiffel Tower... pretty much unmissable.
-- Sweelinck
Thanks Sweelinck,
Haha! Well said… I like your travel analogy… I had hit a point of “gear paralysis” yesterday, not sure which way to go next…
You’re absolutely right… you never really know what’s around the corner until you poke your head down the alley! I got too hung up on the “end” of the journey/build, instead of exploring it as it evolves, playing with each new addition to the adventure!
I feel the same way about Maths… it’s multi-function and quite flexible in its’ routing options. I had planned for it to be next on my purchase list. I was torn on the Disting MK IV, but I think it will give me a ton of options to figure out what direction I would like to explore in a dedicated module.
After that? A Pam’s, some utilities, another voice option (2HP Pluck or a uRings clone - or another DIY VCO). I do love the soldering and assembly aspects, so I have to remember to keep that in mind…
Thanks Garfield. Yeah I too love that “lead” sound that pick up in the last section. I just wish I could remember how I did that. ;-) I didn’t write anything down for this one. Oh well, that’s modular. Cheers!
‘I feel like I’m heading in about 20 different directions at once while trying to plan, so would love some feedback, constructive criticism and advice…’
This is a common situation and also very logical. You can't and shouldn't try to plan everything. As for a trip, you leave by defining a few essential places to visit, but it is then, on the spot, that you will discover the interest or the desire to visit others. Otherwise the process is too mental and, indeed, you can go crazy imagining 20 directions at once!
That said, in your list I see at least two that you will never be disappointed with: Maths and Disting mk4. They are not the most exotic modules, but they are like the Louvre and the Eiffel Tower... pretty much unmissable.
So like a lot of people, I’ve begun to dive into the world of Eurorack modular… I’m in the process of building my first rack and am looking for some guidance. My goal is to build a jamming/ambient/generative machine (with a little loungy/weird house thrown into the mix) that will be supplemented by a few external hardware synths and contain a bunch of DIY modules.
Ideally, I’m looking to build with the Arturia Rackbrute cases - either a 6U and a 3U, or perhaps a second 6U down the line… I’ve started with 1 of the 6U units.
The external hardware consists of:
Korg MS-20 mini
Behringer Crave
drum machine - currently an Arturia Drumbrute Impact, but am thinking to replace it with a Roland TR-6S for a larger palette of percussion sounds
Arturia KeyStep Pro to handle clock, sequencing and MIDI for now…
** and while I’m dreaming up my dream machine, I’d love to throw a Moog Subharmonicon/DFAM combo into the mix **
Some notes:
First row is modules I currently own, in a Rackbrute 6U case
Second row is incoming modules
Row 3 & 4 are potential modules to add - including as many DIY as I can!
I feel like I’m heading in about 20 different directions at once while trying to plan, so would love some feedback, constructive criticism and advice…
Oh wow! This is so beautiful! So beautifully done and such a lovely long track, 26 minutes of pure pleasure! You have some lovely sounds in this track, for example that sound that comes into play just a bit after 18:00+ wow! I could die for a sound like that, so great, so thrilling! :-)
Excellent job and thank you very much for sharing this with us, kind regards, Garfield.
For review reports of Eurorack modules, please refer to https://garfieldmodular.net/ for PDF formatted downloads
This is a great track, one that gives a lot of positive energy, I like that. It's fun to listen at it and it's very playful. Nice video too, it tells me that I need to investigate a bit more into my Studio One ;-) I am currently only using it for importing the recording from the SD card (from a PreSonus mixer) and exporting it then to a stereo WAV file... need to make more use of it I realise :-)
Thank you very much for sharing this with us and kind regards, Garfield.
For review reports of Eurorack modules, please refer to https://garfieldmodular.net/ for PDF formatted downloads
Oh wow! This is nice and super relaxed. I am going to use this for the moments I am working on my review reports. Sorry, just back from a week holiday, so the night isn't long enough the listen at the full hour but will do that during writing the review reports! :-)
Thank you very much for sharing this with us and kind regards, Garfield.
For review reports of Eurorack modules, please refer to https://garfieldmodular.net/ for PDF formatted downloads
That's pretty nice and special, especially in combination with the video it's good fun too! :-) I got a bit of the Matrix feeling too ;-)
I am watching and listening at it now for the second time, still big fun and a great sound! Thanks a lot for sharing this little wonder and kind regards, Garfield.
For review reports of Eurorack modules, please refer to https://garfieldmodular.net/ for PDF formatted downloads
Overall IMO it looks solid. Lots of "no regrets" modules there IMO.
A few things you may want to add sooner or later:
-- an output, like you said. IMO it makes a rig a lot easier to use, having an output that can go to headphones, DAW, etc.
-- XOAC Batumi, Mutable Stages, or something similar, just to give you more normal CV
-- 4MS SISM or something similar, to help you constrain CV to usable ranges. IMO this is very important
-- I would also want a quantizer in this rig. You're planning to use O&C, which should be fine. I like a dedicated one like Scales
Overall I think your rack above looks solid and fun. And its great you're leaving case room and have given thought to further adds.
Stackcables (and any other type of passive mult) are fine for anything but pitch - in 99% of all other cases a tiny bit of voltage droop will not be noticed!
the only exception to this is some modules expect to be plugged into a buffered input - I find Maths needs to go through a buffer to some modules, for example
"some of the best base-level info to remember can be found in Jim's sigfile" @Lugia
Utility modules are the dull polish that makes the shiny modules actually shine!!!
The guy you posted on YouTube uses Euclidean rhythms to trigger his squid. You can do it from Pams but it’s not that performative as opposed to using the vpme module.
The guy you posted on YouTube uses Euclidean rhythms to trigger his squid. You can do it from Pams but it’s not that performative as opposed to using the vpme module.
@happygolucky, since you said you are just looking to get into modular, I will point out some things that may be new to you as a newcomer to modular. If they are obvious, please forgive me.
— modular controls are not all equal. Different controls may have different usable ranges. Those usable ranges may change depending on the patch you have at the moment. Most module designers tend to offer a usable range for a control PLUS considerably more than that, so that users can explore and creatively “misuse” modules also.
— what does this mean? Let’s look at some of the controls you are mentioning. Pitch control is normally volt per octave. So a 15 volt range gives 15 octaves! A large keyboard is 88 keys or roughly 7 octaves. So Odessa has a pitch input range roughly 2x that of a piano. There is almost no musical use case that uses that much pitch range. So IMO you will be fine if you are limited to less than all 15 volts of pitch control.
— practically, you would normally be driving oscillator pitch with control voltage coming from a sequencer or some alternative to that. If you’re using a sequencer, you can tune that output up or down as needed on the sequencer itself. So your final pitch is a function of your sequencer setting and oscillator setting. You’re not reliant on the oscillator settings alone.
— what about the other control values on Odessa? I personally can’t remember a patch where I’m using the full available range of any one parameter. Rather, there are “sweet spots” in and around the patch and the challenge is to find those and constrain the modulation to move around the sweet spots. If anything, I want a type of “modular microscope” that makes small settings and small changes easier to hit. Practically, something like 4MS SISM is extremely helpful to take a modulation source like a LFO then use scale and shift to constrain the modulation to a range that is musically appealing for that particular patch.
— In the broader picture, if Odessa is inspiring to you then yes look to creat a rig using Odessa with enough supporting modules to make it shine. I have Odessa but have not spent enough time with it yet to have a real sense of its possibilities. So beware it is fairly unique and IMO pretty deep. But it is cool IMO and the manual is good.
Not sure if this speaks to your question or not but I hope at least some of this helps. Cheers!
Plenty there to keep you busy for a while. You'll enjoy the Listen 1/4, but if you want line in, you could go with the Listen I/O and some sort of stereo mixer, like the Doepfer A-138s. The Salmple can boost one mono line in to Eurorack level, but that's not a long-term solution.
Thanks again to everyone for their feedback. It's been invaluable for a newbie like me (and hopefully any other newbies reading this thread). I've finally narrowed everything down into the below rack to get me started:
Have removed the FH-2 because at this stage, I'm thinking it might be best for me to just use the rack standalone while learning, and not complicate things by adding the Elektron boxes into the mix. I feel like there's enough on my plate here to keep me busy for the next few months at least.
Replaced the Veils with Intellijel Quad VCA as the former won't be restocked until December and I can't find a second hand one locally. I also heard the Quad VCA might not be able to work with line inputs as they only boost to +6db as opposed to the +20db with the Veils. I figured I'll probably need the Veils at some point, so could also look at the FH-2 when the time comes?
Added the uO_c so I can quantize the MD and also experiment with its other features - e.g. envelope generation. A friend suggested maybe replacing it with the MI Tides to avoid menu diving with the uO_c, but I'm not sure if it's worth the trade off against the other functions of the uO_c, especially with a small rack? That Maths illustrated guide does look very useful, so I'm a bit town about this part.
I know I don't need an output module at this stage, but with my budget it looks like I can squeeze in the 4ms Listen 1/4, so I'm tempted to just add that in as I do have limited desk space, so might even sell my ZED60-FX mixer and get something smaller in the future - maybe a 1010 Bluebox, or something cheaper? Form factor is key for me at the moment.
Also noting that my friend has a 2hp trim and mult, along with the MI Kinks, so if needed I can also add these to my rack temporarily.
I think I'm ready to bite the bullet and make a purchase, so are there any concerns with this revised rack to get me started?
I made the unfortunate mistake of confusing UPS with USPS when ordering from Control, shipment took 4 weeks to arrive into Australia. Disclaimer on Control's website does state that there is significant delays with USPS.
I am in the US and it will be three weeks tomorrow...hoping to hit the mail box and have three deliveries show up at the same time :)
I made the unfortunate mistake of confusing UPS with USPS when ordering from Control, shipment took 4 weeks to arrive into Australia. Disclaimer on Control's website does state that there is significant delays with USPS.
Interestingly when I contacted AU post they told me that the USPS tracking isn't accurate, and items are not actually scanned at each port, instead you’re given a 'projected' date and time items go through each sorting facility, so in essence once your shipment is picked up by USPS it disappears into the ether until it lands on your doorstep...
This has been fairly common in my experience since this time last year. Waited just over a month for a package shipped USPS from one state away.
It’s interesting though as it must be certain parts of the country that are affected more than others…I have packages arriving from Patchworks and Void Modular that I ordered just a little over a weeks ago arriving tomorrow
Hang in there, and good luck!
That’s about all I can do at this point :) just wanted to see if others were indeed feeling the pain too
This has been fairly common in my experience since this time last year. Waited just over a month for a package shipped USPS from one state away. I think Control may even have a disclaimer on their website about this exact thing, at least they did for a few months. I’m even having shipping headaches with FedEx often as well.
DeJoy f’ed up the post office, and the best most of us can do is be patient. 99.99% of the time, it’s not the merchants fault.
Hang in there, and good luck!
I ordered a QuantiZer from them on Wed. Sept 15 and it arrived the following Monday. Since the pandemic I don't expect packages to arrive on time but I do remember Control sending out a couple of emails about how the pandemic affected them.
You don't list your country of origin (edit: after re-reading your post, I think you're in the US?) so that could be a huge factor. Priority is above first class. Beginning October 1st, crony and unexperienced puppet USPS Post Master General Louis Dejoy is slowing down first class mail. Read about the shitshow here. Also, it's possible in rare scenarios that the package is on its way but hasn't been scanned. The other week I received a package that was scanned once it arrived at the origin facility and then wasn't scanned again until it arrived at my doorstep.
I would call Control and try to figure out the situation. Maybe it was suppose to go out and didn't.
Hi, wondering if anybody else from the states is having issues with shipment from Control? I orderd a Ts-L from them...will be three weeks ago tomorrow.
The tracking number they provided says "Pre-Shipment Info Sent to USPS" with no updates. Emailed them last week about it and they said "Your order was packed, shipped and picked up by USPS on 09/24 — the same day the order was placed."
Called USPS and they said "unfortunately we must wait for this package to arrive as it's coming as first class out of NY and we could see some major delays for it."
I mean, I get that there may be some delays, but this is shipping first class...just wondered if others have had such a delay with any shipment from Control.
A couple follow ups:
-- stackables? Sure, you can try that. I almost always use active mults, so that I know what goes out equals what comes in.
-- getting the voltage offset (steps 3 above) may not be easy to do by ear. I was running the signal into Mordax DATA to view the waveforms. I don't have a good workaround to offer if you don't already have an oscilloscope handy. And I'm not totally sure what happens if the offset isn't fully "dialed in". I believe that would lead to passing DC to the outputs; what I'm not sure of is if DC would be filtered by downchain devices (such as audio outs or audio interface).
An experiment with some new stuff I've acquired over the last couple of months: The mighty Doepfer A-151 Sequential Switch, Qu-Bit Bloom, Qu-Bit Chord V2 and Frap Tools Brenso. I got the A-151 so I could replicate the osc round robbin feature of the Sequential Pro 3 witch is an effect I really love. I just got Brenso a week ago, so there's a lot to learn on that, but it is mega!
For track 1, Rene is feeding note CV to Piston Honda Osc A and B as well as to Plaits and using Plaits two outputs. Those oscillators are getting the same exact sequence which is split by the clock and the switch.The sequence is 11 steps, so each time a different note value is sent to a different oscillator at a different time. The two PH outputs are fed into Bionic Lester, then into Chronoblob which has its Mix level modulated by an LFO. The two Plaits outputs go to Vult Freak, then to Mimeophon where its Mix level is modulated by a different LFO. The four outputs are panned 9:00, 1:00, 11:00 and 3:00 so they bounce around the stereo field. Rene is feeding a second sequence to Chord V2 and I have the main out into Ripples and the Root and Fifth outs to QPAS.
For track 2, Bloom is feeding a long-ish branched sequence to Brenso going into QPAS. Various modulation for QPAS and Brenso parameters. Track 3 is a short bass sequence into Brenso into Freak, fed by a Keystep. Drums are pieced together and modified from EZ Drummer.
The video shows Studio One and the automation lanes. Track one is the core track, so it's simple, but for dynamics, tracks 2 and 3 levels are in and out a lot. The automation on the drums is for adding some chorus effects.
A few comments. I won't quote what I'm responding to, hopefully it's not too confusing.
Think of a patch cable coming from an audio source in your rack as a VERY LOUD signal. You just have to get the right plug on the other end, put it into your mixer or Digitakt input after having turned the level to zero, then slowly turn it up to taste. An output module will mean you're not tied to your mixer or Digitakt. Convenience, not necessity.
You can use Pam's to quantize an external signal. But it wasn't made for that purpose, the manufacturer says there could be latency issues, and it uses up one or both of the CV inputs. I've been considering uO_c for quantization and what is commonly but incorrectly called a Turing machine, but I'm also considering other options. My sequencers already quantize; I need a quantizer for CV that isn't coming out of a sequencer. You don't need a quantizer for MD if you're willing to tune by ear and not use "shred" randomization. But if you need to quantize MD to use it (say, to alter a melodic sequence on the fly), then maybe think about a different sequencer.
"Menu-diving" covers a host of usability issues, and they're different for different modules. The issue with Pam's is that most interaction is done with a single push encoder. It does about as well as it can given that limitation, it does a lot of very useful things, and the menu structure isn't too deep. But going between the channel overview and a particular channel's parameters is a one-second long press. That's longer than it sounds in practice, and really breaks up the interaction. It wouldn't be easy to, say, tweak two separate Euclidean rhythms. I haven't used uO_c, but based on the documentation, the issue there is more with a complicated menu structure. There are two buttons and two knobs, so the interaction will be quicker in one sense, but longer in different ways. Quantization is usually set-and-forget, but other functions might need more tweaking while playing.
I have the Intellijel Quad VCA, but am still considering Veils 2020, because the sliders on Veils 2020 correspond to the small attenuators on the IJ, which I use more than the large level knobs. There are a lot of VCAs out there, so maybe you can tell us which ones are available at your retailers of choice?
It's hard to see the modules in the first video (except for the Verbos Complex Oscillator, MD, and Morphagene) but the patch notes are pretty good. Both videos rely on effects: just a delay in the second one (and I can't see the patching but I don't think it's doing anything too complicated) but Clouds and Morphagene in the first, so delay, reverb, granular, loop manipulation. If that's part of the sound you want, then you need to think about how to achieve it. FX Aid XL will get you part of the way there... but it's another Happy Nerding module, so it may be hard for you to acquire. You also have the Elektron effects at end of chain, and I guess the mixer effects if you want to use those. Between the Elektron effects and a good external pedal I have (plus a send/return module so I can put that in the middle rather than only at end of chain), I find it hard to justify any in-rack effects currently, and that doesn't even take into account the ability to use my laptop or iPad in various ways. The one exception is an analog BBD delay (Sarajewo). But that's me; your needs are different.
I haven't had the Odessa for a while so I can't be of much help, but I seem to remember the HEL expander accepted only positive voltages and their CV inputs (HEL and Odessa) summed each other, so you could transpose one with the other. Maybe it has something to do with that (or not). Just putting it out there in case it helps.
well i cant figure out how to set it up (patch it to work)with the doepfer clock divider?
-- Broken-Form
I've got this derived-square patch working on my system right now. Here's how I'm doing it:
1. square wave from any OSC patched to input of A160-2
2. take an output from A160-2: that's the result. Note this is POSITIVE voltage only.
3. apply a bit of offset (negative voltage) using a utility. I have ShadesV2 doing this. SISM would work fine, lots of others would work fine.
I'm getting a square wave at 1/2 rate. Varying settings on A160-2 gives me different pulse width on the output. Both audio and oscilloscope are showing me this works on my end. Note the result is just a lower version of the original square wave.
Of course, assuming you want to mix the original and the derived square, you'll need a copy (mult) of the original.
-- nickgreenberg
Tanks godnat try this already godt a sism in My system.can i Use stackcables instead of a mult for the copy?
there is not really such thing as redundancy in modular - I have both and find that I use Rings in Easter Egg modes and Plaits in other modes often enough to warrant having a DIY Elements in my backlog - which I am hoping to get to before the end of the year! but then again I do have quite a decent sized modular - saying that I also like using both in similar modes at the same time
I would agree that a third sound source would be a good idea - something analog - personally I like the Doepfer Basic VCO and Buchla style oscillators
neither Rings nor Plaits is an oscillator - they are more self-contained voices, as neither needs a filter or vca after it!
"some of the best base-level info to remember can be found in Jim's sigfile" @Lugia
Utility modules are the dull polish that makes the shiny modules actually shine!!!
One comment on getting both Rings and Plaits: note that Plaits has 2 of the 3 Rings modes. Plaits lacks position and doesn't have as much polyphony as Rings, but otherwise it might be redundant to get both. Pairing some other oscillator with Plaits that doesn't have overlap like that might give you more versatility.
Sorry for the lengthy reply in advance, but just wanted to respond to a few comments that I missed earlier.
You're getting a lot of advice, but you're the one who knows best what you want to do with your devices. Treat everything as potentially useful information rather than authority. And go slowly!
-- plragde
Of course. I'm just trying to get as much advice as possible so I can (hopefully) decide on a starter rack that is logical and help me on my journey.
good thinking!
Remember that OS 1.3 means your Digitakt can mix input from your modular, pan it dynamically, and apply its effects (and a similar Digitone update is considered likely). Both the Digitakt and the A&H can deal with Eurorack-level signals, but an output module is convenient.
-- plragde
Oh wow, I didn't know this! That's awesome. Out of curiosity - what would be the best way to do this without an output module? I've also got the A&H ZED60-FX mixer, so any recommendations there would be appreciated!
3.5mm->1/4" cables, turn everything down on the mixer and bring up slowly - you probably won't need any gain on the mixer
if it still clips then use passive attenuators - 2hp trim, for example - they are cheap small and can be set and forget once you get the levels right
The A&H mixer has 2 headphone sockets - why not just use 1 of them for now? you can add a headphone output in the future if you find you need it!
-- JimHowell1970
I always thought that was the whole point of output modules in eurorack, but seems like I've been wrong about that. As I've asked @plagde - what's the best way to connect it to my mixer/headphones without an output module?
they are kind of like medicine - you only need them if you need them - if you need balanced outputs then you'll need them - if you have noise on the output then they are worth trying - but only once you have tried attenuators - and unbalanced outputs are really just attenuators so if you are going to go for an output module buy balanced/isolated ones
I like FX Aid XL will make a great addition
-- JimHowell1970
I think I'm definitely going to get one of these. After watching a few videos it looks absolutely amazing!
the only way I'm going to get mine is if and when they offer the FX Aid XXL - there is talk of one with a screen etc, but that's a way off - and only then if I've bought the one with the screen and I can't live without it on my existing one!
a disting (mk4 or ex) would be a great addition
-- JimHowell1970
I've been doing a bit more research and can see now why a lot of people recommend the Disting MK4 and uO_c modules for a small rack like this. I'm considering adding a uO_c to the rack for quantizing the Digitalis and experimenting with its other uses, then maybe get a Disting after, as it seems like it's a good option to "test" out other functions to help plan future expansion. Do you think this is a good idea? I thought the Marbles and PNW already could already do quantizing, so am I missing something when everyone says the MD needs a quantizer?
Disting is great for auditioning different types of module - don't rush trying all the different algos - this is how people seem to get to hate them quickly - favourites are the way to go - if you find yourself using the same algo constantly replace that with a dedicated module and move on...
Marbles and PNW can both quantize their internal signals and apparantly external signals as well, but I've never used them for this - I have never used Mimetic Digitalis - but I just skim read the manual and it does not appear to have quantization functions - if you want it's outputs to be quantized, then it's probably better to quantize - there is no guarantee that what it records and plays back is pitch perfect - some voltage droop may be experienced I don't know... so if MD users are saying to get a quantizer, I'd be tempted to listen!
Saying that I almost always use a quantizer on the outputs of Marbles, when I use that for sequencing, but the quantizer I use is sinfonion - which also adds chord progression sequencing and an arpeggiator
Also would having the Salmple, PNW, uO_c and Disting be too much menu diving? I'm trying to avoid this but from what I've seen it doesn't seem too bad. Ideally I'd prefer 1 knob per function but can live with a little menu diving.
only you can answer that one - I don't own the squid salmple or O&C - but the menu systems on both PNW and Disting are not too bad...
Maths not required. If you want more plucky sounds you have a low pass gate built into plaits. From what I can see he likes using plaits to give chord drones. He is using md to drive the melody in the 0 coast.
-- greenfly
This is good to know, thank you. I'm thinking of getting a uO_c instead of the Maths and possibly a Disting MK4 after (as mentioned above). Assume this could open up a world of possibility and keep me busy in the meantime?
Maths is not required - correct, BUT I think it's the best module for learning modular synthesis there is due to the 'maths illustrated supplement'
it's important to note some people into modular synthesizers are not really into modular synthesis - they're only interested in connecting a few modules together to make some sounds - both are equally valid approaches - as is a middle ground!!!
I want to underscore what Lugia said about MD needing a quantizer
-- plragde
Yeah this seems to be the general consensus. But as I've asked above in this response. Doesn't the Marbles and PNW act as a quantizer also? And I'm guessing the uO_c or Disting is the solution to this? Seems like the Ladik Q-040 is hard to come by, so maybe I'd be better off with the former as I could also use it for envelope generation, etc?
see above
Ladik is only available from Ladik - they are easy to get hold of you just buy them direct!!!
3xVCA, if you can get it, is a fine bridge to Veils 2020
-- plragde
Good to know! I can't seem to find one for sale. Would the ALM Tangle Quartet work as another solution? Or are there any other alternatives you could recommend?
Intellijel quad vca? or just wait until the one you want (Veils 2020) is available - remember you can never have too many vcas!!!
Also I realised I didn't include any reference videos to the style of ambient that I'd like to make, so better late than never.
This is pretty much the exact style of ambient I am referring to. So Ideally I am trying to build a system that can do both styles of music like the original videos I posted, along with these ones. Am I on the right track with my current setup? I can't really see / am not familiar with the modules in the first video, so would like to know what recommendations everyone has with this in mind. Could the system Lugia proposed achieve this?
Almost any modular system can produce any type of music to some extent - it's an instrument like a guitar - the player is more important than the instrument - go slowly and you will get the right modular for you and your workflow
Thanks again to everyone for the super insightful and knowledgeable feedback. I will post a picture of my final starter rack once I've decided on my final shopping list in case anyone is interested. I feel like you all are invested in this journey with me now, ha :)
-- calmfarmer
don't post a picture - post a link to your public rack!!!
"some of the best base-level info to remember can be found in Jim's sigfile" @Lugia
Utility modules are the dull polish that makes the shiny modules actually shine!!!
Sorry for the lengthy reply in advance, but just wanted to respond to a few comments that I missed earlier.
You're getting a lot of advice, but you're the one who knows best what you want to do with your devices. Treat everything as potentially useful information rather than authority. And go slowly!
-- plragde
Of course. I'm just trying to get as much advice as possible so I can (hopefully) decide on a starter rack that is logical and help me on my journey.
Remember that OS 1.3 means your Digitakt can mix input from your modular, pan it dynamically, and apply its effects (and a similar Digitone update is considered likely). Both the Digitakt and the A&H can deal with Eurorack-level signals, but an output module is convenient.
-- plragde
Oh wow, I didn't know this! That's awesome. Out of curiosity - what would be the best way to do this without an output module? I've also got the A&H ZED60-FX mixer, so any recommendations there would be appreciated!
The A&H mixer has 2 headphone sockets - why not just use 1 of them for now? you can add a headphone output in the future if you find you need it!
-- JimHowell1970
I always thought that was the whole point of output modules in eurorack, but seems like I've been wrong about that. As I've asked @plagde - what's the best way to connect it to my mixer/headphones without an output module?
I like FX Aid XL will make a great addition
-- JimHowell1970
I think I'm definitely going to get one of these. After watching a few videos it looks absolutely amazing!
a disting (mk4 or ex) would be a great addition
-- JimHowell1970
I've been doing a bit more research and can see now why a lot of people recommend the Disting MK4 and uO_c modules for a small rack like this. I'm considering adding a uO_c to the rack for quantizing the Digitalis and experimenting with its other uses, then maybe get a Disting after, as it seems like it's a good option to "test" out other functions to help plan future expansion. Do you think this is a good idea? I thought the Marbles and PNW already could already do quantizing, so am I missing something when everyone says the MD needs a quantizer?
Also would having the Salmple, PNW, uO_c and Disting be too much menu diving? I'm trying to avoid this but from what I've seen it doesn't seem too bad. Ideally I'd prefer 1 knob per function but can live with a little menu diving.
Maths not required. If you want more plucky sounds you have a low pass gate built into plaits. From what I can see he likes using plaits to give chord drones. He is using md to drive the melody in the 0 coast.
-- greenfly
This is good to know, thank you. I'm thinking of getting a uO_c instead of the Maths and possibly a Disting MK4 after (as mentioned above). Assume this could open up a world of possibility and keep me busy in the meantime?
I want to underscore what Lugia said about MD needing a quantizer
-- plragde
Yeah this seems to be the general consensus. But as I've asked above in this response. Doesn't the Marbles and PNW act as a quantizer also? And I'm guessing the uO_c or Disting is the solution to this? Seems like the Ladik Q-040 is hard to come by, so maybe I'd be better off with the former as I could also use it for envelope generation, etc?
3xVCA, if you can get it, is a fine bridge to Veils 2020
-- plragde
Good to know! I can't seem to find one for sale. Would the ALM Tangle Quartet work as another solution? Or are there any other alternatives you could recommend?
Also I realised I didn't include any reference videos to the style of ambient that I'd like to make, so better late than never.
This is pretty much the exact style of ambient I am referring to. So Ideally I am trying to build a system that can do both styles of music like the original videos I posted, along with these ones. Am I on the right track with my current setup? I can't really see / am not familiar with the modules in the first video, so would like to know what recommendations everyone has with this in mind. Could the system Lugia proposed achieve this?
Thanks again to everyone for the super insightful and knowledgeable feedback. I will post a picture of my final starter rack once I've decided on my final shopping list in case anyone is interested. I feel like you all are invested in this journey with me now, ha :)
