VCV Rack addict wants to go hardware

Dear Voltage people,

I'm new here. Hello!

As of yet I've been playing with VCV Rack. Eurorack has taken me by the throat about 6 months ago and never let go yet. It's a perfect storm for a person like me. Musically educated IT guy with electronics tic that loves EDM but hates the DAW workflow. Proficient on the drums and piano. I started listening music seriously in the 1980s when synthesizers started to become mainstream. I used to be a gamer, until I discovered Eurorack..

I'm planning to take this journey further by building my own hardware rack. I watched a ton of vids and read many best-of lists to arrive at this setup:

The direction I want to take this in Musically is percussion-heavy, dark, gritty, industrial. I like the idea of generated sequences with limited random (mix 7 step sequence into 16 step base sequence to introduce controlled chaos, for instance). Genres I like and want to experiment with are DnB, Neurofunk, Elektro, Retro-wave, (industrial) Tekno, maybe even some Gabber. I want my sound to be dark, cold, gritty, snappy and heavy for this build.

Of course I'm looking for advice on the obvious things. Glaring gaps in the setup my noob eyes missed, better modules for the ones chosen, etcetera. As I'm painfully aware I didn't even scratch the surface yet concerning Eurorack, I hope you can help me "perfect" this box so it is the best I can get. I am planning on buying this bit by bit while practicing in VCV Rack, so being able to produce sound/music early on is not that hugely important. I also have no kids or wife, which certainly helps in freeing up some funds to do this ;-)

Thoughts on choices made:

TOP ROW (1U)
Steppy: Small sequencer with large application
Mult: well, mult.
Quadratt 1U: I learned attenuation/attenuverting is something you can't go without and this module seems very well equipped to do that.
SHTH 1U: same goes for S/T&H, can't go without. This module seemed nice because of small size and "no room in the main rows".
Audio I/O: get my music out of the box into PA. Planning on connecting headphones there if needed, so that interface can potentially be kept out of the rack.

MIDDLE ROW
Turing Machine: I love working with this thing in VCV Rack so I included it in the setup.
Euclidean Circles: Easy rythm setup with easy polyrythm access, without having to manipulate a lot.
BitBox Micro: Chopped up breaks with custom replay options and CV, Sample box if not used for breaks.
LIP: Noise Engineering seems to be the bomb for dark and gritty. I also like Instruo very much, but in vids I watched this thing kept on sounding darker and more industrial than the Cs-L for instance which steered me towards NE.
MIA: Same reasons as LIP, really.
AIA: Idem
BIA: Idem
DATA: It didn't take long for me to realize visualising things is super important during the learning process, and this module offers much more than an oscilloscope which also makes it useful when not using the oscilloscope for anything. So it looks to me like an auto-include.

BOTTOM ROW
PPW: Clock source and limited sequencing, quantizer without adding a separate module for the task (I see mentioned it can quantize, just not seen it in action yet). Had the clock expander besides it but with all the sequencing options already in the box I assumed it's not really needed.
Function Junction: "the easier Maths". I will probably swap to Maths later on when my addiction is permanent, but to cut a little cost and cut some complexity as I'm still a beginner of course I went for FJ. I thought about rampage which is available in VCV Rack, but it's wider than this one so wouldn't fit in the box in the current setup.
Branches: Love to use this in VCV Rack as well so sort of auto-include for me.
Ochd: This is not even a question. I use this thing in close to 100% of my VCV Rack patches. auto-include.
VC EG: I was looking for a CV addressable EG and I use this in VCV Rack too so familiarity made me go this way.
Freak: Awesome sounding multimode filter, also available in VCV Rack so again a familiarity thing.
MFX: FX option with big bang for buck in a small formfactor.
Ghost: Became a fan of it watching Andrew's tube. I know separate dedicated FX options are much more powerful but as these are notoriously expensive and take up quite some rackspace I've cut some corners here. The Ghost also seems to offer options that aren't availble to us when using separate modules.
Channels MK II: I felt the need for a mixing option and this felt extensive enough for the setup. I assume I don't I need more than 4 channels together with the other options I have in the machine. This will give the much needed control when this thing hits the live-scene (if ever).

Doubts:
MFX/Ghost: Although these save a ton of space (and money) I am not completely sure on if I really should. Of course there is plenty reason why the lot of you use separate modules for FX rather than a combined system like Ghost so I might have chosen the wrong option here.
5 voices: Bitbox, LIP, MIA, AIA, BIA. Maybe one or even two too much? Which one would you cut and what would you put in it's place?
Branches: Replace for something with more logic options?
SHTH: I understood that some Sample & Hold modules don't actually hold the Voltage that well over time. Is this one a good one?

I kept myself away from dedicate drum sound modules to force myself to make percussion sounds from scratch using the modules available in the build. I just don't know if that's the right way to go when you are planning on going percussion heavy. Separate Kick to gain more control over it? The one from Erica Synths for instance? Or Kickall from Befaco?

I'm looking forward to any thoughts and remarks you might have on the rack! Thanks in advance for any time and effort someone decides to put into educating and helping me!

Sjleegketting.

I'd drop one of the VCOs to add the DivKid Ochd expansion and maybe another small filter. It really opens things up.

Still haven't used 7U (1U) so hopefully someone else chimes in in that dept.

Function Junction... not sure 'easier Maths'... probably more like poor man's Maths... An objectively lesser capable module. I own both (2x maths... 1x FJ), and while they share similar 'categorical' functionality; just different. FJ sits in a box... in the closet. Might look at Doepfer Dual ADSR or Instruo's Ceis (newly released V2) if you want an "easier" envelope generator. or really any traditional ADSR module.

Too many voices for the size of case is going to be a popular opinion/criticism. BUT... depending on the patch, swapping them out can make sense, so its not like you can't own them. Maybe just keep HP reserved (blank panel for the gap) for a combination of one staple vco and one swap vco. Going to be your call, financially, on that one...

Never tried Ghosts, and probably never will... Modular effects are great to have if you aren't going to be using a computer or outboard/stomp box gear; but I prefer to use in the box/outboard gear fx. Not saying you shouldnt have a module for granular and simple delay/reverbs just to add depth/space. ... I just find 'special' fx modules to never warrant the $; and how could they...? The Arturia bundle is pretty sweet, but I understand not wanting more screen-time added to your day. I have TTA Z5000 -- sounds fine, not special -- MFX -- sounds fine, not special -- and FXAid Pro -- sounds fine, not special. if I kept one... mfx... They are basically akin to a headphone mix for a singer who wants to track with reverb... I run a Metric Halo rig so MIO console gives me zero latency tracking with plugins. That said, I do print Beads reverb regularly.

Also, look into DFAM. Being semi-modular, it can stand next to your rack and create so, so much. Is it perfect? No. Does it have annoying limitations? Yes. Do I still love it? Yes. Using various midi devices really unlocks it... Google dfamThing and mafd. or use a midi controller (keystep) and cv converter.

Enjoy your journey!

EDITED Sep 29th, 06:14

Consider an Expert Sleepers interface so you can have all of VCV inside your rack while you build it up. This is the only no-brainer I see here when you have some modules you already really like in there since it opens up space and saves tons of money on the unsexy stuff like simple VCAs and EGs. The ES mod will also let you avoid "auto-including" wild shit like DATA that's overkill for most people. 4ms MetaModule is coming too, I'd imagine a VCV fiend would love that one!

Your rack is full of mostly digital modules despite coming from VCV rack. Not a problem, but you may want to pick some analog alternatives for those strengths that they provide over digital since you have a wealth of them at your fingertips already. Just depends on how you're patching your voices if this is valid or not.

FX in euro sure as hell doesn't save any money, it's actually stupid the premium spent compared to dedicated FX boxes and pedals. This is a spot where the ES mod could pull major weight. You can also use simple 2-4HP attenuators/level changers/pedal interfaces like that 1u line level module to get into some outboard or pedals. Something like the MFX doesn't make sense to me in euro format without the Axon expander to give it CV inputs, budgeting space for that if you go with it is worth a thought.

Ditch the 1u mult and throw a Guillotine in there. Buffered mults aren't really needed on a case this size especially when your chosen mixer has multiple aux sends. You should check out Ritual Electronics and Bastl btw.

With an electronics tic consider a soldering iron and DIY manufacturers. Saves a good bit and they actually sell decently well secondhand if you end up not liking something you build. Huge difficulty range from soldering everything including SMD parts, to simple through-hole only, to just getting the jacks and pots attached, so you can actually learn this skill while building modules from day 1.

10HP seems like a lot to sacrifice for an ADSR in a rack this size, maybe check out Malekko's Quad Env. With 208hp to work with, this is where swapping the 26HP of Function Junction + Black EG for something like a Doepfer A-143-2 Quad ADSR in the same 26HP or a TTA/Buchla 281t in 28HP may be both a more powerful and attractive option. Sort of the same situation for the filters, you've got 20HP of these (not counting Ghost) which I wouldn't expect alongside multiple dedicated voice modules. What are we doing with these, pinging them for kicks and stuff or deharshing those digital voices? You may prefer a dedicated drum module for pinging, imo the ALM drums are the yin to NE's yang and they're pretty BIA-like in use, look up Tyso-Daiko.

I would personally never pick up Pam's with sequencing as the main intent. She's more of a heroine for syncing modulation and clocks though I dig her euclid options, but you picked up Euclidean Circles so she'd be redundant in that duty. Amazing mod but definitely not an "every rack" module, she's just like Maths actually: do not feel obligated despite the deserved fanfare. I still think she'd be good here since you need the modulation pretty bad.

Don't hesitate to grab some cheapie Behringer mods (used? they're frequently on sale too). I haven't regretted any of the System 55 or ARP 2500 series I grabbed early on and they're all still racked. Their clones of mainstays like Maths could give you an idea if the "real ones" are for you too.

IDK kinda all over the place feedback, if your plan is to recreate your VCV setup on a tabletop then you know what to do, but if not I'd grab the relevant Expert Sleepers interface and build it up slow with the simplest pieces first. Definitely hold off on mods you're not even sure are a fit for the rack you're building like the mixer taking 1/10th of your space.

Not sure if it's intentional or not, but the module next to the Ochd is not the expansion, but the logic module Eas that looks very similar.
Since there's no mention of it (that I can find) in your post I thought it may be an oversight. Apologies if it isn't.

I want to say thanks to you all for the useful suggestions. I already changed it around a bit and removed an osc for some more filtering (Wasp).

I wasn't looking at the Ochd expander but extra logic to do nifty things to my CV as I had some space left when processing other tips I got here, so I added that. I like logic operations in VCV Rack and was missing that in the hardware.

I also already noticed the Expert Sleepers interface. I like it. Surely keeping an eye on that one as it opens many doors via VCV Rack. It might even free up more space as it could stand in for other functions via VCV Rack modules.

I haven't had time yet to consider all the other tips you gave but I will. Thanks a bunch!

update:
I noticed that the Vult Freak is hard to get so I searched for another option and found Intellijels Morgasmatron. It's not as expansive as the Freak but sounds very good in my opinion and has 2 circuits to use. The overdrive circuit looks useful as well, as that seems to fit my preferred sonic profile.
Added an analog sound source to offset all the digital stuff. Thought about cutting an Alia but to hell with that ;)
Replaced the mixer with smaller options to follow up on one of your tips. I mainly opted for the mixer at first because of the send/return options and integrated outputs. Toying around with some other options resulted in more stuff to use.
Added Pico DSP and Pico Out as I got those recently to add to my Cre8audio Nifty Bundle I also recently purchased (darn mono out on this otherwise awesome case sigh). Bought this case to be able to practice with purchased stuff until I have enough of them to warrant a bigger case. This also confronted me with the flexibility a MIDI controller offers so added a module for that.
Added double Disting MK4 as it can do such a heap of things I can safely assume they will add a lot of possibilities and complexity to a patch. And for the heap of things they can do they're relatively cheap as well.
Got rid of the Ghost although I like it to invest that space into more than one module instead.
Practising with PPW in VCV Rack made me cut the Euclidean Circles as I'm starting to get used to the equivalent options in PPW. I also think its 8 outs are enough to offer clocking options and use some for euclidean patterns. I don't see me using more than 3-4 patterns at once coming from PPW and 4-5 clocks seems plenty. I can also get clocks from the Data if need be.
I tried the wasp filter in VCV Rack too and I found it a bit underwhelming for my taste. Added a DJ style filter instead to add a nice performance option.
Also added some small other things derived from lessons I learned in VCV Rack.

Expert sleepers interface, well, I'm in doubt after watching some more vids on it. I'm worried that it adds "too many options". I'm still a novice at this and such a heap of options might overwhelm. I basically want as little modules as possible that need extensive interfacing with a computer. Moving into eurorack was partially motivated by wanting to move away from computers/DAW. The sampler already needs this interfacing to some extend, and I want to keep it at that if I can. When I'm comfortable with this synth, I might still buy it to expand at a later stage.

I think you should decide if you want use the rack more for live performance or for sound design at home. In my opinion these compact synth voices (BIA, LIP, MIA) are good in a live show but when I make sounds in the studio, I usually prefer to patch up my basic Doepfer modules, because I can get more unique "modular sounding" stuff with more control over the sound. If I could go back in time, I'd only get the Bitbox, a few basic modules (vco, vca, lfo, env, etc), cool modulation sources and a matrix mixer. In you case, as others said, integrating VCV rack with Expert Sleepers, would be a huge plus.

Also, I own both the LIP and the Cs-L and the Cs-L is just way more fun for me and covers a wider acoustic palette. YouTube vids don't do justice imho. Complex analog oscillators can get gritty as hell with some distortion, more than the LIP. But they are also more unpredictible, so again, in a live show it may not be what you want.

Thanks for your insights Khimbo!

I was indeed aiming at a live performance case with an emphasis on rythm. I love dnb to death and wanted options to go there if I can so that's the style I was going for. It's the reason why I've put the bitbox in (chopped breaks). I have been drumming for a long time and in any music I listen to I get drawn to the rythm section therefore that idea. I also like the idea of a self sustaining system, "band in a box", to not need anything else besides maybe a MIDI controller to pull off a full set. No idea if I ever get the opportunity to play it live at a venue somewhere but I like to build VCV synths in the same way.

I know the Cs-L from VCV Rack and it's a beast indeed. I was actually considering it when setting up the first take on this, also because I love the aesthetic of Instruo stuff, but got drawn to the grittiness of the LIP. I'm not the kind of person to doubt an expert though, so I swapped the two. I'll take your word for it hehe. I removed the Lorelei as well as the Cs-L can function as two analog voices on its own.

Can you maybe elaborate more on the unpredictability you speak of?

update:
figured that with 4ms interface I can replace anything that would be in it's rackspace. So I went overboard, removed the sampler (as I can build that in VCV) and put in the interface. Also changed MIDI interface to USB based with more sockets to be able to control more than just 2x trigger/CV. Also replaced the DJ filter with TTA's forbidden planet as I heard good things about it and the sound is nice.

As a bonus it's somewhat cheaper and less power hungry than what I had in those places.

EDITED Oct 21st, 11:53