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Hey, pretty nice tune right there !

Love my PHmk3, that thing is bonkers, sounds kinda plain but I really love those faders, genius to place them there, makes the module really playable once you get to know the WT (or come with your own). Its great set of features, large sonic palette on offer and fantastic interface design makes it well worth the asking price IMHO.

I can't see the video, it tells me it's unavailable, is it just me ?

Let me start by saying that I’m really enjoying this conversation, it’s challenging my way of seeing my build and what’s possible with what I have. This is the exact reason I started this thread, and boy did I get what I asked for ! My brain hurts, but it’s a good hurt :-)

@ both
Garfield, you mention the second big rack, and Lugia talks about a 4ms pod. I also still have my 7U from Intellijel which I started on, it’s the case I use during short holidays to focus on some aspects of my modules. As much as possible, I would like to stay within the bounds of 14U for now. First of all, I do intend to move and I might get a bigger space and therefore a bigger desk, but that’s far from guaranteed and my desk is really cramped. I’m not dismissing the idea entirely but it would at least need to wait until March when I’m in the new house and I know what I can work with. There’s also the fact that confining myself to 14U is a good way to not go completely broke in the next months, if you know what I mean ;)

@GarfieldModular: To CV is a verb I use on a regular basis, definitely a thing lol.

The case you make for different kinds of VCA’s is pretty compelling. I have a switch for a +6db boost on each channel of the Intellijel Quad VCA which has been enough for me so far, but it's limited in use and it’s true that sometimes an extra « oomph » could come in handy, yet I still can’t bring myself to consider such a change for now. As Lugia said, I need to make a few theory builds, look at his take on it, and think for a long while. With this discussions, I’m starting to see patching my system in a new light so who knows, in a few days I might just change my tune regarding a « big » change in VCAs for the rack. I’ll definitely check out the demos of Punch !

Thanks for sharing your demo of the Erica Dual VCF, you got some really crazy sounds out of it :-) The more I look at that module, the more I want it. It wasn’t on my radar anymore after we talked about it almost a year ago I think, but now I remember why I wanted it in the first place, I really like the features and I/O it offers, very inviting to experimentation. What I’m after is filters that will go crazy in a « musical » way (to me, of course) when messed with, like the Belgrad for example. Playing with the span of the peaks while also bordering self-oscillation and a generous touch of cross-mod (thank you, Tito switch), I get such beautiful noises, it’s poetry to my ears. I have the same high hopes for the Erica filter… If I’m honest, I’m already very convinced, but I have a principle to at least sit for a while on buying decisions of that importance, for money as well as for build consistency reasons.

@Lugia:

I’m sorry you also lost your answer and more importantly, thank you for taking the time to write another one, it must have taken you a while so thank you for that !

Logic & clock: I’m definitely convinced the Logic 202 is going to find its way in the build, now I’m even thinking 202 first and Kinks second. Because yes, I think that I should be able to manage a Kinks in there too and I feel like it would come in very handy as well, I’ve been eyeing it for a while already. Would it be too much with the 202 already in there ? For the clock, I’m still leaning on me being able to get the effects you describe (cool ideas indeed, all going in my little « to try » modular notes) with a Time Apprentice in the 1U section and sometimes an output or two from PNW. Definitely going to stare at this for a while as you very well put it, that remark will remain valid for the rest of this post :)

EG-like modules: I’m now starting to see what you describe, a big modulation section working as a CV orchestra of sorts, and yeah, it has my grey cells working triple shifts, but it’s beautiful. I have already approached patches of that nature thanks to having Maths and the crazy Zadar now in the build, but I never saw things in the light of a wider approach. I’m very sold on the Quadrax and its expander, a little less on the QPLFO, although I do understand your point and of course fully agree that using the O&C for LFO’s is somewhat sad. I removed the double ADSR for now to have more room, I’m thinking Stages can provide one (at the cost of 4 channels, but OK) and I could also install Hemisphere on the O&c and use a side to produce ADSRs. Also, I don’t find myself using those so much in the way I patch so far, actually that came as a surprise to me when I went from classic synths to modular. Less ideal, though, so if I can find a way for it to come back in the rack, why not.

Varigate8+: aargh, you make such good points and the more I think about it, the more I see it’d be a very very good idea, so much power. Must resist … the dark side…. My wallet just rose an eyebrow in disapproval, but he’s seen worse.
I already get a glimpse of the power of ready-to-drop sequences with the little memory on the VB, and it’s very nice indeed, I use it a lot. Having a hundred of those would be almost too much. I also need to think about wether or not it introduces too much complexity in the system, it’s not that I don’t like menus but I want to keep a relatively small number of menu/complex button combo based modules in the rack, in order to keep the flow going when I patch. Manual reading, demo watching and more pondering will happen before I actually buy anything anyway, but I have a sort of plan presented below and it’s in there. Feels a bit like a waste to sell a large gate sequencer (my Robaux SWT16+) just to get another, but I did get the Robaux before getting my VB, and now VG makes a lot more sense… Oh well, you live, you learn.

Bitbox: keeping it for now, but we’ll see in the long run, it would free up some nice cash and generous HP space, and I can do sampling easily in the MPC too. How easy and practical the workflow really is, I don’t know yet, still have to test the waters a bit but so far so good, which is why I haven’t touched my Bitbox lately. When it's all running together though, I'd have to see how practical it is to add sampling on the fly in my MPC workflow instead of the ease of having the Bitbox always there...

Voices: Wow, I just got schooled :-) Using the filters as voices is clearly something I don’t do often enough. I mean, I know of it, and I’ve done it a few times (even with the Viol Ruina which doesn’t really track 1/oct haha), but how ready am I to commit to that and rock those as VCO’s on a sort of permanent basis, man, we’ll see. But all these ideas you shared, pure gold. Believe it or not, I never patched a voice comprised of the PH and C-sL together, not once, shame on me. I guess my excuse is that they’re so complex in themselves, there’s so much to explore, that exploring them as a voice with another VCO is something that completely eluded me, maybe I was already having too much fun as is. I also can’t believe that I can only remember one unique time when I played with Belgrad as a voice, despite loving it so much (what a fun time that was). The build proposed below is still organized like I did it before but essentially it retains the same functionality if I’m not missing anything, and I’m thinking about copying it to another rack on MG and playing with module placement to try different approaches, or maybe copy your reworked build and start from there.

Stereo: yes, yes, and more yes, in fact that’s also an important reason why I’d like to get the Erica Dual VCF in there. It would also be my second Lester of sorts, I have this idea that it’s better to try different flavors when it comes to modules so closely tied to sound timbre, more variety at my disposal and all that, could be a gross misconception on my part, I really don't know but it's worked for me so far. Otherwise I would already own 3 or 4 Belgrad filters, and using them as voices wouldn’t be so rare anymore :-) That Takaab is a no brainer though, almost feels like I could use a couple (second eyebrow raise by my wallet).

Modulation: this is the section that I have the most ease approaching for some reason. It all makes sense, it’s like a word you’re looking for and someone just says it out loud for you, now sparse ideas that I could never link together in my head are starting to make sense. I guess it’s like with Maths, I’ll start getting new ideas by patching and experimenting, that is what makes it so hard for me to chose how to evolve without having tried that new build.

Tetrapad: aargh-bis, excellent arguments again. I’ve explained the situation above about extra cases but yeah, I totally see the power of casing that in a 4ms pod or some other small case. For now, it’s still in the 14U plans, but I’m not buying all the update at once anyway so I’ll have a lot of time and some practice with new modules to decide how things will go. My wallet just tore his eyebrows off in anger, I'll go patch to calm him down.

New version of the build I have as a result of your kind help, the first wave of pondering, thinking and other slight headaches (the extra bottom row is modules that I would sell as a result of the reshuffling - I may decide to keep the Mixups anyway, they come in real handy when I make smaller systems in the 7U travel case) :

DHL is coming tomorrow to pick up the Intellijel Quad VCA going in repairs (kuddos for an incredibly efficient and nice support team @ Intellijel) so I’ll be without proper VCAs (quite a few hidden in the system, not as flexible though), and even before that I didn’t have enough, far from it. Therefore I’m going to place an order soon for the double VCA 1U and I’d like to add another, probably the new Veils although Garfield did make me want to investigate more on that. Depending on finances (the house move might hurt a bit, I might need some extra furniture and all that), I’ll order soon after the Quadrax + expander and then the Tetrapad+Tête, in that order of priority. I have a local deal on the Erica VCF so I’ll check that out, and I’ll also order the Shakmat clock divider if DIY shops do deliver, I want to get on that soldering iron again, so much fun. Speaking of uncertain deliveries, does anyone know if EMW has retailers in the EU ? MG lists only Thomann but they don’t seem to have the Logic 202 on offer. If no one here knows, I’ll write them an email to ask if they can get it, we’ll see, EMW says on their website that due to COVID, their sales are temporarily paused so that might not be for the very near future :-(

Well, that’s it for me, I’ll go back to patching my current system and try some of the experiments Lugia suggested, this will help me think and decide what I buy first in a week or so.
Thank you as always for all the help and the time you spend on this, on top of helping countless others.

A little early, I’m wishing you all the best for 2021 and I send you all good vibes to inspire you while you make music !

Take care,
D.

Dark and drone in the same sentence, as far as I'm concerned, Loquelic Iteritas is king of my castle. Not exactly the same price, but you may be able to get one on the 2nd hand market: https://www.modulargrid.net/e/noise-engineering-loquelic-iteritas

The Cursus Iteritas might also be worth a look if you want to stay in the realm of wavetables, although its of course the Noise Engineering take on it, not your typical VCO.

That being said, the LI only made me hungry for its amazing Percido version, but that's another budget... :-)

All the best,
D.

Hi fellow knobs wigglers !

THANK YOU FOR YOUR COMMENTS !!
I actually wrote an answer yesterday, forgot to save somewhere else and didn’t have time to write it again after that. Oh well

@Lugia: My God, this is excellent, are you getting tired of me thanking you for the knowledge sharing ? Because I’m not tired of reading your rack rehauls, so many ideas !! I have many questions as well, sorry for the wall of text but I feel it makes things clear at least.
- Modulation section: Finally, it looks like something that makes sense as a whole. I was not considering those logic functions you included, for some reason those eluded me during my VCVRack training sessions, but I’ll definitely go try asap as it sounds like fun. I really like the group you made, with crossfader, mixer and VCA, I think I’d feel more at ease even with only the modules I own but grouped like that.
- Quad LFO: I have the O&C that I use exactly for that when I need slow LFO’s, the Quadraturia app offers an incredible range, from audio rate to several hours for a single cycle (lol) and also offers the tap tempo functionality (which I never use, maybe I should, here’s an exercise). Plus between Ochd and the Octasource, there’s already a lot of LFO fun to be had. Zadar can also do some crazy stuff.
- Quadrax and double ADSR: same remark as above (makes sense, EG and LFOs are similar in nature), there is the Piqued app which offers me 4 envelopes when needed. Not the same as above though, this is the app the O&C ends up on most of the time, and Stages is often used for that as well. I’m not sure I need yet another EG, but freeing the flexible O&C and Stages for other things on a permanents basis isn’t a bad thing. Quadrax (how useful is the expander ?) will therefore stay if there is room, or the ADSR, maybe both. I prefer the added crazy functionality on the Quadrax of course…
- Fractio Solum: I like the idea of having a separate clock divider, or rather I should say I hate “wasting” PNW’s outputs for clock division duties; I’m thinking I could, instead of investing in a 3U modules, get one of those Shakmat Time Apprentice to replace the 1U passive mult on the second 1U row. Big bonus is that I get to build that one myself from a kit, that’s always fun (and cheap).
- Varigate 8+: I’ve been hesitating a lot with including another gate sequencer in my rack. In fact, I still have my Robaux SWT16+ for sale right now, an excellent 16 tracks (!) gate sequencer with a bunch of cool features. I just felt like I was hardly ever using it, it was meant to be used with percussions modules most of which I sold after getting the MPC but now I usually generate simple patterns with PNW or use one of the Hermod tracks to trigger the HH and Bitbox. The way I use Bitbox is mainly to record loops out of other voices, and trigger them by hand, I’ve considered getting rid of it too, the MPC can do all that very well, and turning it on next to the rack isn’t a big effort. Am I crazy, should I keep the SWT16+ or buy a Varigate ? Really can’t decide here…
- Mutes: nice gotcha on the cv control over AUX sends, I always forget that. Not sure how useful that would be for me though, I don’t see myself modulating that so much, I usually set and forget values. Mutes is a nice to have, but since I’m hardly ever using both inputs on the Mixer, I often can use the A/B switch as a mute, by not using the second input. I’d probably skip this, especially if it means I get space for something like Tetrapad.
- Panning Mixer: whaaaaat ? I had no idea something like that existed. Can you use something like that with different VCO outputs ? Imagine that… If I can get my hands on one, I’ll bite, the issue will most likely finding one at a decent price but I definitely want to try it !

This is where I’m starting to get lost:

• Percussions and Bionic Lester n°2: Hahaha, excellent, hadn’t realized there was a second Lester hiding behind the PH (at least that’s how I see it). I don’t actually have 2, unfortunately, that’s just a bug I have sometimes. And I like the thing, but 2 of them, one on percussions? Sure, I’ll try my BIA into the one I have, that experiment is due anyway, but the Lester is in my view, somewhat of a specialist filter, I’m not sure I’d know what to do with it on a percussions section. Using it on the output of the Bitbox makes sense to me though, but again, do I prefer that over using the MPC and its very decent filters ? I guess not, if I’m honest. The more I think about this, the Bitbox is extraneous, I’d just keep the BIA (is it drums, is it a synth ? who knows, who cares, it’s bloody awesome), and the HH just because I built that myself, but I don’t think a Eurorack rhythm section is for me…
• Voices: I’m very lost here lol. You grouped the 2 main VCOs, do you see them more as a single voice ? You removed the Dual filter from Erica, you didn’t like the idea (as I said above, I’d like another stereo VCF if I consider having 1 C-sL and PH as separate voices, plus I think the many simultaneous outputs are a really interesting feature that could go well with my setup) ? Is the Lester at the end of the 1st row meant for the LIP or for the big synth voice ?
• What about Tetrapad ? That’s probably my most desired module right now, mainly to greatly improve the way I can play my patches, to play the thing more like an instrument. I’m willing to make sacrifices to include it in the rack.
• I like experimenting with feedback, so what about that Matrix Mixer ? I feel like that and an Instruo tanh[3] could be very useful for that kind of noise, and could perhaps make my desire for a ResEq much less pressing.

@GarfieldModular: I had never considered that side of things, I only have Intellijel VCA’s for now and found them absolutely clean, I should probably carefully experiment and compare when I get a chance. Also never considered feeding both exponential and linear CV into a single VCA, but now that I think of it, it has a few interesting implications. But I can’t bring myself to dedicate 20HP to 2 VCA’s.
Re QPAS, I actually had it for a while, but just didn’t gel with it. I liked having the simultaneous outputs there, and the interface is great, but the sonic character of it wasn’t for me. I tried to make it work and even had fun with it (of course), but didn’t see myself keeping it in the long run. The Erica one sounds great with audio rate modulation, from what I hear in demos, what is your experience with that ? How controllable is resonance, when you bring it at the edge of self-oscillation ?

Take care !
Diego

Dear Garfield,

Thanks for your comment, I think it's not the same track I shared earlier, but maybe it was, I clearly don't finish enough music, I need to dial down on the pointless jamming in favor of more output... :-)

I'll see if I can demo the Waldorf DVCA somewhere but from the get go, I'm not sure I could take advantage of its particularities. It's 20HP for 2 VCA's where the new Veils offers 4 of them in only 10HP or something like that. From where I stand, the color knob needs to be incredible to justify the extra HP and cost, but maybe I'm missing something ? In all honesty, I probably lack imagination, in my mind the only advantage a VCA module could have over another is the interface, buttons/knobs/jacks placement etc, but not the sound, am I wrong ?

You might be right for the availability of the Dual VCF, it's just that some stores already marked it as sold out, which usually means it's getting rolled out. Also, it's heavily discounted on Erica's website which also usually means they're trying to sell off the stock. Wait & see, I guess, I'm still not entirely decided on what to do, although I do want a dual filter, and this one with all the individual outs seems like a very useful one for my setup and the way I patch, plus it sounds pretty good... There's one for sale locally, might just give in...

Finally, about the WMD mixer: it's probably the best euro mixer I have tried, but I didn't try them all hehe. Let's clear your doubts first: no bleed whatsoever, or noise for that matter, it's very clean. Looking for cons, maybe the panning knob's curve could be smoother (still very workable, I'm being a Karen here), or returns could be stereo and I'd like to have 3 sends instead of 2. How much would the mixer cost in the end if everyone got what they wanted ? Too much, probably.

Take care,
Diego

Very very nice ! Loads of cool moments there, really loving the sound that you are playing with at 5:30, I think it's the same that sort of "cries" at 6:40, seems well behaved but sometimes goes over the edge in a noisy kind of way, genius ! Is that the E330 ?

Anyway thanks for sharing and keeping us inspired ;-)

@Lugia: thank you so very much for the above. I know and understand all the above on a theoretical level but you add the "how to practice", just when I was looking to spice up my patching.
Yet another drink I owe you. If we put those together for all the people you help, you could probably open a bar :D

Hi all ! Merry Xmas !!

All right, it’s my time to ask for advice and opinions on how to extend my rack. This is what I currently have (and already enjoy a lot):

I use my setup to generate most of the synth lines in my music, the drums, one shots and what not are handled by an MPC Live (mk1 so no CV outs) which also sends MIDI sync to the Hermod. I of course sample the LIP and BIA quite a bit for drum duties, but it’s a quick sample/loop that goes straight in the MPC. I also sometimes use the rack on its own to jam so that why you see the Prok HH there, although the main reason was that I wanted to build something lol. For those who want to get an idea of the sort of « music » I make (although I haven’t posted much of the modular music yet):
The placement of modules follows the patching I found myself making the most because that’s what made most sense in my head but I also often patch the C-sL into Sisters or Belgrad so there is nothing fixed.

And this is the plan I have for now:

Let me explain the changes:

• I need more VCA’s ! I’m coming from a smaller setup with less everything, where the Quad VCA made sense but it’s clearly too little now. Even the mixer I use to mix & match waveforms from the C-sL could be a Quad VCA instead, it would probably be more fun, being able to control the mix by hand AND cv ! So I removed the Mixup and added a Quad VCA from Doepfer and a small double VCA in the 1U row. For now…

• I need multi tracking ! For now I thought of adding the expander for my mixer, I’d lose the effects on the recording but I suppose I should consider the Mimeophon as a 1 track effect (like the Chorus from the 1U effects, for example) instead of a send, it’s a bit noisy as a send anyway. I’m very open to ideas on how to do things better, though !

• I like having 2 different filters with the C-sL but I miss a proper stereo VCF for that voice I feel, so I thought of repurposing the Viol Ruina to an effect duty, and introduce the Erica Stereo VCF in the mix (if I can find one, I think they’re discontinued but I see some on the 2nd hand market).

• I don’t like having to sacrifice the Disting for logic duties (or worse, Maths), so a Kinks could come in very handy I reckon.

• I’m using one of the Intellijel Mixups which are remains of my old build as mixers for feedback paths and what not, but a matrix mixer would be so much better, so I think building the AI Synthesis is almost a must-do for me.

• Added the ResEq in the hope that I could figure out how to properly order parts for the build. Or buy one already made. Anyway, looks like a lot of sound timbre fun to be had, I mean, it just ticks too many boxes of what is fun for me (feedback, distortion, band rejection, oh boy).

• The times when I wish I had more cv inputs on the Zadar are sorta rare but I figure those + the trigs for each channel would be nice to have.

• Finally I’d like to have some sort of hands-on controller, to be able to trigger voices and or modulation, the Tetrapad seems like a perfect fit, probably a lot more so than the Pressure Points. I still need to investigate how necessary Tête really is.

Anyway, enough of what I think, let’s hear what you think ! What would you change ? What do you think of my plan for the future, am I missing something glaringly obvious (or very obscure) ?
Looking forward to read your opinions and thank you in advance for your time !

Take care !
D.

EDITED Dec 26th 2020, 18:42

Guess I will NEVER be buying anything they allude to ever in my life!
-- Kel_

But what do they allude to ? I don't even understand what he's on about... What are those "classics" I never heard of ? What is a website drop, what are Astroworld hoodies ? What about fellow "ragers" ? The world of the intellectually challenged is so mysterious !

Even more curious is how the guy created an account here on the 17th, and even went as far as to create 2 empty racks (takes a few clicks, you can't really automate that), then waited a full week to post something, only to post a failed copy-paste (how do you fail a copy/paste ? Another mystery here straight from the lands of the brainless) which won't be driving anyone to anything because there's so much failure here one couldn't make sense of it even if one tried.

I choose to believe that he's in fact a secret agent working for the aliens and using this forum as a way to communicate with other agents, the above is clearly a coded message. The mention of Astroworld gave it away...

Note that the Audio I/O module from Intellijel is discontinued. They have split it in 2, Stereo Line Out and Stereo Line In, a total of 20HP instead of the 24HP used by Audio I/O.

I'd say Pico DSP, leds don't match the BBD (AFAIK it has no led on the front panel) but they do match those on the panel of the DSP. By the way, it's 3HP, not 2.

Hola Cacharrada,

For example Rubadub seems to have Pam's in stock, if that's the question. ModularGrid lists a few sites to purchase modules but not all of them, so sometimes it's worth looking around some more ;-)

Now that I look a bit closely at the rack and Garfield's comments, I second his remark about an extra filter and reiterate the fact that what Pam's can offer in the realm of CV modulation sources is what I feel is missing from the proposed rack. LoL, now I almost feel like I'm selling the thing :-D

Saludos,
Diego

PS: foto de paella -> ahora tengo hambre :-)

Hi there,

Just chiming in to vouch for Pam's many uses and quality. It's much more than a clock module, it's gots euclidean patterns, stepped CV, LFO's, you name it. Clever patching of the unit (like feeding some outputs to its own CV inputs) paired with the BIA you have in your rack is guaranteed to keep you entertained for a while, I reckon. I think it deserves its place in the Top Rated and Most Popular lists.
I don't mind the menu diving so much myself as I often only use 1 or 2 channels for modulation that require me to go change settings on a regular basis. After a few hours with it, muscle memory sets in and since the menu system is well thought of, it's rather easy to navigate. But it is after all menu based, there is only one encoder so if menus are not your thing, maybe try to test the unit first if you can, or carefully watch this excellent demo by Divkid a few times:

And Garfield, it's got a BPM display too :)

Take care !

I believe most of the 1U stuff you've picked is in the 1U Intellijel format. So as long as your case is Intellijel, you're good.

However the RE Guillotine is not in the Intellijel format. It's not going to fit in an Intellijel rack.
-- Ronin1973

Can I ask where you got your info about the Guillotine ? I'm interested in the module as well, precisely because I think it is an Intellijel format one. The demo version shown in the video is fitted in an Intellijel case, as are all their other 1U stuff on demo, and the only 1U module they have for sale on their website now, a 4hp blank, is advertised as Intellijel format too.
Everything else is made by Intellijel so by definition compatible, except the u3A which is made by Transient Modules, I own one and confirm it's in Intellijel format as well.

Your modules are on the far right side, scroll the page to the right.

Clearly a very sad appeal for attention from a sad lonely loser... very sad!!

-- Kel_

• Triptych of Earthly Vanity and Divine Salvation by Hans Memling (1480's)
• Judith Beheading Holofernes by Caravaggio (1590's)
• Heads Severed by Théodore Géricault (1810's)
• Saturn Devouring His Son by Francisco Goya (1820's)
• Deterioration of Mind Over Matter by Otto Rapp (1970's)

Sad lonely losers, the whole lot of them ?
Also, did you just make a link between blank panels and the rise of modern feudalism ? I'll printscreen this to show to the people who ask me why I don't interact with others much on the internet...

You asked for another VCO that might go well together with the Plaits (I would go for the original one, better user interface, which is important, for me at least), I think the Make Noise - STO might be a good choice. I use these two (Plaits & STO) quite often together and I am with both more than just happy, they belong to my favourite oscillators.
-- GarfieldModular

I will not address the whole rack (I have new modules in my rack so burning to go patch those), but since this is between parenthesis here and haven't seen it mentioned elsewhere, I want to direct your attention to the presence of many "mini" versions of modules and what it implies: it's not for everyone, and the more of them you have, the harder it can become for some people to play the system. I say "for some people" because the Erica Pico System seems to be well received but I find it very hard to operate a system comprised of only tiny modules, possible but not confortable.
I guess the point I'm trying to make is please do not dismiss that aspect as being inconsequential and think about whether or not you could be bothered by the concentrated nature of the UI in the proposed rack.

Good luck for the rest of the planning ;-)

Diego

I’m no expert since I don’t actually own one, but I’m almost certain what you described can be achieved with the Squarp Pyramid I already mentioned.

Also, the Varigate is a fantastic module but it doesn’t do what you seem to think it does. At this point, my suggestion would be to do a lot more research about existing midi sequencers you consider easy enough to purchase, reading product manuals carefully and what not, as well as reading about basic modular concepts such as gates vs CV etc, and probably also have a look at a few 1st rack advice threads on this forum which contain a ton of answers to many usual questions.

standalone random melody boxes, that could simply send a midi-signal into my Model:Samples or Cycles, but such a thing does'nt exist.
-- jrs77

That statement is too incomplete, as it stands it sounds incorrect. What is random melodies for you ? The moment the notes are generated, the length of the notes, the pitch of the notes, the velocity, all of that combined ?
Pretty sure that between the Elektron stuff, the Pyramid and others, one could achieve a lot of randomness in MIDI sequences without requiring to use Eurorack tools. Hell, I didn't even need anything when I was trying to achieve random patterns on my Elektron machines, clever use of probability and conditional trigs did the trick, I was able to achieve never repeating patterns with little effort. Did you try that, why doesn't it work for you ?
You're going to need to explain better what you want to achieve, "random melody" is not enough, also if we are to recommend a Euro setup to achieve your goals.

Hi !

Don't take this the wrong way but this rack is essentially a much less capable and more expensive version of the desktop Manther. I quickly read the product page for the desktop version and it seems it's capable of randomizing its sequences, amongst many other features that are missing from the above rack, so if your goal is 'only' to get the sound of Manther and random sequences while playing nice with the rest of your Elektron-based setup, I'd say the desktop version would be better suited for that rather than getting a small rack like the one above. Maybe the Elektronauts forum has a thread on the Manther where people share their experiences with Manther + Elektron machines ? You can also get randomness from some sequencers such as Squarp Pyramid paired with any synth of your choice.
I suggest reading this excellent thread before going further: https://www.modulargrid.net/e/forum/posts/index/3579
Make sure Eurorack is the answer to what you seek before making such investment, it is wonderful on many levels but can also be a sub-par solution for many situations too. For the same money the rack above would cost, you can get a desktop Manther AND a Behringer semi-modular to start playing with patch cables if you also want to do that (and those usually have MIDI I/O so they can play nice with your other stuff).
If you're curious about what Eurorack is and what it offers, the thread I suggest above also offers some perspective on that but there also was another created after which looks at the subject from a different standpoint: https://www.modulargrid.net/e/forum/posts/index/8681

I hope I was able to offer you some perspective and food for thoughts as my goal is to get you the most for your money ;-)

Have a good one.

D.

Hi !

Just jumping in to attract your attention to the 1U formats that exist: there are 2 competing formats, Pulp Logic tiles and Intellijel. The Palette case is made for the Intellijel format, it is not compatible with Pulp Logic sized module.
In the build above, I'm pretty sure the Atten-B are not compatible with a Palette case, and I have my doubts about the Unity Mixer as well. An Intellijel Quadratt (or Duatt) provides mixing and attenuation in the Intellijel format, and I also know of Transient Modules who are also making Intellijel compatible 1U modules, including a mixer.

Hope this help :)

+1 here too, great idea !

• I have an issue with Thonk caused by X and Z, here's my story with no details
• Really, can you explain this a bit more though ? This is too vague.
• I have an issue with Thonk caused by Y
• Wait, where is X and Z now ?
• I will now stop explaining.

Indeed, let's leave the public to decide.

First post speaks about a "misread comment" and implies the refund is blocked by an "expected apology", all that is gone in the second post... Apparently Thonk answered when you initiated the Paypal claim, but that is left out. The "misread comment" is also left out. According to my calculations, 2 weeks after the 24th of March was yesterday, a bit more than a week after the set deadline, which isn't completely out of the understandable realm given that Thonk proposed a refund because of delays I'm assuming. So far, it looks like you're PayPal claiming someone because they are late. I'm also not getting the "urgent purchase" during the confinement times, I certainly wouldn't count on accurate delivery times lately, wouldn't even be surprised if PayPal takes it into account. I'd like to sympathize with you but I need a coherent story.

There is a whole marketplace on this website...accessed with the (quite obvious) blue button labelled "Offer on Marketplace".

I really enjoyed this content, production is really really good. I'm unsure if you wanted to make a piece of art but in my eyes, that is what you achieved, on top of the message itself. Well done, wish I had your talent for video, thanks for sharing !

Thanks, yes, I did, but now I was just testing again and I'm seeing weird things, so I have to assume the problem is linked to my browser not updating the page after clicking the button, probably some extension that is misbehaving. Just tried from my phone and it's working fine.

I wonder if that's a feature that is not working, or if I missed something, but I wonder how the search works for modules, I made the simple test:

• click the Reset button
• type "Plaits" in the search field and press the Search button
• observe that https://www.modulargrid.net/e/other-unknown-mutable-instruments-plaits-eurorack-synth-oscillator-clone-module-black-magpie-textured and I'm guessing similar other modules do not appear in the results although the name of the module contains Plaits

Now, my understanding of a search bar is more or less SELECT * FROM x WHERE name LIKE "%mysearchterm%" but obviously that's not happening here, so what gives ? Is the search bar broken or is my logic broken ? :)

P.S.: shouldn't that module name be corrected ? Eurorack, Synth, Oscillator and Module all seem pretty useless...

What was your first VCO? How many did you get?
-- funbun

My first were the Erica Synths Black Wavetable VCO and Instruo TsL. After some weeks with the first modules, I also got Plaits form Mutable Instruments.

Is there a such thing as too many VCOs?
-- funbun

Depends on space in the rack and funds in your pockets I suppose. Nothing wrong with having loads of VCO's, they can be used as great sources of modulation. But they occupy rack space and cost money, so too many is when you have a near VCO-only rack or when you're broke from buying too many of them :)

I will start by mentioning what other equipment I have around me at this point:

Soundcraft Sound Signature 10
Faderfox Pc & Mx 12
Iconnectivity Mi010
Circuit Happy Missing Link

These are units that, more or less, I think they could take part or not in the future discussions.
-- Tnsl

I'm not sure what you mean by that. The Soundcraft is a mixer so no issue. Faderfox, Iconnectivity and Circuit Happy are all MIDI devices though, so it really depends on whether or not your Eurorack setup can accommodate that much MIDI input and if you want to spend HP for modules making the MIDI to CV conversion.

My first question is: How much importance should I give to this specific case knowing that one row is 1u and It Has to be intellijel utility modules? Should I go on a case without 1u modules ? How efficient are those Intellijel 1u modules to cover the needs of a beginner ? Is it safe to invest in a case like that, knowing that I would have to use Only Intellijel modules for that particular row?
-- Tnsl

The way I see it, the 7U isn't such a big case (but that's highly dependent on the build I personally have in mind for myself, a very personal perception of what is needed in a rack). Therefore, any HP I can save in the 3U space is welcome, and the compatible (again, watch out for Pulp Logic vs Intellijel) 1U offering by Intellijel and a couple of other manufacturers helps me tremendously. I'm particularly fan of the O&C in 1U format, as well as the quad attenuverter, couldn't live without those (I have 2 now, thinking about getting a 3rd). Something to consider: cases with a 1U row seem considerably more expensive than their equivalent without, but 1. you save space and 2. sometimes the 1U module is a bit less expensive than its 3U equivalent.
As Lugia said, Intellijel is not the only player in the 1U Intellijel space. The offering is limited but there is already quite a lot of interesting utilities in my opinion. What is less "safe" is the "lock in" situation: once you get into 1U, you will need to get rid of all your 1U modules if you pick a case without that row, or you will need to limit yourself to options with a 1U row as well (I went with that when I evolved out of my 7U).

If you are worried about the usability, I find that the 1U row on the 7U is ideally placed and the modules design is usually taking the form factor into account so that's not much of an issue. But if indeed you can't see the usefulness of an attenuverter, a linear VCA or a slew limiter, please do follow Lugia's advice and get some experience with free software, it will help you make a better plan based on YOUR patching techniques and related needs.

Hopefully this helps. Welcome to MG :)

I started with an Intellijel 7U. Nothing bad about that one in particular (good starter option, in fact), but indeed I thought initially that the ambitious plan I made before having my first rack wouldn't change too much. I was of course very wrong and as soon as I had my first evening with my first rack, a lot changed and I ended up making more plans. I now have an MDLR 14U and can

• try out modules that a friend lends me
• swap modules in my rack without having to worry about replacing it with a module of the same size, and not necessarily the same function. I may end up with a weird rack layout if I have to place my modules in my rack to make everything fit
• find space in the rack for "cable rivers" that would otherwise cover several modules entirely, reducing playability
• plan more rack evolution plans as I experiment, without worrying about the cost of a new case

I sense that to end up with a small setup that is efficient, interesting and playable, one needs quite a lot of Eurorack experience. Thus the advice for beginners: plan a wayyyy bigger rack than what you have in mind at first, especially if you've never touched modular before.

You can submit modules yourself: Modules > Submit a module.
Copy the info form the existing Yarns and it's done ;)

I'm now investigating into some VCA/enveloppe and/or LFO/enveloppe (any input appreciated).

For VCA's, my first one was a quad VCA from Intellijel, I still like being able to adjust the response between linear and exponential as well as the mixing possibilities. 4 VCA's was more than enough to start messing around in my first rack, I could have done with even less at the start. That being said, consider that a VCA is not only for audio but can also be used to control modulation (=cv) amplitude, so it's not necessarily 1 voice = 1 VCA. And on the other hand, some modules like Plaits, Plonk or Basimilus Iteritas Alter have integrated VCA's which are amazing space savers. Mutable Instruments Veils is another option similar to the Intellijel one, there are also many others so take your time to pick a module. Since you played with VCV, did you try experimenting with using VCAs to control CV modulation or even AM synthesis (amplitude modulation) ? Some practice using VCA's in your VCV patches should give you an idea of how many you like to use. If you really can't decide, start small, I suppose.

For LFO's, Garfield convinced me to get the Erica Synths Octasource and I'm grateful he did, it's loads of fun. The only "drawback" is that it looks like a simple module but it actually took me time to learn how to best use its particularities, clever patching is everything here and that's not easy when you're starting out (wasn't a problem for long though). Oh yeah, it's also not on the cheap side, albeit worth the asking price IMO. Another option I see recommended a lot is the Batumi, looks like a good module to me, less on the crazy side I think. In my rack, I also have a Mutable Instruments Stages which can be configured to offer up to 6 LFO's. The amount of options here is simply overwhelming, the best advice I think I can offer is again, take your time to select what suits you best. That being said, I don't think one could go wrong with any of the options mentioned.

For envelopes, I haven't tried enough options to really recommend anything, but I'd say decide first what sort of envelope you need. For example, I quickly realized, before I got into modular, that I'm generally fine with AD envelopes and rarely need a Hold stage (which stays open while the gate is held) or a full ADSR. I picked the Stages to be able to select the envelope type per patch, that kind of flexibility is really nice.
I feel like at this point I should mention Maths since you are considering a rack with more space. Maths is a large module but it's definitely worth it if you can afford spending some cash and 20HP on it. It's an amazing tool to teach newcomers about what I call "clever patching techniques": amongst its many uses are being an LFO or being an EG but there's a video out there (I think by Loopop) of it being used as sort of a Subharmonicon so really, sky is the limit. Also, you might not need that A-171-2 if you end up getting a Maths.

As this rack also serves an educational purpose I still hope I could get started doing 'something' with these few modules modules and get a taste of what's missing from this point.

Do you think I still can enjoy the basic concepts with this setup before going further?

Sure, if I were you I would even start with only one voice to begin getting a feel for it, you can always buy more later. Full disclosure, I didn't, but I'm definitely greedy :) You have the option to sample the voice into the DT and make another patch if you can live with sacrificing a DT voice for a while. I think that for the learning part of the experience, getting a Disting is a great idea, you can try many types of modular functionalities with it and discover which ones are worth getting their own module.

Oh by the way, what is the A-183-3 for ?

Hi Gastonn,

Excellent advice by Garfield as usual, I would like to add my voice (no pun intended) to the "you probably will need a bigger rack" team. Let's see if I can explain why.

If you want to create a multi-voice modular system (so at least 2 voices), you will already need at least 2 sound sources, here I can only see the Dixie and the STO, excellent in their own right but using the Dixie as a VCO prevents you from comfortably using it as an LFO. How many LFO's you need is a question of taste but just Disting (+ maybe Dixie) on LFO duties is not nearly enough for me.
Sound source is not the only thing you would need more of, in my opinion:
- I would definitely need more envelopes, at least one for the filter. One could do without it, of course, but it would make me sad.
- I would also need another filter for the 2nd voice. Another module that could use modulation like LFO's and envelopes, most likely.
- Ideally, I would like a (cv controllable, if possible) mixer/vca to mix waveforms from the VCO's and get some timbre variation

Let's look at the whole project as well, how much of it could not be achieved with a more "traditional" synth like the Elektron Analog Four ? For now with this setup, I'm thinking "not much, actually", which would prompt me to suggest getting that synth instead if your only goal is having a few mono synth voices with "limited" modulation. You'd get an interesting sequencer, effects, a few more voices, audio via USB etc. Should you get the A4 instead of a modular system ? Maybe, perhaps not. My point is that in my opinion, for one to get into Eurorack, one should probably have (or plan to have) needs that could only be answered in modular. Or simply have a lot of money to spend I guess hehe :) In other words, for your setup to offer more than what can be achieved with a "traditional" synth like the Elektron Analog Four (which BTW is not necessarily a goal that needs to be achieved on the first iteration, but it's good to look at the foreseeable future too), you would most likely need more modules, hence more space.

You have some space left in the rack right now but not much and you said it yourself, the size "can be ok for now", so there is a risk that you outgrow this. It is my personal opinion that it would happen much faster than you anticipate, as it seems to be a common experience for most of us. Hell, I was a modulation freak before but not nearly as much as now that I got into Eurorack, I could have never anticipated that the format would challenge my synthesis and production techniques so much, but I guess that's what great about it. As a result, the rack I have now is very, very different from the first plan I made. More importantly, it's much bigger now that I learned to use my rack and realized I wanted more out of it. I had to buy a bigger case after buying a small one, which is définitely more expensive than just buying the big one straight away.

The risk of outgrowing your current space is enough that I feel I should encourage you to consider a bigger case like TipTop Mantis or Intellijel's popular 7U cases. At first, it will look huge and empty but I wouldn't be surprised if it gets filled eventually. The final decision is always yours, but I hope my comment will help you make the best decision for what you envision.

Have fun and make music !
D.

Hi Winterlight !

Hard to say, depends on your build I guess. VCA's and mixers are not exactly the same thing, although I have used my quad VCA module as a mixer more than once. Rather than reiterating, I'm linking here to a couple of threads seen elsewhere on the subject:

https://www.reddit.com/r/modular/comments/30egtz/question_re_vca_vs_mixer_modules/
https://www.muffwiggler.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=193870

Hope this helps,
D.

Don't panic. Start slow. Learn one module at the time. Be sure to read the manuals. Start with simple patches and when you explore few modules then just add another. By time you will see which modules you don't like and you can sell them.
PS: You have not enough VCA's!
-- reflecture

I fully agree with reflecture here, excellent advice. Simple patches are the way to go when you are lost, simplify your signal path and take things slow, you don't need to be creating masterpieces on your first minutes with your rack. Just exploring a few modules at a time and see how they respond to being fed different types of signal can be very rewarding (and give you ideas you can use musically). This will also teach you what you like to do with a modular setup and how you like to patch, which varies a lot from one person to the next and while trying other people's ideas can be fun, trying your own is equally if not more important.
Take Plaits for example : when I first got it in my rack, I needed a week of simple patches with it just to have an idea of which algos I could prefer in which context. The module is so deep, I even feel I have rushed things by spending only a week with it in "isolation".

And in the end, it can be a question of how you patch and your personal taste/needs, but I would also consider more ways to control modulation, like VCA's and attenuators.

Have fun with your setup, it's a good one !

Sorry to read that then but at least you've got the right attitude, I'm impressed by how you're able to easily remember that one bad experience shouldn't put you off interacting more with the rest of this amazing community so I respectfully tip you my hat.
If I were you, I'd try to contact PayPal nonetheless, perhaps repeated complaints (the victim from the other thread said he introduced one) against the same user could have an effect ?
Wishing you the best luck for the future ;)

You mean that user with already one negative vote on his profile and a thread by another user getting scammed (https://www.modulargrid.net/e/forum/posts/index/8359) ? Not surprising but at least you used the PayPal protection, right ?

Hi there !

Didn't know about Tim Hecker, pretty nice sounds, thanks for sharing :)

With regards to your rack, I would personally miss at least a few VCA's, a clock source (I don't know the Voltage Block that well but Steppy won't advance without a clock, Pamela's New Workout would provide that and some more, or you could just use of Maths' channels in cycling mode) as well as a mixer since in your plan there seems to be no way to hear all your sound sources at the same time... Also, what was the reasoning behind the buffered mult, what do you plan to use it for ? These are generally only used when you need a very precise copy of a signal, otherwise inline mults could do and save you both space and money. Finally, as a very personal choice, I would not go for a Zeroscope in such a small setup. For me, but that's just me, an oscilloscope is needed when creating very complex signals, I don't think I would get a lot of use out of it for a "small" setup like yours, although that may be due to my lack of experience with such devices.

If you want to start with just a few modules based on the above, I would go for the classic Rings into Clouds + Steppy and Voltage Block for sequencing, some fun to be had experimenting with these very deep and complex modules I think, although I have never owned any of those except Steppy in my setup.

Have you tried VCV Rack ? It's free and while you might not want to make music on a computer in the long run, I found that some time with it helped me understand some modular synthesis concepts before diving into the actual pool. It's a rather good option as it allows to better decide for yourself where you want to go, rather than entirely relying on advice from the interwebz.

Hope this helps !

Cheers,
Diego

Hi Eddie !

I have only started Eurorack a few months ago so take my advice with that in mind ;)

I have Plaits and BIA, both are excellent choices well worth the asking price in my opinion. BIA is particularly well suited for designing drum sounds and deep enough to allow for sonic explorations, for example I often use it to make bass lines. It definitely has its own character but can almost stand on its own. Plaits is even deeper, each algorithm almost feels like a new module. It has several sound engines dedicated to percussions as well so it's definitely not a bad idea either, especially since it will make your rig more versatile than a more percussion-focused module, Plaits also makes great synth sounds.
I have the Disting and while I find it super useful, especially to beginners, some people have expressed that they dislike the interface of this module. Indeed, cramming so much functionality in only 4HP, you end up with a non-negligeable manual to read, and some menu diving. I'm ok with it, others are not, something keep in mind maybe.

One thing you may want to consider is that the rack seems a bit light on the modulation/sequencing side. Sure, BIA and Plaits can stand on their own but to keep sounds interesting and evolving, modulation is key unless you have 15 hands. You would probably need triggers for your enveloppe generator (although they can loop on their own) and the sound modules, LFO's and modulating CV for other stuff as well, so it feels like the FH-2 could come short on that (although I don't know that module, I'm just counting the outputs). Did you count modulation sources and destinations as well as needs for triggers in your plan ? No one can decide for you but I would pay attention to this before making a final decision.

If you look for just another one to add, Intellijel Plonk is certainly one that should be considered for percussive rigs. I've only tested it a few times as I plan to buy one for myself but it felt like a very serious option for drum sounds. It's also a self-contained voice like the BIA and Plaits so it wouldn't need "complimentary" modules either. The WMD offering on drums also looks very tempting, although perhaps with more focused sound palettes. No experience with those yet, but I have Crater on order.

Speaking of "adding another one", the big weakness I see in your plan is the rack size. From personnal experience and many, many tales of similar situations I read on the web, buying a bigger rack than the one just big enough to host the modules you currently plan on buying is taking into account the possibility (rather likely to happen, I'd wager) that you will want to expand in the future, and you will need space for that. Something like the Intellijel's 7U in 84HP, it might look big to you at first but it's quite portable (one can definitely lift that one one hand), will give you space to expand and provide you with nice things like a 1U row to put some utilities (for example, Intellijel's Quadratt 1U is a great small mixer/attenuverter) and audio-MIDI I/O. It's just an example of course, the point I'm trying to make is that leaving only 6HP free on your first plan sound like you're going to hit that HP limit very soon, at which point you might have to sell your first rack already.

Hopefully all this will be useful to you ;)

Best,
Diego

Hi there !
Being an Elektron Octatrack user, I'm not afraid of reading manuals often or having to remember key combinations by heart. Consequently, I find the Disting really OK from that point of view and having that many functions available to test a bunch of ideas is amazing. When I'm not using it for experiments it usually serves as an effect module, clocked delay more often that not, it's a very decent delay module IMHO.
I also need to point out how awesome it is to have colored leds at the inputs showing voltage strength visually, brilliant idea really, even better than having the activity led that some modules have. I wish more manufacturers were using those !
With regards to sample playing, I have read somewhere (here I think) that the Radio Music sample playing might not be the tightest when it comes to timing, so if you're thinking about it make sure you check that out first to avoid frustration ;)
I hope you'll find a way to have fun with the Disting !
Best,
Diego

PS: are you the Wishbone Brewery who invited Mylar Melodies to play (he posted a video a few days ago) ? That was neat !

I've been looking at demos and asked for opinions on the 1U reverb but it wasn't really what I needed. I would definitely recommend to make sure it suits your needs, I would personally not consider it as a sort of end of chain module. Again, that's just based on the small demo on Youtube and forum talk so to take with a grain of salt. I myself settled for a 2hp Verb for now, limited as well but at least it sounds decent and has that long tailed reverb I need. Now looking forward to real demos of the new FX modules by TipTop Audio. The ones I often see recommended are the Erbe-Verb by Make Noise (if only I had more cash and more rack space for it lol, demos sound incredible) and the Mutable Instruments Clouds (although a lot of people seem to use it as a reverb, it's wayyy more than that, again, wish I had the space for it).
For the sampling part, I haven't really reached a point where I'm ready to do that in my rack, I use an Octatrack in conjunction with the modular so I can't really comment further on that other than repeating that I would certainly try to decide exactly what needs to be achieved before looking at any module. There are a few options that are doing very different things so make sure you watch all the videos you can about those devices and also read their manuals before deciding.
For your pitch cv offset issue, I'm no expert so definitely check that out with someone else before making any purchase but I think a precision adder could solve your tracking issue. From what I understand, it is made to solve the problem you encountered and some modules have an offset built-in which could free up the Quadratt channel you are using now.
Discussing modular sequencers is worth its own thread (probably has several already tbh) but I'll just say that there are many many options, ranging from single modules to combinations of utilities, from immediate and/or random to pre-prepared sequences, some only cv, some only gate/triggers, some both. To illustrate, I was surprised to learn that you could have a lot of flexibility by having pitch and gate information being sequenced from 2 separate modules, or how it is possible to sequence a voice using a turing machine module in combination with a quantizer because those 2 aspects of sequencing are not really present in the "groovebox" world I was used to. Most options I know of in Eurorack take up a lot of rack space (because I need them to sequence more than 1 voice) so to sequence a single track, I can't really recommend any specific option.
All this being said, what are you using your O&C for ? From what I read in the manual (I don't own one yet, my 1U O&C is in the mail), the Quantermain app has a turing machine built-in so you could use that so sequence your other voice, and it has other options for pitch sequencing as well.
I hope this at least gave you more ideas and options to research :)
This thread has a link to my rack and a track I have on Youtube: https://www.modulargrid.net/e/forum/posts/index/8260

D.

Hi there !
I'm probably as much a noob as you are, given that I only have a few months with Eurorack.
That being said, if I was given your rack I would probably think about adding an effect module or 2, especially if you plan on using the input on that 1U module to get some external sound sources into your rack. Which one is entirely a question of choice. I'm having a lot of fun with the Make Noise Mimeophon, but it's just an example. For anything ambient, I'd say one would probably need a decent reverb, but again, that's just my very small experience making the occasional ambient patch on my system.
For working with samples, I haven't tested either of those but I've heard good things about 1010 Music's BitBox and the Morphagene by Make Noise, 2 very different takes on sampling. Again, it all depends on what you would like to go for, just throwing you a few more ideas to look at while waiting for more experienced posters.
Hope this helps anyway ;)
D.

Fantastic resource, thanks for sharing @defragmenteur !

Hi Garfield,

Thanks for taking part to the conversation and your kind words about my badly mixed music :-p

The Waldorf NW-1 looks nice but it's way too wide for my rack. I have decided that if I change the oscillator, I am going to go with Noise Engineering Loquelic Iteritas. Demos sound rad, it's only 10HP with nice modulation options and most importantly, I think it would be the one I'd have the most fun with. Already have a lot of respect for that manufacturer since I love the MD and every minute with the BIA is a real pleasure. Seeing how much distortion I was using when making music on Elektron machines + computer, I think something small and nasty like the Viol Ruina could also be a good thing for my rack too, I did some experimentation with the Overdrive in my Pico DSP but I wish I could turn the drive knob further :)

I'll have a look at Springray II. To be honest, I'd have to try different options with the sound sources within my rack, given that I clearly don't know enough about reverbs to have an opinion. I think that a reverb upgrade would have to wait for a bigger case, which isn't planned for the near future, and for a day when I would have some idea of what I need.

I don't know anything about the Vermona drum machine I'm afraid but I have owned the A4 mark 1 for a few years, it's a very deep synth that rewards dedicated exploration. I have read criticism about it sounding "thin" but in my experience it comes down to user knowledge about its sweet spots and general substractive synths programming. I recommend trying to get drums sounds out of it too, it can be a great drum machine as well, especially using sound locks. I wish you many hours of fun with it !

I'm still happy about the T-sL, definitely. I find its core sound just powerful and beautiful. It's surprisingly deep for only 6hp, its many outputs offer a wide sound palette from mellow to very harsh. The size could be viewed as a downside though, because if you use a lot of outputs and feed its inputs at the same time, the small knobs can be hard to get to with your hands after everything is patched. If you can live with that, it's wonderful IMHO.

On top of my Mac being broken, I had to send back my Intellijel Mixup modules (dead channel 1, already fixed by the awesome Intellijel support and on its way back to me) so I don't even have a complete setup now. Gives me some time to study modules in more isolation I guess. As soon as I'm back on tracks and have recorded something, I'll let you know ;)

Best,
Diego

Indeed, between Hermod and Pam I have plenty of gates generation and modulation. Pam is so awesome and surprisingly playable for a module that has only one knob.
Nice to read your thoughts about O&C, I really feel like the 1U 4 Robots would be a great use of the spare 1U space I have, I mean from what I understand from the manual, your opinion and the few videos available, it would make a lot of sense in my rack and offer a lot of new options for what I already have. By the looks of it, I would have to agree with you on the analogy with the Disting, although I have the feeling the alternative firmware I am investigating at the moment, Hemisphere, is even closer.

Coming back to the original subject, I have made more experiments yesterday and earlier today with the Black Wavetable. I tried focusing on the raw sound of it, with very little to no reverb and I really felt like it's very mellow compared to something like the raw sound of the T-sL which I find more "powerful" for lack of a better way to explain myself, or even some algorhythms of the Plaits which can easily sound pretty gnarly. I can bring all my other sound sources (T-sL, Plaits, BIA) to noisy territories with relative ease and I'm starting to get a feel for sweet spots too (sometimes), but I struggle to find what I'm looking for with the Erica module. I have also tried mixing sub and main out in the Quad VCA feeding slow LFO's to the VCA, I get a much deeper sound but that's not what I'm really after, if anything it takes more place in the low section of the mix which is not always a nice thing.
On my list of things to try still :
- modulating pitch and/or wave with audio rate CV
- feeding abrupt cv patterns from the MD to wave cv input
- test using that sub output again and play with the octave switch manually
- switching back from the 2hp Verb to the Pico DSP for reverb and make good use of that cv input on the Pico module
- modulate distortion on the Pico DSP, placing before and after the reverb
- if I bring myself to sacrificing a track on the OT, testing of processing the drone in the OT. Sure, it would probably sound nice but I don't like being forced to have the track selected to play with the sound on the OT, I'd rather have that in my case, either on the module itself or the modulation sources I'm using. That is sort of the ergonomics I had in mind but it might just be stupid not to go for the inexpensive option of an extra stereo out in the 1U section, after all it might come in handy for multi track recordings. Nevertheless, I can't help but think that since I would have to make heavy use of the OT effects, I wouldn't be too far off just using drones samples on the OT :)
Any ideas of other things I should try ?

Also, can you tell me more about that Monsoon I see in your racks, do you own that one and if so, would that be relevant for me ? I know Clouds is a very popular module, I of course watched a couple of demos but I'm not convinced it would make sense for me, other than providing a better reverb option than the 2hp... Maybe that would already be a good reason ?

In all honesty, a Eurorack drum machine sounds great on paper. But once you start pricing out everything you're going to need, you'll find it to be an extremely expensive way to go... even if you get dedicated drum modules. That's a lot of money to reinvent a drum machine. I bought a 1010 Music BitBox to act as an in-rack record/playback system. Boom. All my drums. I can also record in-sync. So if I have a long ambiance, I can loop record it or any other part.

Beware the rabbit hole. It will suck your wallet dry.

-- Ronin1973

I agree, I had already figured out that such an endeavor would indeed nuke my finances. I am already mainly using samples for drums so I would have considered a Plonk and a few Pico Drums but the BitBox looks like a much better option, I'll watch the demos attentively. I wonder if it could replace the Octatrack, live looping stuff on the fly and all that. Combined with a Mixer with PFL like the HexMix from Befaco, that sounds like a powerful live setup... As I said, I don't see myself making a move like that in the near future but it's nice to think of options... Don't worry, I have never in my life bought something I could not afford with ease, I have sold a lot of gear and got a few extras here and there this year before getting into this so I'm not spending out of budget and don't intend to start, however fun module X looks like or dreams I may have of wonderful machines.

I had a look at the rack you have in public, I see a 1U O&C. Since I have a bunch of free 1U space, it's been on my radar for a while. I often could use an extra EG or an extra modulation source (especially if I end up changing the VCO and getting something with more CV inputs), as I understand it fits the bill but reading the manual of both the original firmware and the one for Hemisphere takes a while. What is your take on that module ? Would you add it to my rack ?

Ha, nice, didn't know about Philip Jeck, thanks for sharing :)

Cool conversation indeed !

I'll definitely try the slew limiter on the Disting. Lovely to have a module like that, only 4HP and so many functions, it's just perfect for beginners. Trying to use as many different functions as possible is a nice exercise to learn about modular. I'm not sure I need a slew limiter though. Last night I was playing with BIA>3Sisters>Mimeophon with modulation from the MD on the BIA and I really liked how the sudden voltage changes from the MD made a cool rhythm. I thought it was epic but the beer probably helped :) I can see the MD + BIA duo becoming a more permanent thing for me so we'll see.

I could record on my Octatrack, I just didn't take the time to do it to be honest, I spent all my time experimenting with my new setup. I had plans to write sequences in Hermod, write tracks in a way, but I ended up enjoying randomization and MIDI effects too much so it didn't happen yet either. I should think about planning time for actual arrangement and recording work aside from my noodling...

Speaking of the Octatrack, another idea I have for drones is using the 1U space I have to get a stereo out and line out from Intellijel to send just the drone part to an individual track in the Octatrack where I have FX slots. That would mean sacrificing one the 8 precious tracks on the OT though. Options, options...

About the better reverb, money and space. Yeah, sometimes I dream of those fancy 14U MDLR cases. It would mean enough space for an Erbe Verb or a Z-DSP, a bunch of cool utility modules, a fancy complex oscillator, VCAs for days, maybe even enough to have a full drums setup in my modular and have a completely self contained setup. The ultimate groovebox... Maybe later, right now I want to spend the time getting to know each module in my setup really well and get way more experienced before investing outside of my 7U, which I already enjoy a lot.