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Big thanks for the insights and advice!
One correction right off the bat… and I do apologize. 84hp or 114hp.
The 114 was from here… which is an option still to be honest =https://www.ginkosynthese.com/product/758573/wooden-diy-case-114hp
100% = the Mantis is brilliant.

Regarding power… a MeanWell kit from ModularSynthLab… was at the top… but, looking at the Excalibus… may rethink. Even if I have to add a second for whatever reason.
I’m sold on the 1U row vs eating 3U HP. I may build for it now and add rails later for example when needed.
Rails are most likely coming from MDLR Case… I like their 3D printed bits… if they are still in stock.

I appreciate the insight on the modular manufacturing world. I knew they were all small… but didn’t fully realize it.
I see similar mentions in other posts. I do plan to build a few modules as I go and 100% put my money where it’s due… unless it’s second hand.

I’m using a pretty cheap 6 channel mixer right now… but I move things around and wanted a way to play this thing on my terrace for example. The HPO does look like an acceptable alternative.

The FX aid was one of the first things I added… I had no idea they are the same platform… didn’t research enough on this one. Price was another factor.. but…

Ergonomics was a topic I was just reading about… and I agree. It may have been one of you that wrote it.
Going to relook at the Picos and Knit… part of the fun.

Again, big thanks to both of you 😊

I've looked at this, and the only thing I would wish for is a separate unit that's just the synthesizer itself. It's very capable, but sticking with JUST tracker mod clips really sells the synth inside short. Even so, this is way faster than using an old-skool mod tracker on something like an Amiga.
-- Lugia

My experience of the Tracker is that the wavetable function is fun. The granular synth is limited because you can only have one grain. Hopefully they could update that if they can squeeze more out of the processor.

Yeah I did that, got to the paypal payment and couldn't see anywhere to paste the code.

Not to worry, I've already spent enough on Christmas!

I understand but did file claim in case lost or stolen package. FedEx delayed package today as well. Hope this covid crap ends soon.

To be fair, I shipped some stuff to Eastern Europe a while back and it took months to arrive. Between customs and other countries' postal services, there is a possibility for error and huge delays.

Thanks for your comments and insights guys! You have helped me come up with a solution with some slight tweaks and here’s what I’ve changed/added...

Sorry, it’s not showing the updated version of the modular, I’ll try again later. Go on to my profile to see the completed system.

Changing the filter to a multi mode filter as mentioned, and adding the O&C for tons of additional uses, and with 3HP I thought I’ll try out a switch!

I’m happy with these choices and thanks again for your input! I would say that this setup will endure plenty of noodling and jamming fun before I even think about switching out modules. I’m sticking to this size case as preference and believe this combined with Ableton and Maschine should do me wonders!

Side note...I don’t know about you guys but I’ve always had issues with midi clock when using Ableton with hardware synths and drum machines. One thing I can say for sure which I was totally taken aback from is that using Pams as the master (ext) clock is solid AF! After all these years trying to get all that midi synced, offsetting nightmares in Ableton’s MIDI settings, or even using track delays to get audio or MIDI to line up, again, PAMS is seriously solid! I have the modular on a stereo channel, Digitakt using overbridge, and Maschine all running rock solid now...finally. I hope that may help you guys in return and those out there who have these nightmares too.

Thanks again for you help peeps, much appreciated 🖖🏼🙏🏼

EDITED Dec 10th 2021, 12:43

I'm assuming that is on specific products as there is nowhere to put the code on my basket.
-- wishbonebrewery

If you proceed to checkout, there is a place for the code. It worked for me.

EDITED Dec 10th 2021, 01:33

It's probably a good idea to remember that, right now, big swaths of the EU are going bonkers over vaccine mandates, and stuff's not all that stable right now. Shipping especially, since you not only have the protests, but in a few places rioting has broken out.

Yeah it sucks because VJ at Ladik tried making excuses instead of just issue me refund. Now I have to deal with bank and credit card company over it. Other modules arrive from many other places.

Well was interestingly cool...would you say the Polyend Tracker is relatively easy to get started with? Was watching you triggering the various buttons. Maybe the most time consuming part is getting all your samples loaded? Thanks for the video!
-- jb61264

Hi - thanks for the comment. So far I’ve found it pretty straightforward to load samples. There’s a bit of “housework” but nothing like as much as other samplers I’ve tried.

I've looked at this, and the only thing I would wish for is a separate unit that's just the synthesizer itself. It's very capable, but sticking with JUST tracker mod clips really sells the synth inside short. Even so, this is way faster than using an old-skool mod tracker on something like an Amiga.

Smart, yep...I even think that the O&c is better than the Disting in several aspects. The better UI is just one example; one gives you a one-digit display, the other has an actual OLED screen with proper menuing. I know what I would want to work with!

EDITED Dec 9th 2021, 22:58

I'm going to guess...is this built into a "hacked" IKEA cab? The length dimensions seem to suggest that. My suggestion, if you're fitting this with 114 hp x 6U, would be to NOT add the tile row in deference to having 6U of normal Eurorack modules. That way, you'll get the tile functions as well as more capability.

+1 on Jim's take on the picos, too. The big problem with them is that their control space is so tight that it's easy to nudge a control on an adjacent module. It's not just a "small knob problem", but the layout of those modules as well. Circuit-wise, they're all that, though. Frankly, if you wind up with a 228 hp cab, you'll have ample space to do a proper build AND avoid using 2 or 3 hp modules UNLESS you've got a hole that needs filling...and even then, you still might be better off by shuffling things around and clearing space for something 4 hp and up.

hello ! drill some big holes into the back of your case at the top and the bottom. glue some mesh against them to prevent getting dust inside.
-- mrsupersubsonic

Definitely another way to do it! And this actually makes sense, because you'll have your cooler air entering at the bottom, warmer out of the top, and all of the cooling would be passive and convective, ergo no need for a fan, etc. I do note, though, that it might make more sense to use "slots" rather than just holes...something along the lines of 1" high and 6" across for a typical 84 to 104 hp cab. Two in the bottom of the cab's back panel, two in the top, add some mesh (just glue it in) and you'll be SET. Plenty of airflow, and that'll help keep both drifting and weirdness AND component thermal stress under control.

EDITED Dec 9th 2021, 22:45

I had the same thing happen with an order for a Ts-L I placed with Control (here in the states)...they kept saying it had shipped for four weeks, after sixth week they said it looks like there was a shipping error we'll refund your money...sigh...I ordered one from Analogue Haven and it was on my doorstep in a week...smh

and unsurprisingly me too...
-- JimHowell1970

Not surprising. I based that signal flow partly on the ARP 2600's design. It's somewhat different, but that flow is very much part of what makes IT easy to work with.

I'm assuming that is on specific products as there is nowhere to put the code on my basket.

well if Ladik takes your money and never send module it is bad deal.

I quite fancy one of these sometime https://www.modulargrid.net/e/ladik-e-480 fingers crossed your delivery arrives.

I want to share a message we have got from reverb.com

From now through the end of the year, your audience can get $10 off of any purchase of $50 or more, using your exclusive coupon code at checkout:

MG10OFF50

It would be nice to have the total HP listed for a rack when displayed...seems like it shows everything else (Power Consumption | Depth | Price | Number of Modules) could be useful to show total HP and total HP occupied by modules if possible.

Well was interestingly cool...would you say the Polyend Tracker is relatively easy to get started with? Was watching you triggering the various buttons. Maybe the most time consuming part is getting all your samples loaded? Thanks for the video!

Definitely clears things up. I always forget about the LFOs from Pams and I'm not familiar with the Behringer modules. I would probably second the 0_C as a multi function module to fill that space and fill any role you need in a pinch, or maybe a triple sloths to add subtle movement to your patches. You can get two sloths with the o_C using the Lo Rentz app though, so that might be the better fit still.

whilst the mantis is a brilliant case and really quite reasonably priced, especially compared to other cases that were around when (and since) it was launched, building a case is a great idea and can save a little money - if you can use a saw, a drill and a screw driver then they are, at their most basic, incredibly easy to build - I should know I've built 4, so far! my average build time is a couple of hours, so I wouldn't really call it a project, as such, but then I don't really bother sanding, staining or varnishing etc

88 & 114 hp are weird sizes - ie not standard rails sizes are you going to use wood rails? - I've tried this and personally I wouldn't advise it - when using aluminium rails (and preferably threaded inserts - seriously much better than sliding nuts) it's much easier to stick to standard sizes!!

what power supplies are you considering - I like the befaco excalibus, myself - it's an easy but tedious DIY build and provides a decent amount of very clean power (clean enough for video which needs to be cleaner through much higher frequencies than audio - otherwise it is visible in the output)

as for 1u - as you are building your case yourself, you will come to appreciate that the cost of housing 1u modules in a row is identical to that of a 3u row - and there's really nothing compelling in 1u that can't be achieved with a 3u module, in a much smaller hp footprint, the only thing that 1u really does is save you 3.5" (8.9cm) from the height of the case

as you have more space - I would suggest getting rid of the micro versions of modules - their ergonomics sucks!

as you seem to be into open source, I would also suggest either to build yourself or to support the person who made them open source in the first place and not cloners, where possible (hint buy plaits, not knit)

Emilie is a truly fantastic person and deserves your money, way more than anyone who shrinks one of her modules to child size and I can assure you any product support that you do need will be excellent

almost all eurorack manufacturers are very small - other than the obvious evil that is the b-company I don't think many are more than 10 people:

Doepfer, outside Munich, is 4 - & Dieter "invented" the format
Mutable Instruments, Paris, is 1

for example (nb both of these outsource their production - Doepfer to China, iirc, and Mutable to a company in France

what are you currently using for mixing your existing instruments? you may not need the output module - if you desperately need headphones then I'd suggest something like the ALM HPO - which is made, kind of locally to the EU, in the UK

I'd probably also go for a fx aid xl instead of the milky way - Igor adds more and more algorithms to it - so it's significantly more versatile than the milky way - whilst being built on the same platform

I'd probably replace the pico filters, for the mostly same reason as the knit - poor ergonomics, better suited to children than adults - with Doepfer modules that are bigger and have more space - I have a pico seq - which is kind of annoying for this reason and also the lack of a reset jack (resetting is horrible and really requires space around the module to achieve) - I have other full size erica modules, both DIY and bought, and they are excellent

Noise, mixers (as xnax mentioned above), quantizer, attenuverters???

Both filters in your set-up are low-pass only. So you're pretty limited there.

Also, is this a dream build or do you already have all of these modules? Clouds isn't in production anymore. You can buy a new clone of Clouds or hope for someone willing to sell the original (not cheap).
-- Ronin1973

1. Yes I’m missing noise, do I really need it? Mixers, the two voices used with Tangle Quartet, master to QOP Aux in. Master out to Outs. Bloom covers scales for Quantizer duties, though perhaps you’re right that a dedicated Quantizer could come in handy.

2. I was originally going to get the Wasp filter as it does HP and I think even BP if I’m not mistaken. The filter on the QOP can do both LP and HP, which is great! I do have a limitation with the depth of my case (ALM 6U 84HP). The Mum M8 is a thin module so it can fit. Though it’s a good point of maybe having that dedicated filter for the NE oscillator to do HP or BP. More searching for filters for me there.

3. I have most of the modules except for the Mum M8, and the NE oscillator. Fortunately I got hold of an original Clouds a year or two ago from Reverb.com.

Thanks for your reply!

How are you mixing all of this? How will you be modulating all of this? How will you be utilizing all those Midi inputs?
-- xnax

Thanks for your reply. So I currently have it setup for the Tangle Quartet to mix the two voices. The mix output goes into the Aux in of the QOP so it’s filter is a master filter. The output of the QOP goes into the Intellijel Outs as a master output/headphone output.

Modulation can be covered by the B140’s LFO. And extra modulation from Pams. The mult comes in handy here too.

I should have clarified the Midi. I wanted to be able to sequence this system two ways. 1, by using the Mutant Brain mapped to use my Digitakt or Keystep Pro as a sequencer for the drums, the 2 channels of the Bloom to sequence the two oscillators.

The other setup, is to use Pams to get interesting patterns with QOP and keep using Bloom for the oscillators.

I hope that gives a bit more clarity. 👍🏼

ornament and crime might give you some good bang for the buck with that remaining 8HP
https://www.modulargrid.net/e/after-later-audio-uo-c-black-gold-panel
-- jb61264

This is a solid suggestion a ‘Swiss army knife’ solution for the space and functionality. Something I would certainly consider. 👍🏼

maybe you could benefit for a FX Aid
-- Broken-Form

That is a good suggestion, though Clouds and Milky Way including the filter on the QOP offer enough FX for my liking. Thanks

Recent visitors to my little corner of YouTube will know I've been looking at expanding my modular set-up to include a new case and lots of lovely new modules, inspired by my passion for Buchla.

Well, in the last few months, I have made zero progress. And in the meantime I've bought a new toy, a Polyend Tracker. I'm enjoying it so far, and can see that it will easily incorporate into any modular set up I end up with.

It's also great fun in its own right. I've been enjoying loading samples from my Plink and Tenor Uke Kontakt libraries and seeing what I can come up with. This is the first track I've made on it. Hope you like it.

EDITED Dec 9th 2021, 19:41

I have only one suggestion (except of course the removal of some multiples as previously mentioned): a Disting mk4. Small, cheap, easy to use, and perfect for a Xmas tree ;)

Hi Amazing humans.
What we're working with... Neutron, Werkstatt, NTS-1, Keystep, SQ1 and... PLINKY!
Plinky got me looking into modular over the summer. It may or may not be racked... need to build the CV expander.
I'm only showing 88HP... but the case I'm looking to build in January will likely be 6U at 88HP or 114HP. 1U is still an option.. but the Xodes things are an option as well. Why not Mantis... price and it's winter... why not have a project?
This is the starter kit. Something to get me patching more and curious...
Workflow is left to right as my brain demands it.
Nothing super flashy but I think there is some room to play and make "happy mistakes".

Or... is there? Am I missing anything or have something I just don't need? I know O_C and Temps can wait awhile if needed.
I'm big on open source... small and local makers if possible (I'm in Europe).

Goal is to make noise and smile once in awhile :)
What do you think?

Noise, mixers (as xnax mentioned above), quantizer, attenuverters???

Both filters in your set-up are low-pass only. So you're pretty limited there.

Also, is this a dream build or do you already have all of these modules? Clouds isn't in production anymore. You can buy a new clone of Clouds or hope for someone willing to sell the original (not cheap).

How are you mixing all of this? How will you be modulating all of this? How will you be utilizing all those Midi inputs?

I have the 4ms Ensemble Oscillator and love it. [...]. You could also go with a 4ms Listen Four or Four Quarters(depending on what outputs you want) and it will replace your output module and allow for 2 panable mono channels and 2 full stereo channels of input as well as a headphone out and not take up too much space.
-- xnax

That's brilliant, thanks for the suggestions. In fact I think if I swapped out the Befaco OUT V3 for the Four Quarters, and a 2hp Mix, I'd have a more workable set up (mixing wise).

As for the 4ms Ensemble Oscillator, I'm mulling that one over, but it looks very tempting indeed!

Thanks for the tip(s).

So I ordered a module from Ladik a month ago and it never arrived. I asked VJ at Ladik for update and he kept saying shipping delays but I received other modules ordered at same time from Europe and Israel. So frustrating won't do that again.

I have the 4ms Ensemble Oscillator and love it. Modulating the spread to create melodies over the core melody is super satisfying. Not sure what exactly you are after, but that module sounds amazing. You could also go with a 4ms Listen Four or Four Quarters(depending on what outputs you want) and it will replace your output module and allow for 2 panable mono channels and 2 full stereo channels of input as well as a headphone out and not take up too much space.

Frap Tools are very expensive priced modules as are Verbos modules plus very large sized. A friend has the 4ms Ensemble Oscillator and it sounds amazing. It is on my wishlist along with the Knobula Poly Cinematic oscillator. I want small polyphonic modules for my smaller cases to get big sound in travel setups. Acid Rain Chainsaw also sounds massive and is a small module.

Sounds and looks really interesting.

Actually, the fun of starting a thread is all the various directions it sends you. I have to say, after looking at these posts, I realise I seriously need a mixer module (of some sort), and secondly on the pros and cons of Frap Tools side, apart from the Tiptop/Buchla 258t, I'm quite curious to discover the 4ms Ensemble Oscillator, which from watching a few demos I wonder if I might get more mileage out of that in the long run - hmm, decisions, decisions!

Anyhow, thanks again.

hello ! drill some big holes into the back of your case at the top and the bottom. glue some mesh against them to prevent getting dust inside. thats it. i did some temperature measurements with a closed system which ended at about 35 degrees (celsius) with 20 degrees outside. this is not really a problem for your electronics. if you live in a tropical region this might be more important. but high humidity is more dangerous then. happy twiggling !

So, just to add a comment, the Brenso is (as I said) just an idea at present, so indeed, as Lugia says, if I want to go down that path for less money, I could try out the Tiptop/Buchla 258t. Of course, if it can do the same thing for a third of the price I'd be very happy - as many would.
-- joesh

The 258t will not do the same things as Brenso. It may do pretty much what you want, though, and it will be almost half the size and a third the price. Better direct points of comparison are the Buchla 259 and its Eurorack descendants, including ones made by Verbos, Instruō, Hexinverter, Endorphin.es, and others, which tend to be large and expensive also.

ornament and crime might give you some good bang for the buck with that remaining 8HP
https://www.modulargrid.net/e/after-later-audio-uo-c-black-gold-panel

maybe you could benefit for a FX Aid

I'd add a matrix mixer, fx aid xl and something that can do offsets and inversion (3*MIA, perhaps) [...] - I have multiple problems with the frap tools modules, but that's just me - although I'm sure they are great... I think bresno is way too big for a case this size - as there's not enough room left over for modules to support it - add another row, though and it'd be substantially better

-- JimHowell1970

Hey Jim, big thanks for the case update, that's really helpful, especially as I can see it in action with your rack image, brilliant. The WMD Tool-Box looks really interesting, I hadn't thought of that. In fact due to this I'm going to have a much deeper look at the WMD modules, they look as though they have a very nice range indeed. And, oddly enough, I had the Happy Nerding modules in my original 'idea' when first starting. Somehow, they got forgotten along the way, so thanks for the reminder. Lastly, I'm glad the In the Trees A/B Mixer's still in there, I also thought that it looked basic, but so useful.

No problem - I'm happy it was helpful

don't forget to check out the wmd/ssf collaborative modules like the toolbox (hint they're all listed under steady state fate here)

re: the trees a/b mixer - I'd probably have taken it out and replaced it with something else - to get something stereo and to get something else in the rack! but it was the middle of the night

So, just to add a comment, the Brenso is (as I said) just an idea at present, so indeed, as Lugia says, if I want to go down that path for less money, I could try out the Tiptop/Buchla 258t. Of course, if it can do the same thing for a third of the price I'd be very happy - as many would. Another couple of possibilities which look interesting (I think) are the Gravitational Waves by Void Modular, and the Intellijel Rubicon 2, or something else (not quite the same, but) which looks very versatile the 4ms Ensemble Oscillator.

If I ever buy another oscillator it'll be the tiptop 258t - I've got a dannysound cali which is based on the 258 - and it'd be nice to be able to have a 2-3 osc voice from time to time

As for another row ... I've got that covered, I've also got a 104hp skiff that's empty (or used as needed). So, I could expand even more at a later date.

but if I'd known that I wouldn't have crammed such small modules in!!

As for the symbols and layout of Frap Tools discussion, I don't really see why people get so wound-up about them. FT are trying to do their own thing, like plenty of other makers out there - who BTW also have wacky images and odd layouts. I bought the Falistri due to recommendations here, and have to say I love it. Once you see how they've laid it out, it's very very easy to use, and logical. The quality of the build of their stuff (from what I've seen) is very good.

I can't disagree with any of that - never used one of their modules - but, having over 100 modules, from a wide variety of manufacturers - see comments above - Maths makes more sense as a learning tool - due to the fantastic resource that is the 'maths illustrated supplement' - and for me ergonomics are really important - plus we all like to discuss things - looks like me, sacguy74 and Lugia have bonded more over our shared dislike of frap tools - some people don't like make noise for similar reasons - tbh not many of their modules I like the look of either - Maths, optomix and lxd are pretty much the exceptions there - or mutable clones - which again we seem to agree on

Lastly (@Lugia), don't worry about the CWEJMAN VCA-4MX, I just thought it looked interesting and it clearly is, but too expensive, which you mentioned on another thread (I think). However, luckily everyone here who's answered my questions, has come up with some alternative solutions which gives me plenty of ideas/solutions as where to move next on my set-up.

Very big thanks to all.

-- joesh

Hi folks, I am near completion of my modular system and am a bit stuck on what to fill the last 8hp with that would benefit the system rather than clutter it, ideally a single 8hp, though I'm open to alternatives.

The system is built to have two voices, one for melodies another for bass and QOP providing drums. Musical styles would cover electronica, techno, down tempo/chill and a dabble in ambient.
I would love to hear your suggestions on what to add to compliment the system. Another oscillator is a possibility, though two voices should suffice. I guess, I'm looking for something to add variation, or modulation or something extra to keep the system fun and playable with an element of unpredictability. As I'm quite new to modular, some advanced ideas could be what's needed, I am open to your suggestions.
Thanks for stopping by and your opinions are appreciated.

🙌🏼

Note : I am willing to take out the Pique and use the second ADSR of the B140 to expand that space to 12HP if necessary. But everything else stays. 😌

EDITED Dec 9th 2021, 12:55

@Ronin1973 good points, yeah the perforation holes might not line up just by "spray and pray" or other magical thinking.

@wishbonebrewery, yes I have a nice setup and don't want to f&*$ it up with ugly handmade trash

... sigh, too much thinking for a small problem. At this point I'll probably go with https://www.shapeways.com/product/67YKP7968/eurorack-blank-panel-4hp-vented?optionId=70725951&li=more-from-shop as suggested much earlier above. The are ~$10 per 4hp for the black plastic version. I thought I could do better elsewhere but maybe I can't.

Think I'll first try rearranging my rack (temporarily) with full gaps where the "vented blanks" would go and see if that sorts out the heating issue.

Thanks for all the pointers guys!

EDITED Dec 9th 2021, 09:10

-- nickgreenberg

How would you mount the perforated aluminum to your rails? There's no guarantee that any of the holes will line up or be big enough to pass the threads of a screw through.

I wouldn't use sheers as they will probably curl your aluminum. Sheers (aircraft sheers are best) only make sense for rough cuts in my opinion. I'd use a small hacksaw. You can clean up your cuts using a deburring tool. Just do a search on Amazon for one.

-- Ronin1973

If using perforated aluminium:
You would have to Buy some Round Needle Files to open out or Slot the appropriate perforations.

Snips - Yeah bad idea, as said it will curl the metal, especially so with small parts like this.

Hacksaw - you are going to have to be very careful and accurate or it will look like a dogs dinner, you need a large Flat File rather than a deburring tool, to smooth and straighten the edges. You may also find you will need a Bench Vice to you can appropriately hold the piece of metal so you can square off and make parallel.

Personally, I'd just wait and buy something made by someone else, Eurorack looks nice and I wouldn't spoil it by making something in my garage that would look like a bag of Sh**..... I'm a Mechanical Engineer (for years, before I was a brewer).

If you want to get technical, the Aluminium Blanks from Thonk - You can see the sheer and break-away on the edges, this shows its been stamped out, the initial stampings (Holes & Outside edge) will bend the material, a subsequent stage of the Power-Press will planish (Flatten) the Blank, there will still be sharp edges so I could guess the parts are then tumbled or shot blasted to de-burr. I literally used to make the tools that made things like this.

EDITED Dec 9th 2021, 07:58

I'd add a matrix mixer, fx aid xl and something that can do offsets and inversion (3*MIA, perhaps) [...] - I have multiple problems with the frap tools modules, but that's just me - although I'm sure they are great... I think bresno is way too big for a case this size - as there's not enough room left over for modules to support it - add another row, though and it'd be substantially better

-- JimHowell1970

Hey Jim, big thanks for the case update, that's really helpful, especially as I can see it in action with your rack image, brilliant. The WMD Tool-Box looks really interesting, I hadn't thought of that. In fact due to this I'm going to have a much deeper look at the WMD modules, they look as though they have a very nice range indeed. And, oddly enough, I had the Happy Nerding modules in my original 'idea' when first starting. Somehow, they got forgotten along the way, so thanks for the reminder. Lastly, I'm glad the In the Trees A/B Mixer's still in there, I also thought that it looked basic, but so useful.

So, just to add a comment, the Brenso is (as I said) just an idea at present, so indeed, as Lugia says, if I want to go down that path for less money, I could try out the Tiptop/Buchla 258t. Of course, if it can do the same thing for a third of the price I'd be very happy - as many would. Another couple of possibilities which look interesting (I think) are the Gravitational Waves by Void Modular, and the Intellijel Rubicon 2, or something else (not quite the same, but) which looks very versatile the 4ms Ensemble Oscillator.

As for another row ... I've got that covered, I've also got a 104hp skiff that's empty (or used as needed). So, I could expand even more at a later date.

As for the symbols and layout of Frap Tools discussion, I don't really see why people get so wound-up about them. FT are trying to do their own thing, like plenty of other makers out there - who BTW also have wacky images and odd layouts. I bought the Falistri due to recommendations here, and have to say I love it. Once you see how they've laid it out, it's very very easy to use, and logical. The quality of the build of their stuff (from what I've seen) is very good.

Lastly (@Lugia), don't worry about the CWEJMAN VCA-4MX, I just thought it looked interesting and it clearly is, but too expensive, which you mentioned on another thread (I think). However, luckily everyone here who's answered my questions, has come up with some alternative solutions which gives me plenty of ideas/solutions as where to move next on my set-up.

Very big thanks to all.

EDITED Dec 9th 2021, 09:12

I try to keep things grouped in sections by functionality and place the things that get tweaked the most closest to me (same idea mentioned above). I’m usually sitting for sessions and streams, and have tried a few arrangements where things were being tweaked up high and my shoulder would hurt after 10 minutes so settled on this.

I prefer the bottom case angled as opposed to vertical cases, but it hasn't been too bad having a top vertical case (Intellijel stack).

1U-Drums
3U-Drums, Master processing
3U-Voices, send and return fx
1U-Utility
3U-Filters, envelopes, mixer
3U-Sequencers

Agree Jim,
I’m saving up for the Serge Eurorack and Tiptop Buchla modules. They are easy to read and sound amazing from what I’ve heard.

and unsurprisingly me too...