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I've been thinking about this for a while, and my idea is now to focus on Rings and noise generation/mixing for now. I may be a bit crazy not planning on getting Elements, but I would like to experiment with Rings using noise, a contact mic, and external audio sources, for now.
I pretty much consistently chose Mutable Instruments modules rather than narrower or slightly cheaper modules because I like Mutable Instruments (such as the open source approach and the aesthetics) and because I wanted a built-in contact mic. I might be getting an A-119 later. I will also wait on the Clouds successor for now.
Given these decisions, I would love to hear your thoughts generally, and about whether or not these modules seem to make sense together. :)
I put Ears to the right since I'm right handed, and I'm kind of loosely thinking that the patching will mainly go from right to left.
I got lots of cables and inline mults.
Thanks again for all the information and great advice! I have learned a lot through this thread. :)
There are some manufacturer-approve modules that have incomplete specs. For example, the Erica Synths Dual FX doesn't have a depth listed, or the URL on the Erica website. I'd like to be able to add that info, but the module is manufacturer approved, and so it's locked, and I can't add that info.
Is there any way to get that info added? There are more modules like this, too..
Thanks for the advice!
I think I start with µOsc-II, A-120, Swamp, µ4xVCA, 2Multi and Disting for checking out which of the effects I need as dedicated modules.
Nice one! Thank you for sharing the modules you used for this track. Do you have perhaps the rack here on ModularGrid that you used for this track, that would be interesting to see too.
For review reports of Eurorack modules, please refer to https://garfieldmodular.net/ for PDF formatted downloads
Excellent experience with @tomlaan.
Picked up a module from him, he took the time to let me try it out and we had a nice chat about his setup :)
Thanks!
Part of the problem is that you mention you want this for "techno production", but not which aspect of that, of which there are many. Is this for percussives? Bass? Leads and pads? All of it? If the latter, you're going to have quite a time of fitting something that versatile in that small a cab. NEVER start with a small cab like this...ALWAYS go with a cab that you think is too large. Invariably, you'll find that your "too large" cab is actually just fine or, if the goal is to create a unitized production device, it's STILL too small.
Second: "important" modules don't make a synthesizer work, if by "important" you actually mean "sexy". This is something I go over quite a bit on here. The ACTUAL things that make a synth a synth are the modules that seem UNimportant...VCAs, mixers, attenuation/inversion, and the like. Sure, it would be awesome if we could fill our cabs with nothing but edgy graphics, a bazillion blinkenlichts und twistenknobs, devices of arcane mystery and all of the rest of that marketing bullshit. But the truth is that you can spendspendspend on those sorts of modules and wind up with something utterly nonfunctional by neglecting the sleepy-looking modules that do all the scutwork.
Third: if the idea is to go from and to Ableton, you've got the wrong interface altogether. See the ES-8 (and expanders) from Expert Sleepers instead. These allow direct control via Ableton's internal CV tools and/or Silent Way or Volta, plus they have four return lines for audio, various timing signals to lock Ableton to the synth's clock, cues from your CV/gate/trig environment that can affect Live's operation, and so on. MIDI interfaces are all well and good, but there's other...and in this case, better...ways to do this.
Lastly, cost-effectiveness and function density are something any modular builder/user has to address. You need to define your necessary functions first (NOT the modules) and then sort out how you can make those happen in terms of modules and module combinations. That last bit is important, because a major aspect of modular synthesis comes from how the modules in your build work with each other, and not merely that you have X, Y, and Z modules. Plus, insisting on X, Y and Z modules before figuring out what they need to "play nicely together" can lead to some nasty cost and space surprises when you start factoring those actually-necessary modules into the mix.
I'd suggest tearing up the above and then going back and doing some basic research. What do the artists you mention use (that you know of)? How are they using those devices? How would you do that? Do you know your music well enough to understand how you would do that? Also, go and study some classic prebuilt synths and see how they generate the sounds they're known for, how their workflows optimize that process, and so forth. Plunging into this without the aid of extensive research will...well, just let us know when you put your money pit on Reverb, because that'll be where it winds up when you get frustrated at this little box that costs several grand but which can't accomplish jack-shit. Seriously.
-- Lugia
Hey, thanks too much for your answer.
I need the modular system first of all for leads, effects, drone sounds and sequences.
I've already made the social research what the artists i mention use and i made the rack i posted here based on the information.
But the problem is that their racks are way too expensive form me to start, so i just want something to start from, because i don't have that amount of money in one moment.
And i know the way the most synths create the sound, but the modular world seems for me a little different.
And i am not sure if the Ableton sequencing is the best, i just want to start from something to practice and make my own mistakes)
Part of the problem is that you mention you want this for "techno production", but not which aspect of that, of which there are many. Is this for percussives? Bass? Leads and pads? All of it? If the latter, you're going to have quite a time of fitting something that versatile in that small a cab. NEVER start with a small cab like this...ALWAYS go with a cab that you think is too large. Invariably, you'll find that your "too large" cab is actually just fine or, if the goal is to create a unitized production device, it's STILL too small.
Second: "important" modules don't make a synthesizer work, if by "important" you actually mean "sexy". This is something I go over quite a bit on here. The ACTUAL things that make a synth a synth are the modules that seem UNimportant...VCAs, mixers, attenuation/inversion, and the like. Sure, it would be awesome if we could fill our cabs with nothing but edgy graphics, a bazillion blinkenlichts und twistenknobs, devices of arcane mystery and all of the rest of that marketing bullshit. But the truth is that you can spendspendspend on those sorts of modules and wind up with something utterly nonfunctional by neglecting the sleepy-looking modules that do all the scutwork.
Third: if the idea is to go from and to Ableton, you've got the wrong interface altogether. See the ES-8 (and expanders) from Expert Sleepers instead. These allow direct control via Ableton's internal CV tools and/or Silent Way or Volta, plus they have four return lines for audio, various timing signals to lock Ableton to the synth's clock, cues from your CV/gate/trig environment that can affect Live's operation, and so on. MIDI interfaces are all well and good, but there's other...and in this case, better...ways to do this.
Lastly, cost-effectiveness and function density are something any modular builder/user has to address. You need to define your necessary functions first (NOT the modules) and then sort out how you can make those happen in terms of modules and module combinations. That last bit is important, because a major aspect of modular synthesis comes from how the modules in your build work with each other, and not merely that you have X, Y, and Z modules. Plus, insisting on X, Y and Z modules before figuring out what they need to "play nicely together" can lead to some nasty cost and space surprises when you start factoring those actually-necessary modules into the mix.
I'd suggest tearing up the above and then going back and doing some basic research. What do the artists you mention use (that you know of)? How are they using those devices? How would you do that? Do you know your music well enough to understand how you would do that? Also, go and study some classic prebuilt synths and see how they generate the sounds they're known for, how their workflows optimize that process, and so forth. Plunging into this without the aid of extensive research will...well, just let us know when you put your money pit on Reverb, because that'll be where it winds up when you get frustrated at this little box that costs several grand but which can't accomplish jack-shit. Seriously.
I plan to build a modular system for techno production and sync and output to Ableton. The type of sound that i want to reach is industrial like - gritty, raw, crispy and warm like Rebekah, I Hate Models or Regal.
So i need the advice with the rack i've build here - maybe something is missing or i'd better change or add some more important modules.
Now i plan to buy a few most important and irreplaceable modules and then improve it.
I hear you all, we now have a Minimalist theme.
As a special feature you see the snap grid on that one for precise dragging and better visual reading of available space.
What do you think?
The tactile switches (non-latching types) instantly mute / un-mute tracks in mixer mode.
In switcher mode, yes, they will solo the selected track instantly.
Am i right in saying the mutes/ch select are momentary hold buttons ? or switched? Are they smooth or audible?
And in mixer mode they mute but in siwitcher mode they effectively ‘solo’?
.
Well, I don't have great answer for you since everyone uses their rig differently. You have several directions you COULD go in. But each one requires a substantial investment.
So, let's start with your MiniBrute. You have basically a "synth voice." It's a complete synth architecture with semi-modular jacks.
What is the MiniBrute lacking for you? You can always add Eurorack effects. Eurorack effects can differ from pedals or outboard gear especially if attributes of the effects can be controlled via voltage. Take for example Tip Top's Z-DSP. The effects are fine. But what makes them shine is the ability to modulate them. Think of a Clouds clone, distortion/overdrive, ring modulation, etc.
Filters. Having different choices in filters rather than just what comes with the MiniBrute might be a tasty choice as well. You could also add different types of VCOs or sound sources rather than what comes with MiniBrute... then run those VCOs through the MiniBrute architecture.
But for now, there's a limited amount of money to go around. I would try this: whatever you've already bought... put it in the rack. Get the Disting module and try out ALL of the effects in it. The Disting is a pain in the ass to use. But it's basically a nice collection of different module functions you can try out with your MiniBrute. If you find something that you use over and over... then maybe you should get a dedicated module? Take for example the quantizer or the sample playback functions. If you're constantly using one of these functions, then start looking for a dedicated quantizer or sample playback module. Then you have a roadmap to which module(s) you should get.
OK, I'll throw in for this as well...plus, it's not just the 4ms Pod series that has that look; you also have cases from Make Noise and Intellijel that have that "narrow edge" thing going on.
Also, part of the reason MG is able to be so comprehensive is because of the crowdsourcing of its data. Even though some companies understand MG's importance and create their own module listings, the majority of the info here comes from people who know synths and know when they're seeing something new, ergo they add the new data to the site even faster than a company might. For example, I came across listings on Schneider's Laden's site for the four new "N" series modules from Analogue Systems a few days ago, and added the information as per Schneider's.
Which brings up a salient point: if you're going to add information to MG's database, it needs to be from a reliable source. Manufacturers are certainly that, but so are retailers, as they need to properly represent the gear and its information to their customers. What's NOT on is pulling info from speculative sources such as blogs, forums, etc when the info isn't coming from manufacturers to those sites in the first place. There's a long trail of rumored devices, fakes, speculation and conjecture, etc in the synth world and a comprehensive and authoritative database such as Modulargrid isn't the place for that.
Okay, so I'm a noob to modular (tho not to electronic music in General). I was watching a few videos on the random source serge dual universal slope generator and there was one in which the guy ran one envelope into the other and pulled off this double attack. It seems like this is possible to pull off on the endorphin grand terminal, but every time I try, all I get is that end of stage trigger click. Am I deluding myself or am I missing something? I use a furthrrrr generator as my main oscillator, patched to the "into the gates " input, run the bipolar output to the filter cutoff cv in and then run the end of stage output into the "check in" gate input on the second envelope,then run the other bipolar out into filter 2. One the video,he uses the trigger in instead of the main in and emphasizes there is no retriggering on the dusg , I've tried both eoc jumpers one of each, none at all.I feel like im missing something fairly basic. Heres the video video for reference
Perhaps a weird question but can just any member of ModularGrid add/change information on modules or is it actually supposed to be done by the manufacturers themselves. I would have thought to leave this up to the manufacturers to make sure the module information is accurate?
If there are any ModularGrid rules to add new or update existing modules, then please let me know to make sure I will follow suit.
For review reports of Eurorack modules, please refer to https://garfieldmodular.net/ for PDF formatted downloads
Generally for front panels, what would be a good place to buy them? I haven't found a shop in Germany yet where I could buy front panels for let's say... the Neutron. Any suggestions would be helpful, thank you!
For review reports of Eurorack modules, please refer to https://garfieldmodular.net/ for PDF formatted downloads
"Odd" sizes used to be pretty uncommon, but these days there's odd-sized panels from numerous companies. In fact, some have whole lines of odd sizes, such as Erica's Pico line (all 3 hp). Konstant Labs even makes an actual 1 hp module, their PWR Checker, which is super-useful for those who want (but don't have) rail status indicator lights.
Elby also does quite a few odd-sized panels in their Eurorack and Euroserge lines; the idea with these is probably that if you're planning to use Elby modules, you're apt to use several, and the "oddness" will get resolved in the build.
I’m slowly learning to master my Minibrute 2S and have decided to go Eurorack for more options. So I have bought a 6U Rackbrute that wants to be filled with modules.
But I have a limited budget and it is so hard to decide what to start with.
I want to create something like ambient music and maybe try to create some simple self-generating patches.
But the main purpose is to add new functions to the Minibrute.
I think I need some dedicated LFO:s and EG:s in the rack but I maybe can start with the 3 LFO:s and 2 EG:s in my Minibrute?
Maybe I do not need the step sequencer but I already have it and have used it as a battery powered stand alone unit for another synth.
I would really appreciate if I could get some feedback and some advice in what order I shall buy the modules I’m thinking of or the ones that you maybe suggest as better choices. I have not the money for buying everything at once, but maybe within half a year :-)
One other device in the "slo-mo" modulation realm comes to mind: the 4ms Pingable Envelope Gen. This is capable of rise/fall cycles of a half-hour plus, and has clock-based control over cycle times with either an incoming clock or an internal clock with tap tempo. Adding one of Nonlinearcircuits' low-speed chaotic sources might also be of some use here.
I can't answer all of your questions. But here's what I have.
Compare the NerdSeq to the 1010 Music Toolbox sequencer. See if one workflow is better than the other. I think the Toolbox will be better for instant gratification but the NerdSeq will be better for building songs.
The Expert Sleeper FH2 requires configuring before you access it with your DAW. If you wish to reconfigure it, then you have to quit out of your DAW, open the browser interface, make your changes, load up your DAW again and see if the changes are to your liking. You can make changes via the module's front panel. But the menu'ing system isn't that intuitive. That's been my experience. I would take this into consideration unless they've improved the USB interface.
Instead of a 2HP LFO, have you considered a 2HP switch instead? Being able to switch between different modulation sources might be more useful than another LFO.
Slew limiters are great. Being able to plug in a simple CV sequence and then slew between the values at a slow rate might be tasty for drones. The Rampage or Maths work well at this with individual controls over rising and falling CV. Both can also be used as a basic envelope generator as well as having comparative or even mixing functionality (Maths). If you have the space, one of these is a great utility module to have about.
Thanks for checking it out, I use Modulagrid daily and love it. Extremely useful tool! I'm getting a small spinning black loading gear above all the racks in my Command Center where snap shot of all racks are shown in full, have never seen this before( most likely as pages were loading immediately before this problem). My main rack loads straight away, but if I try to load one of the other racks, page just sits for up to sixty seconds. Also have the same problem at that point with any of the modulagrid menu items or logging out. Have the same problem with both Safari and Chrome.
Have more tracking cookies been implemented. Are you cross tracking? I'm using same browser, computer and fiber connection with no problems with loading speeds elsewhere.
No. We have Google Analytics and ReCaptcha. Nothing creepy besides the usual Google creepiness.
I look if I see strange behaviour.
I've noticed the last 2 days Slow Loading (up to 1 minute) of Racks in Command Center and Me section. Bouncing between my 6 racks, loading an alternate rack. Also jumping to a any of MODULARGrid's menu items. Browser just load 1/4 of the progress bar and stay at that quarter mark for 45 to 60 seconds then loads page. Also does the same thing when trying to logout. Have used MODULARGrid for more than a year and this is the first time I've in encountered this problem. Has their been any change on MODULARGrid's side? Have more tracking cookies been implemented. Are you cross tracking? I'm using same browser, computer and fiber connection with no problems with loading speeds elsewhere.
Skinny/minimalist case designs. The 4ms Pods just have a thin black line around them (except at the top, which you don't need here). Others are similar. Be nice to have a "non-case case" where the edges are just a black line border rather than an imitation of wood or other "real life" case.
Obviously "inspired by" the Moog Grandmother...although, this is more like your grandmother's creepy neighbor with the overgrown yard, who always smells like mothballs and Kools.
I bough him a M303 one month ago,
At the begining, everything was friendly, but since he got my money, he desappear.. Any news, no response anywhere, and of course, he doesn't send me anything..
Thanks again for helping me!
I now realise that ”generative music” is a much more complicated issue than I thought. So I will not use that term anymore when I discuss my racks.
By the way, your explanation of ”generative” is the best I have read and I now think I understand it a little bit better.
I also realise that a fully generative rack for the moment is a bit to expensive for me. So I start slowly and try to maybe achieve the first two orders of control.
Is there any racks at Modulagrid that is tailor made for generative experimentation?
The tuner is intended for tuning some vco:s to chords and I thougt it would be handy to have it in the rack. But I have a couple of chromatic guitar tuners I can use instead.
So admittedly, I've already built this and it's fairly solid for drones, i.e.; does what it says on the tin. When I feel like doing something more rythmic I have an MFB Urzwerg Pro, Electro-Harmonix 8 Step Program and a TT-303 hence the lack of any sequencers. For effects I already had a bunch of guitar pedals with plenty of pitch shifting options and rack mount FX so the ADDAC200PI though I realise the drawback of those is a lack of CV. The primary focus of the rack is indeed drone and dark ambient, but I'm also interested in industrial, IDM, acid house and breakcore.
Most of the modules I chose for this I did so because they could do things I couldn't find a cost-effective way to do outside of modular (hence the E350, Morpheus, Warps etc.). A few of the modules here do synergise well and I feel like I have most bases covered including even sampling in a limited sense, but there just seems to be a certain something missing and I don't know what it is; I've considered going for a third row but actually finding it harder to come to a decision on what is most needed.
Here are some modules I've considered:
Serge triple waveshaper
ADDAC 207 quad intuitive quantizer - seems like a logical option for times when I need drones to mesh with other stuff outside of the modular tuning-wise
Mutable Instruments Shelves - a friend of mine once blew my mind with a certain sound when he modulated the frequency of an EQ at a high rate, this would give me the ability to do that on two channels and I could just use it as a conventional EQ & filter alongside it. It'd also make the ALM EQ obsolete though, most likely.
Zvex Instant Lofi Junky - A chorus which you couldn't come across too easily outside of modular. Sure there's also a version of it in pedal format but that doesn't have the CV control!
Expert Sleepers FH-1/2 or Endorphin.es Shuttle Control - obviously for MIDI to CV/Gate control, I'm really on the fence about whether either of these would be useful for me. I have a MIDI I/O PCI card so it would mean I could control the modular with software, which is potentially a big deal?
Intellijel Shifty - looks like there are some useful utilities on offer here, I do sometimes find that I wish I had more than the one channel of S&H from the Pittsburgh Mod Tools.
Zlob modular VnIcursal - You know what they say about how you can never have enough VCAs, and I can't get enough of the idea of combined VCAs and mixers. This is like Intellijel quad VCA only even more space-efficient to me, and if I need the features of the quad VCA I'd be keeping that.
2hp LFO - between the Batumi, Kamieniec, Mod Tools etc. I have a few LFOs, but a couple more couldn't hurt and might come in handy when there's 3 rows to work with?
I was thinking in addition to this, maybe a compressor, since modulating the E350 tends to cause volume spikes in certain waveforms, but I'm not sure how effective that would be?
Something else that might be useful is a slewer? On the other hand, I can't say I've ever felt a real need for one.
Would like to know what your thoughts are on these ideas for a third row. Feel free to roast me over the decisions on the two rows I've already got!
Oh and just a patch I loved on the IDM/breakcore side of things that might be worth trying for any of you: I have the Warps on the obligatory Parasite firmware, patched a Korg ES-1 into the ADDAC200PI then through the Warps on Comparator, then back out. Results in extremely aggressive sounding drums!
Edit: And some more modules I have considered:
Befaco Rampage
NerdSeq - It would be nice to be able to play this portably if I don't use a FH-1/2 or Shuttle Control. my primary DAW software is a tracker so the interface is familiar to me and it has enough channels.
I'm open to ideas of different modules than the ones I've mentioned and prepared to accept I may have some ideas which don't make sense here. I haven't felt like there's a particular module I've got that was a mistake (though I don't find I use the Dreadbox WL Divider much) but if there's any I should really get rid of I could accept that too.
