How to improve my rack

I'm looking for feedback on my rack and advice as to how to position the modules for a better flow.

I've not really been hitting any pain points, but wondered if another pair of eyes could suggest some improvements.

I've steadily and a little organically built up the below system:

The top two rows are 6u 84hp doepfer case, which I am considering replacing with a 104hp case in the long term

The bottom two rows are a Pittsburgh modular move 104, this case has a few restrictions, each row has 18 floating nuts and the power from the case itself is limited to about 1.3A, so I'm using the endorphins shuttle to power the bottom row which is also limited to about 1A

I have an Elektron Octatrack providing clock/midi through the shuttle, and the audio goes back out via the Jumble Henge and then the Disting which I often use to record quickly if I hear something I like.

During lockdown I have been using music as a way to escape screens, so I really don't want any PC involved in the setup and only use it occasionally to update modules or reconfigure the shuttle/fx aid, or to play back recordings from the Distings

In the long run, I'm thinking of building towards this:

I'm not necessarily attached to the new modules in this, although I think I'd still like the crime expander for Miasma when it is released to avoid taking it out of the case to change its tone.

I'm also not entirely getting on with Marbles, Tides and Plaits, I don't dislike them I just find myself not using them very much... although I'm planning to spend some time focusing building patches around each of them to see if I can change that feeling before deciding if I want to remove them, Tides especially I feel could be great if I invest the time to properly learn it.

Any feedback or input would be very welcome

Plaits is probably my least favourite mutable module - although I do use it quite a bit - even if it is just for hats... I must spend some more time with it again...

Tides is fantastic though - I have both versions - I especially like the phased mode on the one you have - although both get used in nearly every patch I make - great for both audio and modulation

Marbles - I like it a lot - one thing that helped was increasing the length of the gates so that they were more useful for opening envelopes (as well as just triggering percussion)

When I look at your racks - both versions - I see a serious lack of basic utility modules - these massively help in terms of plumbing... sub-mixers, matrix mixer, mults, logic, rectification etc etc... when extending I'd be tempted to keep the doepfer case too - so you have room to add a lot more of these...

as for flow - I'm guessing you mean workflow here - ie patching things together - as I said above more utilities, which should be distributed throughout - but also I find something along the lines of the layout of the 2600 - from top, left - sound sources, modulation, effects (including filters) and controllers/sequencers and end of chain mixing at the bottom - but this assumes that you actually have the cases arranged as depicted, one on top of the other

Plaits is probably my least favourite mutable module - although I do use it quite a bit - even if it is just for hats... I must spend some more time with it again...

Yeah, I seem to do exactly the same with it most of the time, resetting the octave range definitely helped make it more playable but on the whole I tend to leave it set up for high hats

Tides is fantastic though - I have both versions - I especially like the phased mode on the one you have - although both get used in nearly every patch I make - great for both audio and modulation

I think this is a time thing, it is so deep it takes a bit more investment than I have put into any of the other modules, so I'll be putting a bit more focus on it. I especially like it as an oscillator but I bought it with the intent of interesting related modulation

Marbles - I like it a lot - one thing that helped was increasing the length of the gates so that they were more useful for opening envelopes (as well as just triggering percussion)

When I look at your racks - both versions - I see a serious lack of basic utility modules - these massively help in terms of plumbing... sub-mixers, matrix mixer, mults, logic, rectification etc etc... when extending I'd be tempted to keep the doepfer case too - so you have room to add a lot more of these...

Interesting, I use links, veils, MIA, Shades, Jumble Henge and sumdif for mixing of one kind or another alongside stackables, and cable splitters, but in this arena, I don't know what I don't know and I'd like to change that. Have you any suggestions as to what might help rebalance? The additional 40hp I get by replacing the doepfer doesnt have to be used on the lubadh / quad quantizer / quantas ampla, the latter was yet another attempt at adding some kind of utility (mixing, ducking/sidechaining)

as for flow - I'm guessing you mean workflow here - ie patching things together - as I said above more utilities, which should be distributed throughout - but also I find something along the lines of the layout of the 2600 - from top, left - sound sources, modulation, effects (including filters) and controllers/sequencers and end of chain mixing at the bottom - but this assumes that you actually have the cases arranged as depicted, one on top of the other

-- JimHowell1970

Yes, the Move case is on its back in front of the doepfer one, so effectively stacked as shown, the main issue is the power / screw constraint in the bottom case so some of the smaller or power hungry modules need to stay up top.

Plaits is one of the rare modules that I sold due to neglect but now wish I had. I have plenty of oscillators and drum modules, but none of them can cover the broad range of percussive sounds that Plaits can do easily. I was recently considering adding another drum machine like the Elektron Model:Cycles or Erica LXR02, but realized Plaits could cover all of that territory without the need to learn a new sequencer. I feel embarrassed that I didn’t recognize its potential earlier.

The octatrack pulls a lot of weight for me for drums, and to be fair, the pico drum with plaits does a decent job of replacing that when I dont want to play outside of the rack. Maybe it is more of a "this isnt quite what I expected" from plaits, rather than "I don't like it"

so which case are you looking at

I'd seriously consider keeping the doepfer, getting rid of the pitts and it replacing with a couple of mantises, it's what I would do if I were you knowing what I know - if I ever buy another case it will be another mantis - best combination of cost/hp/good power/reputable company/standard screws - so knurlies! or just going DIY - and building a 12u/104hp case - I use befaco excalibus power supplies for my DIY cases - which are not that p0werful, but are good power - you might need 3 for 12u/104hp depending on the power draw of your modules

re utilities: take a look at my signature - it's a philosophy/concept for getting the most versatility for the least amount of money... not that I necessarily strictly follow it - or expect anyone else to, for that matter - but I do try to and I do hope that people take notice - because it does work - want more complex modulation - get a matrix mixer and some mults, want more sounds - get a new filter or a waveshaper or delay and parallel process the sound sources you already have... etc etc

*good power for me is clean enough up to video rates - as I do a lot of video synthesis - and need ripple free up to MHz for that not just the 10's of KHz needed for audio

so which case are you looking at

I'd seriously consider keeping the doepfer, getting rid of the pitts and it replacing with a couple of mantises, it's what I would do if I were you knowing what I know - if I ever buy another case it will be another mantis - best combination of cost/hp/good power/reputable company/standard screws - so knurlies! or just going DIY - and building a 12u/104hp case - I use befaco excalibus power supplies for my DIY cases - which are not that p0werful, but are good power - you might need 3 for 12u/104hp depending on the power draw of your modules

Later this year I intend to replace both cases with a 12/14U 104hp case, I've been looking at the MDLR cases, but whichever route I go, I'd like to stay within roughly 416hp in total. so refinement would then involve selling modules I have to make space for others.

I'd like to reshuffle my case in the near future, but I keep going around in circles as to how I should move things around, I'm going to look at the ARP2600 later and see how feasible it is to align to that layout.

re utilities: take a look at my signature - it's a philosophy/concept for getting the most versatility for the least amount of money... not that I necessarily strictly follow it - or expect anyone else to, for that matter - but I do try to and I do hope that people take notice - because it does work - want more complex modulation - get a matrix mixer and some mults, want more sounds - get a new filter or a waveshaper or delay and parallel process the sound sources you already have... etc etc

-- JimHowell1970

Absolutely, I'm a fan of the suggested relationship between types, I'm more excited for utilities right now than I am for anything else, I've looked at your cases to try and find inspiration for what utilities I might be omitting - but I'm still not entirely clear what would add value, I feel like I might have a blind spot here?

Kinks offers rectification, but I've already got 3 S&H in the RND Step, and Plog can do some wave rectification, EAS looks great for more logic, but Plog is doing the basics for me and maybe I need to investigate that further as I'm still not getting a lot of use out of it right now.

Veils + Jumble Henge is doing most of my audio mixing, with some additional done in filters (Ripples, Morgasmatron) or 3xMIA. Shades, links, sumdif, 3xMIA and veils/2hp VCA are doing my modulation mixing.... but this is quite dispersed and I can see that a more focused mixing utility might be helpful.

a matrix mixer - really handy for: getting more complex modulation from what you alreaddy have (mult 4 modulation sources, get 4 more complex ones out), feedback patching (mix output of xyz module back into input), send/returns (send outputs of modules into inputs of effects and then mix outputs of effects back into original signal - useful for effects modules that don't have dry/wet controls)

joranalogue compare 2 - great logic module...

I know what you mean about modules that already have xyz in them - but usually it's part of something else - taking useful functions out so they can be used on their own is a good practice - so you always have that functionality available, even when using the module for something else - Maths is a great example of this - it's really powerful in itself and especially when patch=programmed to do something more interesting - much more so than using it as the individual functions it is made up of - which can be had individually for a relatively small amount of cash!

Disting and O&C are similar - you can only do 1 thing (or 2 with the ex/hemispheres) at a time...

a matrix mixer - really handy for: getting more complex modulation from what you alreaddy have (mult 4 modulation sources, get 4 more complex ones out), feedback patching (mix output of xyz module back into input), send/returns (send outputs of modules into inputs of effects and then mix outputs of effects back into original signal - useful for effects modules that don't have dry/wet controls)

Is there a good in rack option for this, or is it better to go to a standalone mixer?

joranalogue compare 2 - great logic module...

I'll check it out!

I know what you mean about modules that already have xyz in them - but usually it's part of something else - taking useful functions out so they can be used on their own is a good practice - so you always have that functionality available, even when using the module for something else - Maths is a great example of this - it's really powerful in itself and especially when patch=programmed to do something more interesting - much more so than using it as the individual functions it is made up of - which can be had individually for a relatively small amount of cash!

I think I'm agreeing with you but using different words, then wondering what is the most efficient and basic ways to add those capabilities without introducing too much redundancy, does adding an EAS or Joranalogue compare 2 give me the additional logic and rectification to remove the contention on my existing modules? (although I've not actually used plog for rectification yet, so that might be a technique I should explore soon!)

That is one of the reasons I don't have Maths, I'd rather use 20hp to have multiple components I can stitch together differently, and sometimes independently of each other.

Disting and O&C are similar - you can only do 1 thing (or 2 with the ex/hemispheres) at a time...
-- JimHowell1970

Absolutely, that is why I'm looking at the quad quantiser to unlock the other O&C functions.
Disting I use as a quick fix to fill any gaps, and when its not being used for anything else I use it as a sound recorder

a matrix mixer

Is there a good in rack option for this, or is it better to go to a standalone mixer?

there are plenty of in-rack ones - doepfer, AISynthesis etc etc - I think the smaller they are the less useful - I have 2 smaller ones (10hp) and find them a bit fiddly due to trimmers, urgh, and wish I had a doepfer one - which I will one day - I have space for it (currently about 300hp available in my racks - mostly due to DIY backlog and useful balnk panels)

joranalogue compare 2 - great logic module...

I'll check it out!

I know what you mean about modules that already have xyz in them

I think I'm agreeing with you but using different words, then wondering what is the most efficient and basic ways to add those capabilities without introducing too much redundancy, does adding an EAS or Joranalogue compare 2 give me the additional logic and rectification to remove the contention on my existing modules? (although I've not actually used plog for rectification yet, so that might be a technique I should explore soon!)

redundancy? don't understand the concept within modular - duplication of functionality is useful - multiple voices = sometimes the need for use of similar modules on each voice - especially when some of these functions are in multi-function modules...

whats EAS? - not familiar!

That is one of the reasons I don't have Maths, I'd rather use 20hp to have multiple components I can stitch together differently, and sometimes independently of each other.

No Maths is fantastic - get a maths - more than the sum of it's parts - see the 'maths illustrated supplement'!!! and all of the parts can be used independently!

Disting and O&C are similar - you can only do 1 thing (or 2 with the ex/hemispheres) at a time...
-- JimHowell1970

Absolutely, that is why I'm looking at the quad quantiser to unlock the other O&C functions.
Disting I use as a quick fix to fill any gaps, and when its not being used for anything else I use it as a sound recorder

I use my disting as a tape delay most of the time - even after buying a magneto to stop doing this!!! I'm a bit of a delay junky - lots of delay pedals too!

redundancy? don't understand the concept within modular - duplication of functionality is useful - multiple voices = sometimes the need for use of similar modules on each voice - especially when some of these functions are in multi-function modules...

Well, in this case I have more S&H available than I use, so buying Kinks doesnt feel efficient, I'd much rather but the Jornalogue compare 2 and feel like the space being occupied is more broadly useful to me.

whats EAS? - not familiar!

Instruo's cascading logic module: https://www.modulargrid.net/e/instruo-eas

That is one of the reasons I don't have Maths, I'd rather use 20hp to have multiple components I can stitch together differently, and sometimes independently of each other.

No Maths is fantastic - get a maths - more than the sum of it's parts - see the 'maths illustrated supplement'!!! and all of the parts can be used independently!

Yeah, it just hasn't grabbed me at all.

I use my disting as a tape delay most of the time - even after buying a magneto to stop doing this!!! I'm a bit of a delay junky - lots of delay pedals too!

yeah, I'd say most of the time its being used for the tape delay when it isn't sound recording, I've barely used any of its other functions! (then I got the fx aid and took some of the pressure off of it)

redundancy? don't understand the concept within modular - duplication of functionality is useful - multiple voices = sometimes the need for use of similar modules on each voice - especially when some of these functions are in multi-function modules...

Well, in this case I have more S&H available than I use, so buying Kinks doesnt feel efficient, I'd much rather but the Jornalogue compare 2 and feel like the space being occupied is more broadly useful to me.

use for modulation as well as pitch - they get used up pretty fast then - kinks is more than just s&h - but I understand

whats EAS? - not familiar!

Instruo's cascading logic module: https://www.modulargrid.net/e/instruo-eas

never had a desire to get any instruo - except maybe tan[h] - have (inexpensive) wavefolder habit due to video...

That is one of the reasons I don't have Maths, I'd rather use 20hp to have multiple components I can stitch together differently, and sometimes independently of each other.

No Maths is fantastic - get a maths - more than the sum of it's parts - see the 'maths illustrated supplement'!!! and all of the parts can be used independently!

Yeah, it just hasn't grabbed me at all.

patch programming!!!! it won't grab you until you try it...

I use my disting as a tape delay most of the time - even after buying a magneto to stop doing this!!! I'm a bit of a delay junky - lots of delay pedals too!

yeah, I'd say most of the time its being used for the tape delay when it isn't sound recording, I've barely used any of its other functions! (then I got the fx aid and took some of the pressure off of it)

I have an fx aid xl - if igorrr ever gets round to the proposed xxl version (with a screen) I might buy another - and upgrade the one I have - don't like the algo swapping - so it's constantly in lofi mode!

never had a desire to get any instruo - except maybe tan[h] - have (inexpensive) wavefolder habit due to video...

It's so good! I've been really pleased with all of my instruo modules, but the tan(h) especially so.

That is one of the reasons I don't have Maths, I'd rather use 20hp to have multiple components I can stitch together differently, and sometimes independently of each other.

No Maths is fantastic - get a maths - more than the sum of it's parts - see the 'maths illustrated supplement'!!! and all of the parts can be used independently!

Yeah, it just hasn't grabbed me at all.

patch programming!!!! it won't grab you until you try it...

Isn't that still achievable using multiple modules?

yeah, I'd say most of the time its being used for the tape delay when it isn't sound recording, I've barely used any of its other functions! (then I got the fx aid and took some of the pressure off of it)

I have an fx aid xl - if igorrr ever gets round to the proposed xxl version (with a screen) I might buy another - and upgrade the one I have - don't like the algo swapping - so it's constantly in lofi mode!

Ive only just moved off of the stock config, but again I need to spend more time exploring what I can do with it.

I'm not in a rush to buy anything new at the moment, I've lots to learn about what I have!

patch programming!!!! it won't grab you until you try it...

Isn't that still achievable using multiple modules?

kind of - but it's also intrinsic to the module itself - which is important - self-patch-programming

yeah, I'd say most of the time its being used for the tape delay when it isn't sound recording, I've barely used any of its other functions! (then I got the fx aid and took some of the pressure off of it)

I have an fx aid xl - if igorrr ever gets round to the proposed xxl version (with a screen) I might buy another - and upgrade the one I have - don't like the algo swapping - so it's constantly in lofi mode!

Ive only just moved off of the stock config, but again I need to spend more time exploring what I can do with it.

I'm not in a rush to buy anything new at the moment, I've lots to learn about what I have!

that's good - I'm trying to persuade myself not to buy a crucible - and just to buy the components I need for my DIY backlog - or at least some of it... and go back and debug a few that don't work too well... and update my fx aid - to add the drum algos - really want crash, ride (& rimshot, not covered by the crucible) - but 1 at a time recording - rather than building everything and multi-tracking at once is a pita...

I tried all of the drum algorithms, a few were very good but most I felt were better served by the Pico drum, or the octatrack. I never really intended to build a drum machine I always intended to layer the modular over the Octatrack drum samples... The Pico drum just lets me ignore the octatrack if I want to play around and do something basic .. and with the fractio solum it can do some very bizarre and fun things

cool - I'm not expecting anything that great - I just sometimes want to use a crash or ride or rimshot - everything else I have covered already - I can always do them in Logic anyway... but I'd like to be able to have them on tap...

@JimHowell1970 I put my modules into categories to match your formula to sense check what I have.

I know some modules will cross multiple categories but I've tried to align them to their main intended use:

Utility (16): (incl. 4 clock/trigger)
Pico Trigger, Plog, SumDif, Fractio Solum, SL3KT, 2hp VCA, Ears, 3x MIA, Links, DOT, Shades (2020), Veils (2020), Disting mk4, Ornament and Crime, RND STEP, Shuttle Control

Modulation (12): (incl. 4 pitch sequencing)
Contour, 2hp ADSR, Mimetic Digitalis, Marbles, Tides, 8S, Varigate 4+, Quadrax, Qx, Catalyst Expander, Catalyst, Muxlicer, TILT, ochd

Sound modification (10): (incl. 4 filters)
tanh[3], Miasma, Ripples (2020), Morgasmatron, Freez, Bifold, Beads, FX AID XL, Jumble Henge, Squawk Dirty To Me

Sound source (6):
Pico DRUMS, Twin waves, Plaits, Rings, arbhar, arbhar expander, Godspeed

I'm also considering dropping the lubadh from the target system and seeing what matrix mixer and additional logic might fit in the 22hp that gives back... I can always consider replacing something else with the lubadh later maybe..