Advices for finish my first rack

Hi everyone !

I need your help, ideas, advices for finish my first eurorack. I want to make mainly techno/Industrial/AcidTechno. I already own the Erica Techno System and all the modules in the 6U rack (except XAOC Zadar, Buff mult and Quad VCA)

I would like to hear your advice for finish this 6U rack. I know i need Mult, Enveloppe and VCA. Think about XAOC Zadar, Intellijel Buff mult and Intellijel Quad VCA. Do you have other ideas, modules who will pair well with what i have already ? I have 18HP free to complete my rack if i take Zadar, Buff mult and Quad VCA or 42HP if you have other suggestions :)

Thank you for your help,

Kevin

EDITED Nov 9th 2021, 12:44

Hi! Oh cool, Techno System. I play mine both on its own and as part of larger systems. When I click on your image I'm going to a more complete system but I'm wondering if you could use more mixing and/or output. There are a lot of mixing channels in the techno system but from my experience that section does tend to fill up. The oscillators and effects need to go somewhere, Optomix is good but do you need more submixing for those prior to output? On the other hand, there is technically room for all the voices in the three techno system mixers, and it might be all you need. I'm curious as to where the Erica Link module went, that would actually be a terrific output for this system. Perhaps you've got this solved with other modules. It's a little big, but a Roland 531 would give you more mixing room and a lot of performance control. A DivKid OCHD would be something to consider as well, it would put a lot of movement into the system. I've gotten great results plugging OCHD into the TS, Drum Sequencer loves it. Good luck!

Why not just buy an Erica Synths Techno System and save money and time? I mean you practically have one and your system would cost a lot more.

Hi! Oh cool, Techno System. I play mine both on its own and as part of larger systems. When I click on your image I'm going to a more complete system but I'm wondering if you could use more mixing and/or output. There are a lot of mixing channels in the techno system but from my experience that section does tend to fill up. The oscillators and effects need to go somewhere, Optomix is good but do you need more submixing for those prior to output? On the other hand, there is technically room for all the voices in the three techno system mixers, and it might be all you need. I'm curious as to where the Erica Link module went, that would actually be a terrific output for this system. Perhaps you've got this solved with other modules. It's a little big, but a Roland 531 would give you more mixing room and a lot of performance control. A DivKid OCHD would be something to consider as well, it would put a lot of movement into the system. I've gotten great results plugging OCHD into the TS, Drum Sequencer loves it. Good luck!
-- ThePlate

Thank you for your response !

Nice you have Techno System too ! Love it !
Sorry i had made some modification after my post in the forum… thats why it look complete when you click in my image.
Now you can see how it is now :)
Do you think Intellijel UVCA is enough for the moment or i need Intellijel Quad VCA ? Do i really need Sample and Hold ? Ring Modulation ? I dont understand how to use it and if i really need it… i am totally new to modular… OCHD look very nice for LFO, will ass it or Batumi ;) Thank you !

Do you think i can use my modular like this and see after what i really need ?
For mixing and outputs i will buy another rack with WMD performance mixer and two others Vermona Twinout..

Thank you again, Kevin

Why not just buy an Erica Synths Techno System and save money and time? I mean you practically have one and your system would cost a lot more.
-- sacguy71

I already own the Techno System and all the module you can see in the rack above except Zadar, Buff mult and Intellijel UVCA !
Just want to know how to complete it, what is necessary (other enveloppe, Ring modulation, Sample and Hold, other utilities…) I am totally new to modular.. would like to know if my modular will be usuable like this or if I miss something important.. and if it’s usuable like this, what you will add for finish the 24HP free for the moment..

Thank you, Kevin

Ah gotcha sorry for that! Anyways sounds like a fun plan.

Given you have a nerdseq I would get the more cv expander, while the envelopes are not as crazy as a zadar, you get lots of modulation capabilities integrated with the nerdseq ( love this sequencer), and a quad vca is a great choice veils is preferred by many but very hard to source. I would give this a go then see what you feel you are still lacking. I have heard mixed opinions on zadar. You really only need a buffered mult if you are looking for multing pitch cv but it doesn’t look like this is a focus or need in this case, you could use some attenuverters like a 3xmia, and I don’t see any random modulation source, marbles, wogglebug, divkid random step. The tough thing is you have a lot of big showcase modules and not a lot of room for modulation, that’s why I think the nerdseq expander would be a great choice over an ochd as you get 16 more slots for lfos and envelopes.

EDITED Nov 9th 2021, 19:09

I'm not going to give specific advice, but advice if I suddenly acquired your system and the things I would check.

My first consideration would be able to stop, start, and reset both the Nerdseq and the Erica Drum sequencer together. If I start playing one sequencer from the beginning, I should be able to slave the other. This might be done through MIDI or CV through clock and reset. I would look through both for Clock-In, Clock-Out, Reset-In, Reset-Out features.

My second consideration would be a mixing. I'd just go Full-Monty and get the beast that Befaco makes. The Techno-System comes with a lot of sub-mixers. But I'd like to be able to take everything to one main performance mixer. Depending on what modules you get for the Befaco mixing system, you might not need the Intellijel VCA.

Third, utilities. How are you doing on sample&hold, logic modules, slew limiters, etc.

Finally, modules like Plaits would be a great addition as they don't need a lot of support... just a gate and pitch CV. I'm assuming that the main focus is the Techno System and your other modules will support it. Add in a nice reverb and I think you're near golden.

Nice you have Techno System too ! Love it !
Sorry i had made some modification after my post in the forum… thats why it look complete when you click in my image.
Now you can see how it is now :)
Do you think Intellijel UVCA is enough for the moment or i need Intellijel Quad VCA ? Do i really need Sample and Hold ? Ring Modulation ? I dont understand how to use it and if i really need it… i am totally new to modular… OCHD look very nice for LFO, will ass it or Batumi ;) Thank you !

Do you think i can use my modular like this and see after what i really need ?
For mixing and outputs i will buy another rack with WMD performance mixer and two others Vermona Twinout..

Hmm, do you need ring mod and sample & hold. I think others would agree it really depends on what you're going for. Drones? Melodies? A bit of both? It think you definitely would use a quad VCA if you had it, because putting movement into a drone or a melody is key to bringing life to your patches. Ring modulation is an effect. In this system, I would look at another multi-effect (you already have a good one with Erica's Dual FX, but that will get used quickly even if sent to a mixer. If you're going to go big and get the performance mixer (VERY good choice), a couple multi-effects would be perfect to start. FXAid is of course great. So is the Erica Black Hole DSP, so is Milky Way. All of those are very much preset friendly and good for beginners.

Sample & Hold can be extremely useful for a broad range of audio and CV uses. Random melodies, random beats, random control of VCA's to randomize random movements in the spectrum! You don't need it, but investigate how it is used on YouTube and see what you like.

Consider a quad VCA, at least one multi-effect, an LFO generator and some kind of attenuator to really master control over as many parameters as you can.

All the other suggestions you're getting are terrific too. As always, endless possibilities and angles.

BTW, I think you can slave Drum Sequencer to the NerdSeq with very little effort. DrumSeq is really one of the greatest things I've encountered in Eurorack. So much fun to use and play. Hope this is all helpful!

I'm not going to give specific advice, but advice if I suddenly acquired your system and the things I would check.

My first consideration would be able to stop, start, and reset both the Nerdseq and the Erica Drum sequencer together. If I start playing one sequencer from the beginning, I should be able to slave the other. This might be done through MIDI or CV through clock and reset. I would look through both for Clock-In, Clock-Out, Reset-In, Reset-Out features.

Yes i asked to Erica Synths team and I can slave the Erica Drum Sequencer to Nerdseq easily or also use Drum Sequencer as master clock.

My second consideration would be a mixing. I'd just go Full-Monty and get the beast that Befaco makes. The Techno-System comes with a lot of sub-mixers. But I'd like to be able to take everything to one main performance mixer. Depending on what modules you get for the Befaco mixing system, you might not need the Intellijel VCA.

I was thinking to buy another 6U rack and take the WMD Performance mixer, another Vermona Twin out and the Vermona TAI-4.
Do you think Befaco Hexmix and expander is better ? I know there is EQ on the Befaco but I have a preference for WMD Performance mixer for the moment..

Third, utilities. How are you doing on sample&hold, logic modules, slew limiters, etc.
Will learn more things about those things. For the moment I will begin without those utilities in this first rack..

Finally, modules like Plaits would be a great addition as they don't need a lot of support... just a gate and pitch CV. I'm assuming that the main focus is the Techno System and your other modules will support it. Add in a nice reverb and I think you're near golden.

For reverb I was thinking about Noise engineering Desmodus Versio, good choice ?

-- Ronin1973

Thank you !

Nice you have Techno System too ! Love it !
Sorry i had made some modification after my post in the forum… thats why it look complete when you click in my image.
Now you can see how it is now :)
Do you think Intellijel UVCA is enough for the moment or i need Intellijel Quad VCA ? Do i really need Sample and Hold ? Ring Modulation ? I dont understand how to use it and if i really need it… i am totally new to modular… OCHD look very nice for LFO, will ass it or Batumi ;) Thank you !

Do you think i can use my modular like this and see after what i really need ?
For mixing and outputs i will buy another rack with WMD performance mixer and two others Vermona Twinout..

Hmm, do you need ring mod and sample & hold. I think others would agree it really depends on what you're going for. Drones? Melodies? A bit of both? It think you definitely would use a quad VCA if you had it, because putting movement into a drone or a melody is key to bringing life to your patches. Ring modulation is an effect. In this system, I would look at another multi-effect (you already have a good one with Erica's Dual FX, but that will get used quickly even if sent to a mixer. If you're going to go big and get the performance mixer (VERY good choice), a couple multi-effects would be perfect to start. FXAid is of course great. So is the Erica Black Hole DSP, so is Milky Way. All of those are very much preset friendly and good for beginners.

Sample & Hold can be extremely useful for a broad range of audio and CV uses. Random melodies, random beats, random control of VCA's to randomize random movements in the spectrum! You don't need it, but investigate how it is used on YouTube and see what you like.

Consider a quad VCA, at least one multi-effect, an LFO generator and some kind of attenuator to really master control over as many parameters as you can.

All the other suggestions you're getting are terrific too. As always, endless possibilities and angles.

BTW, I think you can slave Drum Sequencer to the NerdSeq with very little effort. DrumSeq is really one of the greatest things I've encountered in Eurorack. So much fun to use and play. Hope this is all helpful!
-- ThePlate

This is very helpful ! Thank you so much !

So I tried to listen all your advices, and think I’m done for this rack ! I think I will choose Pamela new workout for random and some lfo, Intellijel quad VCA, and for Attenuator/ CV/level control will take the Vermona Amplinuator 3.
In my next rack I will put WMD Performance mixer, A multi effect (surely Erica Synths Black hole DSP 2) other modulations sources (Quadrax, Bastl Trinity, Kermit..), utilities (S&H and ring modulation, will learn more about these and check videos..) and other Vermona outputs (TAI-4, Twin outs)

So I think for my first rack, it will be finish like this :

Can you confirm it will be fully usuable like this to begin ? Can’t afford the next rack this year…

Thank you very much, Kevin

Thank you everyone ! You take the time to help me, and I learn a lot of things with you all ! I think my first rack will finish like this :

You think it can be usuable like this and I can enjoy for a moment like this ? Can’t afford the next rack with WMD mixers, effects and more modulation ms and utilities for the moment..

Thank you again, I appreciate a lot,

Kevin

Tried to work on this, but much of the on-hand modules are simply too big to be practical. Plus, I'm definitely NOT an advocate of building drum machines in Eurorack...and here's why:

An Erica Techno System = $4829
Actual used Roland TR-909 = $7000-ish.

Now, the problem here is that, for one thing, actual TR-909 prices should not be that close to a modular system. Worse still:

An Erica Techno System = $4829
Behringer 909 clone (RD-9) = $349

Now, that's the current clone of the TR-909. $4480 cheaper. With that, you could buy four WMD Performance Mixers...or 12.836 RD-9s. Behringer notwithstanding, that's a massive drop in cost.

Yes, I get it...modular presumably gives you more flexibility in sound design. But so will a drum machine with independent outputs per drum and a small rack of outboard processors...and you'd STILL come out ahead.

My suggestion is this: stop. Take a close look at the Erica rig, and start figuring out if you really DO need all of that, especially if it takes up so much room in the cab that everything else has to be a compromise of some sort or another. If so, leave it in its own case, then build up a second and smaller cab for a complimentary system that contains both synth voices AND processing for the Erica rack.

And think SMALLER. Huge modules are nice in a huge system...but in something like a Mantis, they SUUUUUUUUUUCK. This is a compromise you should get used to. If you want the big module functions, keep the following in mind:

1) It's going to kill space in the cab for a lot of things, potentially including the utility modules these big ones need.
2) There ARE smaller modules that do the same (or sometimes more) as the huge things. For example, that HUGE Vermona meloDicer...there's a few other modules that do the same thing (Stochastic Instruments' Stochastic Inspiration Generator, Catalyst's Time's Arrow, etc) but which AREN'T 34 hp. Nor are they $480.

There's definitely ways to make something like this work, both financially AND practically. But right now...hmm, not so much. Consider a separate system instead. Otherwise, this will just turn into a frustrating exercise in trying to fit modules into a rapidly-diminishing space for a pile of money.

Tried to work on this, but much of the on-hand modules are simply too big to be practical. Plus, I'm definitely NOT an advocate of building drum machines in Eurorack...and here's why:

An Erica Techno System = $4829
Actual used Roland TR-909 = $7000-ish.

Now, the problem here is that, for one thing, actual TR-909 prices should not be that close to a modular system. Worse still:

An Erica Techno System = $4829
Behringer 909 clone (RD-9) = $349

Now, that's the current clone of the TR-909. $4480 cheaper. With that, you could buy four WMD Performance Mixers...or 12.836 RD-9s. Behringer notwithstanding, that's a massive drop in cost.

Hi Lugia,

Yes i understand your point of view, but I want to go full modular and I already own the Erica Synths Techno system which is a beast. The Drum Sequencer is incredible and all the drums are very good. I don’t want to compare with Berhinger who is (for me) a shitty brand and sounds (for me) like shit..
i am very happy with my Techno System and this will stay my only drum machine. Just add Jomox Modbase 09 MkII for more kick diversity, my music is hard/Industrial techno and I don’t need a lot of things for that, a distorted kick, some hats, and some harsh synths voices with a touch of acid, I think I’m pretty ok with just the Techno System and some proccessing modules.

Yes, I get it...modular presumably gives you more flexibility in sound design. But so will a drum machine with independent outputs per drum and a small rack of outboard processors...and you'd STILL come out ahead.

My suggestion is this: stop. Take a close look at the Erica rig, and start figuring out if you really DO need all of that, especially if it takes up so much room in the cab that everything else has to be a compromise of some sort or another. If so, leave it in its own case, then build up a second and smaller cab for a complimentary system that contains both synth voices AND processing for the Erica rack.

That’s what I want to do with my case, so I choose 2 synth voices (Piston Honda and Manis Iteritas) and modules for processing my Erica rack. The British Noise Electronics Gain Stage Amplifier which is the distortion I choose for my kick drums. The Lyra 8 FX for destroy my snare and clap. The British Noise Electronic Grit filter for my Erica Synth Bassline.

And think SMALLER. Huge modules are nice in a huge system...but in something like a Mantis, they SUUUUUUUUUUCK. This is a compromise you should get used to. If you want the big module functions, keep the following in mind:

1) It's going to kill space in the cab for a lot of things, potentially including the utility modules these big ones need.
2) There ARE smaller modules that do the same (or sometimes more) as the huge things. For example, that HUGE Vermona meloDicer...there's a few other modules that do the same thing (Stochastic Instruments' Stochastic Inspiration Generator, Catalyst's Time's Arrow, etc) but which AREN'T 34 hp. Nor are they $480.

Yes you’re right but I’m in love with this Vermona module from the first time I discover it.. I already own it and will be very useful for me because I Suuuuck ;) at programming (musical) melodies, I don’t have a musician background.. and this module is very nice for live performance. Can save 16 patterns and make them evolve in live… yes it’s big and expensive but will keep it for sure…

There's definitely ways to make something like this work, both financially AND practically. But right now...hmm, not so much. Consider a separate system instead. Otherwise, this will just turn into a frustrating exercise in trying to fit modules into a rapidly-diminishing space for a pile of money.

I think my rack can work like this for the moment and for the music I make… If I miss something necessary please let me know.. Later in 2022 I will buy another 6U rack for install the WMD performance mixer and will have the place for all the utilities.. this term is abstract for me.. if you can tell which utilities I need for sure, why ? And how I will patch for example the Piston honda with those utilities ?

Thank you very much,

Kevin

-- Lugia

@Tchnondz,

I have Erica Techno & Jomox Modbase MkII (and some other perc stuff and lots of other modular stuff). The Jomox is SICK. Since you are liking the Techno, I think you'll love the add of the Jomox.

The rest of your rack doesn't make a ton of sense to me. A few comments:
-- if Piston Honda and Manis Iteritas are the synth voices that are inspiring to you, sure, go for it
-- Zadar and QuadVCA will be useful in almost any scenario, so those also I see as "no regrets" choices here
-- PNW is superb, but I'm not immediately seeing a need for it since you also have Erica Drum Seq and Nerdseq in the rack above
-- your question "what utilities" ... the answer there is "it depends." Really depends on how many voices you are running, how you will typically patch those, etc.

SO my suggestion for you is i) you already have Techno and a few other modules--cool ii) identify your next "no regrets" modules, get those, and spend some time with them--that will tell you what utilities etc. you need to make those work as you are hoping.

Last, since your focus is Techno / Acid, I should point out (if you don't already know)
-- https://wmdevices.com/products/time-warp Time Warp will let you add slew/glide to anything on demand. The glide sound is a big part of the acid sound. Its very worth considering if you don't already have a satisfactory slew/glide function in your setup
-- I notice a lot in your setup looks like it is to "dirty up" various sounds. If that's your aim, I can recommend SSF Triptych and/or Instruo tahn[3] which can help you get some added brutality on your sounds.

Cheers,

Nicholas

One other great source for audio manglers is Schlappi Engineering. These don't just "dirty up" things...they're more akin to aural homicide!

@Tchnondz,

I have Erica Techno & Jomox Modbase MkII (and some other perc stuff and lots of other modular stuff). The Jomox is SICK. Since you are liking the Techno, I think you'll love the add of the Jomox.

The rest of your rack doesn't make a ton of sense to me. A few comments:
-- if Piston Honda and Manis Iteritas are the synth voices that are inspiring to you, sure, go for it
-- Zadar and QuadVCA will be useful in almost any scenario, so those also I see as "no regrets" choices here
-- PNW is superb, but I'm not immediately seeing a need for it since you also have Erica Drum Seq and Nerdseq in the rack above
-- your question "what utilities" ... the answer there is "it depends." Really depends on how many voices you are running, how you will typically patch those, etc.

SO my suggestion for you is i) you already have Techno and a few other modules--cool ii) identify your next "no regrets" modules, get those, and spend some time with them--that will tell you what utilities etc. you need to make those work as you are hoping.

Last, since your focus is Techno / Acid, I should point out (if you don't already know)
-- https://wmdevices.com/products/time-warp Time Warp will let you add slew/glide to anything on demand. The glide sound is a big part of the acid sound. Its very worth considering if you don't already have a satisfactory slew/glide function in your setup
-- I notice a lot in your setup looks like it is to "dirty up" various sounds. If that's your aim, I can recommend SSF Triptych and/or Instruo tahn[3] which can help you get some added brutality on your sounds.

Cheers,

Nicholas

-- nickgreenberg

Hi Nickgreenberg,

Thank you for your reply,

Yes can’t wait to try the Jomox Modbase 09MKII ! Love the Jomox sound (already owned the Modbase11 and the Jomox Alphabase)
Ok so for you i made good choice with Piston Honda, Manis, Zadar and Intellijel Quad VCA. So you said the rest of my rack doesnt make a ton of sense, so i think, like Lugia said me already, you hadn’t choose Vermona Melodicer (too big for my small rack) and Zularic Repetitor.. So I will try those modules and maybe put them out of the rack later for make place for utilities…
Can you confirm or infirm I necessary need an attenuated, something like Vermona Amplinuator, for attenuate signal maybe of Piston Honda and Jomox who are really hot ?
I love WMD, will buy their Performance mixer for sure ! I checked the Timewarp, look very nice, keep it in mind :) Thank you

Like you say, I will try the modules I already own and see little by little what utilities I need..
My fear is if I need something necessary (and what I miss) for make my System work and make a little bit of music.. but I think it will work like this and I can have a little bit of fun.. even if I miss some utilities…

Thank you again,

Kevin

One other great source for audio manglers is Schlappi Engineering. These don't just "dirty up" things...they're more akin to aural homicide!
-- Lugia

Thank you again Lugia,
Yes i know about Schlappi Engineering and I’m very interested by their modules ! Angle grinder look very interesting.. pfff need more racks ahhaha

Oh yeah the Jomox is the king of kick drums! I love mine and feed it to Hexinveter Hot Glue mixer with compression and distortion sooo good! Now for the Schlappi 100 Grit that is a beast as well and the touch balls are fun. I find that drums benefit from distortion and compression. It brings them to life.

Kevin, for your rack IMO Intellijel Triplatt (or MI Shades) would be a better choice vs. Vermona Amplinuator. Triplatt will be more versatile and also less HP. Having something like Triplatt or Shades in your rack is IMO another "no regrets" type of choice, it will be useful on many many patches. I would have one of those in basically ANY rack setup. Furthermore, if you get to using more complex CV modulation, something like 4MS SISM or Tiptop MISO is super handy; those are basically suped-up Triplatt. But Triplatt is super useful and small.

You already have Erica Techno, so that already gives you Mixer Lite, Mixer and Stereo Mixer. That will give you a good number of basic mix channels and should handle your immediate needs IMO. Why bother with WMD Performance Mixer when you already have those Erica mixer units? Yes WMD PM is very good, but it is big and expensive, and I don't see a need for those in ADDITION to the Erica mix modules you already have.

I've read more closely the posts above, now thinking PNW may or may not be a good fit. It's a great module, but I don't know that it makes sense given what else you have. BTW if you need to coordinate a lot of different sequencers the PNW with its 24ppwn expansion plus a mult would be a good way to sync everything; that's what I have to sync my many sequencers. SO my suggestion is PNW goes into your "maybe later" modules.

Hope this helps. Good luck!